Am I obliged to allow Octopus to fit a smart meter?

[.:ian:.]

RichFN2 said:

EON constantly hound me to one fitted (emails, texts and phone calls) but I'm in a new build flat and live alone. What I need to use I use and just aren't that fussed about saving a few minutes a month to read a meter.

From what I understand energy firms are paid by the government for every smart meter they install, this is often passed on as commission to someone hence the desperation some people will experience.

Could be worth checking how old your meter is though as it might genuinely need replacing, and smart meters can be handy for a family with large energy bills.

I would suggest large families are the least likely to benefit as they will be using peak electricity at peak times.

I'm sorry children you cannot eat until 21:00 as that's when the cheap tariffs begin.

[Louis Balfour]

Macneil said:

I rent my house and would expect the landlord to ensure the meters are safe and compliant. This email stinks to me.

I rent my house and there was rain in the garden yesterday. I would expect the landlord to ensure a suitable level of sunshine.

A dog defecated within 100m of the property I rent from him, surely it should be a legal requirement for landlords to fit nappies to all dogs that live near me?

I rent my house and the Renter's Reform Bill should ensure that I am allowed to have the moon on a stick. Oh, and a button to turn it on and off. PAT tested every ten days at the landlord's expense.

Wah, wah wah, landlords.

[Arrivalist]

SpidersWeb said:

When? It has already happened.

Those with dumb meters are paying double or triple the prices that those on smart meters can pay because the claim that power generation is marginal because of renewables is nonsense and a surplus of renewable power is driving the price down - but only for those who have smart meters.

I assume you’re talking about off peak charging? Or am I missing something?

[Rough101]

Arrivalist said:

I assume you’re talking about off peak charging? Or am I missing something?

I regularly get updates where there are windows available for cheap energy, if I reduce my consumption in other periods, e.g. put the tumble drier on at 8pm not 6pm and get a credit etc., this will become more commonplace, the off peak EV charging is already here and of course anyone using the old economy seven and relying on the radio teleswitch service will need a smart meter as the BBC are switching off its transmitter.

Old meters aren’t far away from being an expensive flat rate, the energy companies don’t buy at a flat rate, so anyone on a flat will pay for the privelege.

Of course all smart meters have a sharp edge covered in Bill Gates mind virus that will get you eventually.

[Cupid-stunt]

RichFN2 said:

From what I understand energy firms are paid by the government for every smart meter they install, this is often passed on as commission to someone hence the desperation some people will experience.

Or more accurately, if the firm does not meet a certain criteria of smart meters fitted, they face a fine.
In order to reduce the fine, they offer a sum less than that as payment to people to get smart meters installed.

Semantics ... but the message reads differently

[Arrivalist]

Rough101 said:

Arrivalist said:

I assume you’re talking about off peak charging? Or am I missing something?

I regularly get updates where there are windows available for cheap energy, if I reduce my consumption in other periods, e.g. put the tumble drier on at 8pm not 6pm and get a credit etc., this will become more commonplace, the off peak EV charging is already here and of course anyone using the old economy seven and relying on the radio teleswitch service will need a smart meter as the BBC are switching off its transmitter.

Old meters aren’t far away from being an expensive flat rate, the energy companies don’t buy at a flat rate, so anyone on a flat will pay for the privelege.

Of course all smart meters have a sharp edge covered in Bill Gates mind virus that will get you eventually.

Cheers, I was unaware of the ‘window’ updates you mention. (Not the Microsoft ones!)

[was8v]

My electricity bill has dropped by 1/3 since I moved to an octopus smart tariff from a flat rate.

Why would you not want that?

Smart metering allows the grid and your energy company high resolution (half hourly Vs annual) understanding of energy consumption. Allowing them the invest in better grid services.

For example through better understanding of peaks they will be able to bring peak cost down by investing in battery storage offpeak and discharge peak. Octopus through Krakenflex control many GW of batteries for this purpose- since they only buy renewable electricity they need this to be viable.

FYI You don't own the meter, and neither does your energy company. It's owned by a monopoly company that owns every meter, your energy company just rents it from them and arranges service.

Edited by was8v on Friday 10th May 08:28

[AdeTuono]

Louis Balfour said:

I rent my house and there was rain in the garden yesterday. I would expect the landlord to ensure a suitable level of sunshine.

A dog defecated within 100m of the property I rent from him, surely it should be a legal requirement for landlords to fit nappies to all dogs that live near me?

I rent my house and the Renter's Reform Bill should ensure that I am allowed to have the moon on a stick. Oh, and a button to turn it on and off. PAT tested every ten days at the landlord's expense.

Wah, wah wah, landlords.

You missed 'Evil' from your last sentence.

[craig1912]

was8v said:

My electricity bill has dropped by 1/3 since I moved to an octopus smart tariff from a flat rate.

Why would you not want that?

Smart metering allows the grid and your energy company high resolution (half hourly Vs annual) understanding of energy consumption. Allowing them the invest in better grid services.

For example through better understanding of peaks they will be able to bring peak cost down by investing in battery storage offpeak and discharge peak. Octopus through Krakenflex control many GW of batteries for this purpose- since they only buy renewable electricity they need this to be viable.

FYI You don't own the meter, and neither does your energy company. It's owned by a monopoly company that owns every meter, your energy company just rents it from them and arranges service.

Edited by was8v on Friday 10th May 08:28

How did you know it would drop? I’m with Octopus on standard tariff but yet to be convinced I “need” a smart meter. If it was to drop by a third, I agree it’s a no brainer.

[megaphone]

I'm now with Octopus after being moved from Shell. I've had similar messages and emails, was also getting them from Shell. The tariff I'm paying is marginally more than their 'smart' tariff, don't have an EV (yet), don't use much power anyway. I'm sticking with my old meter for now, solar panels help with my bills.

[No ideas for a name]

craig1912 said:

How did you know it would drop? I’m with Octopus on standard tariff but yet to be convinced I “need” a smart meter. If it was to drop by a third, I agree it’s a no brainer.

My smart meter lets me get comedy electricity bills from time to time.



A more 'normal' average would be about 15p/kWh

[Spitfire2]

Response from Octopus.

"Thank you for your email. I understand that you don't believe it is necessary to change your meters, but we have a duty to inform you when your meter reaches the end of its certification period. However, you have the choice to ignore this suggestion for now if you prefer."

Essentially confirms the wording in their "we need to change it" email is misleading and inaccurate.

They can be ignored until you decide you want a smart meter.

[was8v]

craig1912 said:

How did you know it would drop? I’m with Octopus on standard tariff but yet to be convinced I “need” a smart meter. If it was to drop by a third, I agree it’s a no brainer.

Because I have a had a smart meter on a fixed tariff for 5 years before (new build), simply comparing my consumption (4 bed 2 kids) against octopus agile was all I needed to do. (Octopus compare app on play store).

Doing a quarterly meter reading tells you nothing.

My only change in lifestyle has been never run the washing machine or dryer between 4-7pm. Set the dishwasher off on a 3 hour delay (mine has a button) when I go to bed.

We still cook (electric oven and induction hob) at 6pm every day.

I don't have an an EV

[NDA]

Macneil said:

I rent my house and would expect the landlord to ensure the meters are safe and compliant. This email stinks to me.

I am getting the same from OVO - they started with extolling the virtues 'you don't need to submit a reading' and, er, that was it. And I am now receiving the same sort of emails saying my meter is too old and I must have a 'smart' meter.

From their perspective of course, it's a prelude to surge pricing or 'time of use tariffs' as they're called. They can also remotely switch consumers to a pre-payment plan (which they are doing) and remotely disconnect supply if consumers don't keep the account topped up.

I always pay quarterly and have no problem submitting a meter reading.... a 'smart' meter (which is only smart for the utility company) is not needed.

Interestingly, the OVO app, which used to give a breakdown of usage (monthly, annual costs etc) now doesn't do that - it says I have to have a 'smart' meter to access this information. It worked perfectly previously.

[InitialDave]

Simpo Two said:

Alickadoo said:

And if they DO get you on to a smart meter, what disaster awaits you?

Only unannounced price changes, power restrictions, power cuts... basically they have control of your power. Power generation is already marginal and will only get worse in the insane rush to 'net zero' as traditional power station are closed and we gamble on it being sunny and windy and everyone buys EVs to save the planet.

There's really only two options with regard to this.

- you're wrong/paranoid. None of this will happen.
- you're completely correct, this will happen... in which case there's absolutely zero you can do to prevent or avoid it irrespective of your meter type.

Smart meters are quite handy, but I'm largely ambivalent on them. I have one, it's fine, but I'd not be bothered if I didn't.

[Alickadoo]

InitialDave said:

Smart meters are quite handy, but I'm largely ambivalent on them. I have one, it's fine, but I'd not be bothered if I didn't.

Cut it out.

We don't want people posting on PH with rational, balanced views.

There's no time for it.

[OutInTheShed]

I'd quite like a smart meter, but in view of where I live and where the meters are located, the chances of getting a signal seem slight to non-existant.

There are a very large number of people getting a lot of hassle from non-working smart meters in the UK, I can't be arsed to google the current figure.
Chasing a few quid in savings to join that pool of victims is not an attractive idea.

IF you live some where with strong phone signals next to your meter you will probably be fine.

If our meters are beyond their calibration date, and we decline to have them changed, are we putting ourselves in a poor position if the meter starts over-reading?

[otolith]

Wacky Racer said:

otolith said:

I’ve had an Octopus email saying they want to upgrade my smart meter. I’ve no problem with that, except that the new ones use a different data network and when they tried to do my neighbour’s - according to my neighbour, who is a bit of an old battleaxe - it couldn’t get a signal.

Bulb. (Now Octopus) fitted two new meters to our house two years ago.

Still can't get a signal, so I still have to read them every month.

(Not that bothered to be honest)

I would be bothered, because the existing gen 1 smart meter works fine!

[otolith]

OutInTheShed said:

IF you live some where with strong phone signals next to your meter you will probably be fine.

As I understand it, my current SMETS1 meter uses the mobile phone network, the new SMETS2 meter they want to install uses a dedicated radio network. Supposedly with 99.5% coverage, but my neighbour says that hers didn't work.

[kambites]

I'm pretty sure you are obliged to allow the electricity supplier to change your meter if (and only if) it has reached the end of its certified lifespan or they have identified a safety issue. You could request a new dumb meter, but as far as I know they are under no obligation to provide you with one.

I guess there's nothing to stop you installing a tin-foil hat on the new meter if you want to though.