Things you always wanted to know the answer to [Vol. 5]
Discussion
Not quite the same as shifting into reverse, but racing at Combe a couple of years ago, after a great start from the middle of the grid and a good run through Quarry, in all the excitement of heading into the top 4, I managed to slightly lock the front wheels as I braked for the chicane and instead of going from 4th to 3rd, I went straight into 1st. Suffice to say that the flywheel got ripped off, the gearbox and diff got destroyed and the top end of the motor was scrapped.
I’d suggest that it’s not a good idea.
I’d suggest that it’s not a good idea.
paua said:
Try it in a traditional automatic - shift from 1 to 2 to Drag to Race. You'll end up with the back end locked up, half sideways & needing a new tranny.
Something for Paua....I've never experienced this in a car, but I have in a boat. When the RNLI started out re-engining the Severn class, replacing the old CAT 3412s with MTUs, they sent the prototype around the coast on extended sea trials calling at LifeBoat stations on the way. One of the features of the MTU boat is the option of emergency stop by pulling both throttles from full ahead to full astern in one movement.
This would get very expensive very quickly with the CATs but on the MTU version the computer takes over and does exactly what you just told it to.
When it was demonstrated to me the bloke just said "hang on very tight and watch this".
Try to imagine 44 tonnes going at 26 knots then suddenly applying all 3200 horsepower the other way.
Once was enough. I never had the nuts to try it again.
Error_404_Username_not_found said:
paua said:
Try it in a traditional automatic - shift from 1 to 2 to Drag to Race. You'll end up with the back end locked up, half sideways & needing a new tranny.
Something for Paua....I've never experienced this in a car, but I have in a boat. When the RNLI started out re-engining the Severn class, replacing the old CAT 3412s with MTUs, they sent the prototype around the coast on extended sea trials calling at LifeBoat stations on the way. One of the features of the MTU boat is the option of emergency stop by pulling both throttles from full ahead to full astern in one movement.
This would get very expensive very quickly with the CATs but on the MTU version the computer takes over and does exactly what you just told it to.
When it was demonstrated to me the bloke just said "hang on very tight and watch this".
Try to imagine 44 tonnes going at 26 knots then suddenly applying all 3200 horsepower the other way.
Once was enough. I never had the nuts to try it again.
I've been on a pontoon boat ( 300HP outboards) slaloming very aggressively until one pontoon dug in. Leading to a couple people with cracked ribs after people were catapulted from port to stbd.
Last Lifeboat I drove ( as a teeneger in the 70's) did all of 7-8 kts. ( it started life in your part of the world
edit - was a ex-RNLI 10.9m Liverpool class
Edited by paua on Tuesday 7th May 09:59
paua said:
Abbott said:
Mr Penguin said:
What would happen if I was driving along the road at a normal speed and suddenly put my car into reverse?
I have occasionally tried to do this as I drive different cars with different gear patterns. It gives a zing noise but certainly won't engage. I guess there is a high probability that bits of gear tooth are sitting at the bottom of the gearboxHalmyre said:
paua said:
Abbott said:
Mr Penguin said:
What would happen if I was driving along the road at a normal speed and suddenly put my car into reverse?
I have occasionally tried to do this as I drive different cars with different gear patterns. It gives a zing noise but certainly won't engage. I guess there is a high probability that bits of gear tooth are sitting at the bottom of the gearbox
I’ve not always wanted to know this so slightly O/T
Step-daughter was flying from Barcelona to Cologne last night so, out of idle curiosity, I was watching on FlightRadar24. Why did Eurowings take the “long way round” rather than flying in a straight line? Is there a better tailwind over the Med’ giving better fuel usage, are there tax advantages for a Germany-based airline to be in German airspace as much as possible, are they avoiding the Pyrenees after an unfortunate incident involving the same airline a few years ago? Something to do with French ATC? Is the map not a “true” representation and it’s actually more direct than it seems?
Maybe someone here can shed light on this?
Step-daughter was flying from Barcelona to Cologne last night so, out of idle curiosity, I was watching on FlightRadar24. Why did Eurowings take the “long way round” rather than flying in a straight line? Is there a better tailwind over the Med’ giving better fuel usage, are there tax advantages for a Germany-based airline to be in German airspace as much as possible, are they avoiding the Pyrenees after an unfortunate incident involving the same airline a few years ago? Something to do with French ATC? Is the map not a “true” representation and it’s actually more direct than it seems?
Maybe someone here can shed light on this?
generationx said:
Step-daughter was flying from Barcelona to Cologne last night so, out of idle curiosity, I was watching on FlightRadar24. Why did Eurowings take the “long way round” rather than flying in a straight line? Is there a better tailwind over the Med’ giving better fuel usage, are there tax advantages for a Germany-based airline to be in German airspace as much as possible, are they avoiding the Pyrenees after an unfortunate incident involving the same airline a few years ago? Something to do with French ATC? Is the map not a “true” representation and it’s actually more direct than it seems?
It could be any of the above. Traffic is another (as in air traffic), weather as well. Interesting you mention the map accuracy in terms of reality. I've often wondered why when flying to the US from the UK you end up flying over the tip of Greenland and along the eastern Canada. In my mind, I expect to head off over the Atlantic and not see land until we reach the US. It's not until you look at a globe you realise that the former is in fact the more direct route.
StevieBee said:
It could be any of the above. Traffic is another (as in air traffic), weather as well.
Interesting you mention the map accuracy in terms of reality. I've often wondered why when flying to the US from the UK you end up flying over the tip of Greenland and along the eastern Canada. In my mind, I expect to head off over the Atlantic and not see land until we reach the US. It's not until you look at a globe you realise that the former is in fact the more direct route.
Great circle, innit?Interesting you mention the map accuracy in terms of reality. I've often wondered why when flying to the US from the UK you end up flying over the tip of Greenland and along the eastern Canada. In my mind, I expect to head off over the Atlantic and not see land until we reach the US. It's not until you look at a globe you realise that the former is in fact the more direct route.
generationx said:
I’ve not always wanted to know this so slightly O/T
Step-daughter was flying from Barcelona to Cologne last night so, out of idle curiosity, I was watching on FlightRadar24. Why did Eurowings take the “long way round” rather than flying in a straight line? Is there a better tailwind over the Med’ giving better fuel usage, are there tax advantages for a Germany-based airline to be in German airspace as much as possible, are they avoiding the Pyrenees after an unfortunate incident involving the same airline a few years ago? Something to do with French ATC? Is the map not a “true” representation and it’s actually more direct than it seems?
Maybe someone here can shed light on this?
It's called the Great Circle, and it's down to the fact that the earth is a globe (actually it's an oblate spheroid) and a map is a flat projection. This means that a straight line over a globe can look like a curve when projected onto a flat map. Step-daughter was flying from Barcelona to Cologne last night so, out of idle curiosity, I was watching on FlightRadar24. Why did Eurowings take the “long way round” rather than flying in a straight line? Is there a better tailwind over the Med’ giving better fuel usage, are there tax advantages for a Germany-based airline to be in German airspace as much as possible, are they avoiding the Pyrenees after an unfortunate incident involving the same airline a few years ago? Something to do with French ATC? Is the map not a “true” representation and it’s actually more direct than it seems?
Maybe someone here can shed light on this?
This video explains it well. It's about ships but it equally applies to aircraft
https://youtu.be/u8A3yAbcMcM
Edited by Clockwork Cupcake on Tuesday 7th May 13:19
generationx said:
Yes this is clear - as mentioned above the interactive maps on aircraft often seem “strange”. However this is a shorter distance so the globe/projected map distortion is less effective. This snapshot is taken from Google Earth which should be a bit more representative:
I fly frequently from London to Milan and vice versa. Although French ATC industrial action is generally a reliable bet for disruption most of the time, poor weather in some parts of the Alps often causes dog leg routings on my flights. The main alternative corridor seems to be northwards from Malpensa up to Zurich, turning towards Basel, then following the Rhine valley and then Belgium/Holland in my case, while I would usually get to see Paris out of the window on a normal course.
generationx said:
Yes this is clear - as mentioned above the interactive maps on aircraft often seem “strange”. However this is a shorter distance so the globe/projected map distortion is less effective. This snapshot is taken from Google Earth which should be a bit more representative
Are you sure it's a shorter distance, given the aforementioned Great Circle projection? Air carriers are not in the habit of going the long way round and burning extra fuel, if they can help it. 
edit: As psi310398 alludes, there are plenty of other factors to consider too though, like weather, prevailing winds, airspace restrictions, flight corridors, etc.
Clockwork Cupcake said:
generationx said:
Yes this is clear - as mentioned above the interactive maps on aircraft often seem “strange”. However this is a shorter distance so the globe/projected map distortion is less effective. This snapshot is taken from Google Earth which should be a bit more representative
Are you sure it's a shorter distance, given the aforementioned Great Circle projection? Air carriers are not in the habit of going the long way round and burning extra fuel, if they can help it. edit: As psi310398 alludes, there are plenty of other factors to consider too though, like weather, prevailing winds, airspace restrictions, flight corridors, etc.
generationx said:
Why did Eurowings take the “long way round” rather than flying in a straight line? Is there a better tailwind over the Med’ giving better fuel usage, are there tax advantages for a Germany-based airline to be in German airspace as much as possible, are they avoiding the Pyrenees after an unfortunate incident involving the same airline a few years ago? Something to do with French ATC? Is the map not a “true” representation and it’s actually more direct than it seems?
Yes, some of these in my original question, although some other interesting alternatives.We need an ATC/airline insider expert!
Going back a coupla pages to the oval cylinders and wanting to get more valves in order to get more fuel in/gasses out; why has this design not been used as (to me) it looks like its about 20% more area to get fuel in/extract exhaust gasses than two each for inlet/exhaust?
Or perhaps it has been used?
Sorry for the amateur word.doc pic
Or perhaps it has been used?
Sorry for the amateur word.doc pic
Edited by Fastchas on Tuesday 7th May 16:28
RizzoTheRat said:
borcy said:
Why do some job adverts give vague info like 'UK based' what use is that to anyone?
Fully working from home? Office location within the country doesn't matter but there are tax issues if WFH abroad.Gassing Station | The Lounge | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff