Rishi Sunak - Prime Minister
Discussion
President Merkin said:
Mostly because there's always a small army of mouth breathers only too ready to be semi profesional empty vessels.
But it's always other people who are "offended", not them. carlo996 said:
Start with the vapes, and tattoos…..cost money. Think of the children.
You must be exhausted being outraged about literally everything?
You must be exhausted being outraged about literally everything?
W124 said:
I was talking to my errant father about this last night. Over a nice pint of Cotswold Pale. He is a self described ‘natural conservative’.
He said something like ‘the Conservative Party has always relied on people voting in narrow self-interest but, now, nobody voting even in their own narrow self interest is going to vote for them.’
He tells me he’s going to vote for Starmer. Quite something. This is the Tories absolute core. A dyed-in-the-wool, allotment dwelling resident of Henley-on-Thames.
If they really have lost people like him, then they really are in serious s
t. He’s voted Conservative since the 1960’s.
At least he is sensible enough not to vote Reform. He said something like ‘the Conservative Party has always relied on people voting in narrow self-interest but, now, nobody voting even in their own narrow self interest is going to vote for them.’
He tells me he’s going to vote for Starmer. Quite something. This is the Tories absolute core. A dyed-in-the-wool, allotment dwelling resident of Henley-on-Thames.
If they really have lost people like him, then they really are in serious s
t. He’s voted Conservative since the 1960’s. Edited by W124 on Tuesday 7th May 08:47
Rufus Stone said:
W124 said:
I was talking to my errant father about this last night. Over a nice pint of Cotswold Pale. He is a self described ‘natural conservative’.
He said something like ‘the Conservative Party has always relied on people voting in narrow self-interest but, now, nobody voting even in their own narrow self interest is going to vote for them.’
He tells me he’s going to vote for Starmer. Quite something. This is the Tories absolute core. A dyed-in-the-wool, allotment dwelling resident of Henley-on-Thames.
If they really have lost people like him, then they really are in serious st. He’s voted Conservative since the 1960’s.
At least he is sensible enough not to vote Reform. He said something like ‘the Conservative Party has always relied on people voting in narrow self-interest but, now, nobody voting even in their own narrow self interest is going to vote for them.’
He tells me he’s going to vote for Starmer. Quite something. This is the Tories absolute core. A dyed-in-the-wool, allotment dwelling resident of Henley-on-Thames.
If they really have lost people like him, then they really are in serious s
t. He’s voted Conservative since the 1960’s. Edited by W124 on Tuesday 7th May 08:47
W124 said:
I think he feels some corruption is unavoidable in politics. But it’s a matter of degree.
I’d be surprised if that was the whole of it. Corruption is a pretty strong description that the UK hasn’t been known for compared to many other countries. The Conservatives have been absolute troughers and up to all sorts of unsavoury behaviours personally but, Mone apart, they haven’t been facilitating big piles of cash changing hands on any great scale. They’ve done more unashamedly than most blue governments in terms of lobbying and favouritism in this latest incarnation but I wouldn’t call it large scale corruption.If corrupt means morally bankrupt that would make more sense.
Unreal said:
Condi said:
Unreal said:
I think he'd be far better concentrating on a Project Fear type policy regarding what havoc Labour policies would cause than continuing on his present path over over promising and under delivering. Covid proved how fear can be used to motivate, however much some academics would like us to believe it doesn't.
Is this satire? Or is he praying people forget Boris - lied to everyone, even himself, had parties in Downing Street, wasted money during Covid, removed almost everyone in the Party who disagreed with his version of Brexit, gave Honours to all of his mates including the 27 year old blond assistant? Or maybe Truss, who lasted 49 (42?) days in office, and caused so much havoc the BoE had to intervene and inject liquidity into the pensions system, also caused everyone's mortgages to go up.
Project fear? The evidence is there. The national debt is 50% higher today than it was when they left the note that "the money has gone". Taxes are higher. NHS waiting lists are longer. Councils are cutting services and going bust due to cuts in government funding. Project fear, its the Tory's we should be fearful of!
I want to live in Utopia just like everyone else. I just want to know who is going to pay for it. Other than the non-doms, Labour policy on that seems to be a bit threadbare whereas the shopping list is nice and juicy.
Rishi needs to hammer home this disparity. I honestly don't think it will make any difference but the thread is about him so we can either close it now because we know he is going to California and Labour will have a 200 seat majority or we can continue to talk about the man and his options.
So do you want the thread to be limited to how awful Rishi and the Tories are, in which case we can close the thread or combine it with the Trump thread, or would it be ok with you to explore other options, such as how Rishi and the Tories may try and extricate themselves from the hole they're in?
People look back over the past 14 years, and they're realising that the Tories also have an uncosted plan to offer a Utopia. They just don't publish their nice and juicy shopping list, because it only contains caviar and champagne for the very rich.
Speed 3 said:
W124 said:
I think he feels some corruption is unavoidable in politics. But it’s a matter of degree.
I’d be surprised if that was the whole of it. Corruption is a pretty strong description that the UK hasn’t been known for compared to many other countries. The Conservatives have been absolute troughers and up to all sorts of unsavoury behaviours personally but, Mone apart, they haven’t been facilitating big piles of cash changing hands on any great scale. They’ve done more unashamedly than most blue governments in terms of lobbying and favouritism in this latest incarnation but I wouldn’t call it large scale corruption.If corrupt means morally bankrupt that would make more sense.
He’s very much a realist, my father. He thinks that we allow and accept a bit of venality in politicians but there is, or should be, an unspoken agreement that this at least needs to be seen to be hidden. Or, at worst, an attempt must be seen to be being made to hide it.
Boris (he hates Boris) didn’t bother to attempt to hide his venality and corruption. Both personally and in policy terms. And from there we get here.
Corruption of course isn't confined to money. It can encompass for example, imposing historically restrictive laws during a public health crisis with severe penalties for breaches & flagrantly disregarding them yourself. That sort of thing has a natural tendency to enrage the hitherto compliant people you're governing. Then if you subsequently lie about it, well...
Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
President Merkin said:
Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
Yep, our system still works on the assumption that those who govern us should always act in a gentlemanly way and should know when to fall on their own sword when exposed for naughtiness.Boris changed all that and the ancient system wasn’t able to deal with it and that emboldened others to act in a similar way. How many times have ministers (inc PM) been caught up in something sleazy that would normally be a resignation matter have just styled it out and remained in office?
President Merkin said:
Corruption of course isn't confined to money. It can encompass for example, imposing historically restrictive laws during a public health crisis with severe penalties for breaches & flagrantly disregarding them yourself. That sort of thing has a natural tendency to enrage the hitherto compliant people you're governing. Then if you subsequently lie about it, well...
Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
It's been exposed many times over the years. Labour's Michael Martin wasn't in politics not to take what was owed to him. There are very few Dave Nellists.Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
Rufus Stone said:
W124 said:
I was talking to my errant father about this last night. Over a nice pint of Cotswold Pale. He is a self described ‘natural conservative’.
He said something like ‘the Conservative Party has always relied on people voting in narrow self-interest but, now, nobody voting even in their own narrow self interest is going to vote for them.’
He tells me he’s going to vote for Starmer. Quite something. This is the Tories absolute core. A dyed-in-the-wool, allotment dwelling resident of Henley-on-Thames.
If they really have lost people like him, then they really are in serious st. He’s voted Conservative since the 1960’s.
At least he is sensible enough not to vote Reform. He said something like ‘the Conservative Party has always relied on people voting in narrow self-interest but, now, nobody voting even in their own narrow self interest is going to vote for them.’
He tells me he’s going to vote for Starmer. Quite something. This is the Tories absolute core. A dyed-in-the-wool, allotment dwelling resident of Henley-on-Thames.
If they really have lost people like him, then they really are in serious s
t. He’s voted Conservative since the 1960’s. Edited by W124 on Tuesday 7th May 08:47
W124 said:
I was talking to my errant father about this last night. Over a nice pint of Cotswold Pale. He is a self described ‘natural conservative’.
He said something like ‘the Conservative Party has always relied on people voting in narrow self-interest but, now, nobody voting even in their own narrow self interest is going to vote for them.’
He tells me he’s going to vote for Starmer. Quite something. This is the Tories absolute core. A dyed-in-the-wool, allotment dwelling resident of Henley-on-Thames.
If they really have lost people like him, then they really are in serious st. He’s voted Conservative since the 1960’s.
I have a similar story. My mother was a Conservative councillor for many years in north London and obviously a Conservative voter her entire adult life. Never again she assures me. Sadly she refuses to back Labour (I’m obviously working on it) so voted for the Green candidate in these locals.He said something like ‘the Conservative Party has always relied on people voting in narrow self-interest but, now, nobody voting even in their own narrow self interest is going to vote for them.’
He tells me he’s going to vote for Starmer. Quite something. This is the Tories absolute core. A dyed-in-the-wool, allotment dwelling resident of Henley-on-Thames.
If they really have lost people like him, then they really are in serious s
t. He’s voted Conservative since the 1960’s. Edited by W124 on Tuesday 7th May 08:47
turbobloke said:
President Merkin said:
Corruption of course isn't confined to money. It can encompass for example, imposing historically restrictive laws during a public health crisis with severe penalties for breaches & flagrantly disregarding them yourself. That sort of thing has a natural tendency to enrage the hitherto compliant people you're governing. Then if you subsequently lie about it, well...
Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
It's been exposed many times over the years. Labour's Michael Martin wasn't in politics not to take what was owed to him. There are very few Dave Nellists.Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
turbobloke said:
President Merkin said:
Corruption of course isn't confined to money. It can encompass for example, imposing historically restrictive laws during a public health crisis with severe penalties for breaches & flagrantly disregarding them yourself. That sort of thing has a natural tendency to enrage the hitherto compliant people you're governing. Then if you subsequently lie about it, well...
Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
But Labour....Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
turbobloke said:
President Merkin said:
Corruption of course isn't confined to money. It can encompass for example, imposing historically restrictive laws during a public health crisis with severe penalties for breaches & flagrantly disregarding them yourself. That sort of thing has a natural tendency to enrage the hitherto compliant people you're governing. Then if you subsequently lie about it, well...
Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
It's been exposed many times over the years. Labour's Michael Martin wasn't in politics not to take what was owed to him. There are very few Dave Nellists.Our system of government has relied on the theory of the good chap.The flaw in that has been brutally exposed in the past few years.
First it's comparing individual miscreants with wholesale & ongoing wrongdoing. Secondly, it cynically mplies they're all at it - they are not & never were. and finally, it dismisses without censure the worst excesses of the past few years. Truly a the ends justify the means outlook. No wonder the right is sinking here.
President Merkin said:
I find this entrely morally debased. TB representative of everything wrong with right wing thinking today.
First it's comparing individual miscreants with wholesale & ongoing wrongdoing. Secondly, it cynically mplies they're all at it - they are not & never were. and finally, it dismisses without censure the worst excesses of the past few years. Truly a the ends justify the means outlook. No wonder the right is sinking here.
YupFirst it's comparing individual miscreants with wholesale & ongoing wrongdoing. Secondly, it cynically mplies they're all at it - they are not & never were. and finally, it dismisses without censure the worst excesses of the past few years. Truly a the ends justify the means outlook. No wonder the right is sinking here.
blueg33 said:
President Merkin said:
I find this entrely morally debased. TB representative of everything wrong with right wing thinking today.
First it's comparing individual miscreants with wholesale & ongoing wrongdoing. Secondly, it cynically mplies they're all at it - they are not & never were. and finally, it dismisses without censure the worst excesses of the past few years. Truly a the ends justify the means outlook. No wonder the right is sinking here.
YupFirst it's comparing individual miscreants with wholesale & ongoing wrongdoing. Secondly, it cynically mplies they're all at it - they are not & never were. and finally, it dismisses without censure the worst excesses of the past few years. Truly a the ends justify the means outlook. No wonder the right is sinking here.
blueg33 said:
I would be very surprised if they can extricate themselves from the hole they have been digging since 2016. The problem is they don't stop digging it, they just double down and bring in an extra shovel.
IMO they have totally missed the point about the things that concern most people. If you are working on say the living wage, things are tight, you are more worried about the cost of living than about culture wars, you are more worried about whether your elderly mum has to wait 2 years for a knee op,and your cousin who was sexually assaulted and has PTSD can't get a mental health appointment for 18 months.
On top of that, your car was damaged by a pothole and you can't afford to get it fixed, you can't get to work by train because they are on strike again and bus services have been reduced by 14% since 2014.
But yeah the war on trans, making homelessness illegal, pissing £500m up the wall on a deterrent that has already failed, and ensuring people who cant get healthcare have their benefits cut is definitely the way to win votes.........
Their track record is a failure to deliver on things that people see and feel the most.
So would I, which is why I find it far more interesting to discuss what they could try rather than participating in a circle jerk about how awful they are.IMO they have totally missed the point about the things that concern most people. If you are working on say the living wage, things are tight, you are more worried about the cost of living than about culture wars, you are more worried about whether your elderly mum has to wait 2 years for a knee op,and your cousin who was sexually assaulted and has PTSD can't get a mental health appointment for 18 months.
On top of that, your car was damaged by a pothole and you can't afford to get it fixed, you can't get to work by train because they are on strike again and bus services have been reduced by 14% since 2014.
But yeah the war on trans, making homelessness illegal, pissing £500m up the wall on a deterrent that has already failed, and ensuring people who cant get healthcare have their benefits cut is definitely the way to win votes.........
Their track record is a failure to deliver on things that people see and feel the most.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff