RE: 2024 BMW M4 CS | PH Review

[cerb4.5lee]

philmots said:

This will likely be ultimate road car and people are moaning about how it looks.

Be grateful stuff like this is still being made, nobody else is doing it as good.

mrclav said:

The way humans consume new products, including cars, has massively changed in the last couple decades and will continue to change as legislation is going to makes cars like this extinct. Rather than moaning, maybe people should enjoy cars like this while they still can.

You're both spot on I reckon, and before we know it...we'll all be driving around in soulless EVs in comparison. More people need to realise that the future isn't all that bright anymore when it comes to cars I think.

[nismo48]

It's not a looker and it's sheer size and weight need those extra horses to escape It's hideous presence

[Nomme de Plum]

cerb4.5lee said:

philmots said:

This will likely be ultimate road car and people are moaning about how it looks.

Be grateful stuff like this is still being made, nobody else is doing it as good.

mrclav said:

The way humans consume new products, including cars, has massively changed in the last couple decades and will continue to change as legislation is going to makes cars like this extinct. Rather than moaning, maybe people should enjoy cars like this while they still can.

You're both spot on I reckon, and before we know it...we'll all be driving around in soulless EVs in comparison. More people need to realise that the future isn't all that bright anymore when it comes to cars I think.

The future is what we make it and IMO is fantastically bright. Isn't it a bit grim to be so negative?

I'm sure this car will sell well enough to make BMW a few bob.

[AmyRichardson]

cerb4.5lee said:

You're both spot on I reckon, and before we know it...we'll all be driving around in soulless EVs in comparison. More people need to realise that the future isn't all that bright anymore when it comes to cars I think.

I dismal future is no reason to withhold legitimate criticism in the present.

You might say that some folk are putting weight, tactility and, far moreover, looks on an unreasonable pedestal - and that's a reasonable point

[E90_M3Ross]

Nomme de Plum said:

cerb4.5lee said:

philmots said:

This will likely be ultimate road car and people are moaning about how it looks.

Be grateful stuff like this is still being made, nobody else is doing it as good.

mrclav said:

The way humans consume new products, including cars, has massively changed in the last couple decades and will continue to change as legislation is going to makes cars like this extinct. Rather than moaning, maybe people should enjoy cars like this while they still can.

You're both spot on I reckon, and before we know it...we'll all be driving around in soulless EVs in comparison. More people need to realise that the future isn't all that bright anymore when it comes to cars I think.

The future is what we make it and IMO is fantastically bright. Isn't it a bit grim to be so negative?

I'm sure this car will sell well enough to make BMW a few bob.

It wouldn't surprise me if the future eventually goes 100% AI/automatic driving (i.e. no driver input). Sure, many years off yet, but I wouldn't bet against it. For someone who enjoys driving, I'd say that is a bit grim. Many people also quite enjoy driving a lightweight sports car round and using a manual gearbox. Sure, they aren't the fastest things, or the most efficient, but these interactions and the feelings can be fun and enjoyable. I'm not too convinced many cars in the future will offer that ability, certainly on the manual gearbox side of things. Or is that wrong?

If you are a straight line hero and just want efficiency, then yes, the future is indeed very bright, I will grant you that.

[Dolf Stoppard]

Interior looks like someone has been hitting Ali Express very hard.

[sidesauce]

AmyRichardson said:

cerb4.5lee said:

You're both spot on I reckon, and before we know it...we'll all be driving around in soulless EVs in comparison. More people need to realise that the future isn't all that bright anymore when it comes to cars I think.

I dismal future is no reason to withhold legitimate criticism in the present.

You might say that some folk are putting weight, tactility and, far moreover, looks on an unreasonable pedestal - and that's a reasonable point

It's funny - I very clearly remember people complaining about the M3 CSL when it came out and yet today it's considered the best M3 ever made and I generally haven't heard anyone speaking bad about it (apart from its gearbox).

As the saying goes, you don't know what they've got til it's gone and I think people on here generally moan way too much...

[Nomme de Plum]

E90_M3Ross said:

It wouldn't surprise me if the future eventually goes 100% AI/automatic driving (i.e. no driver input). Sure, many years off yet, but I wouldn't bet against it. For someone who enjoys driving, I'd say that is a bit grim. Many people also quite enjoy driving a lightweight sports car round and using a manual gearbox. Sure, they aren't the fastest things, or the most efficient, but these interactions and the feelings can be fun and enjoyable. I'm not too convinced many cars in the future will offer that ability, certainly on the manual gearbox side of things. Or is that wrong?

If you are a straight line hero and just want efficiency, then yes, the future is indeed very bright, I will grant you that.

If autonomous driving ever comes to fruition it will be because the vast majority of the populous accept it and no doubt will result a worthwhile reduction in deaths and serious injuries, something that no one should argue against.

Nothing is or will stop existing cars being used whether manual or automatic, certainly in the lifetime of current PH posters.

Your last paragraph is ill informed and already evidenced as being inaccurate.

I do wonder how long the likes of BMW will keep developing this type of car, impressive though it is.

[CountyAFC]

That's the 'stance' of the most hardcore M4?

[GT9]

E90_M3Ross said:

Many people also quite enjoy driving a lightweight sports car round and using a manual gearbox. Sure, they aren't the fastest things, or the most efficient, but these interactions and the feelings can be fun and enjoyable. I'm not too convinced many cars in the future will offer that ability, certainly on the manual gearbox side of things. Or is that wrong?

Not wrong at all.
However, if said driver is also going to insist the car must be brand new, then I've personally got a lot less time to hear what they have to say.

[E90_M3Ross]

Nomme de Plum said:

E90_M3Ross said:

It wouldn't surprise me if the future eventually goes 100% AI/automatic driving (i.e. no driver input). Sure, many years off yet, but I wouldn't bet against it. For someone who enjoys driving, I'd say that is a bit grim. Many people also quite enjoy driving a lightweight sports car round and using a manual gearbox. Sure, they aren't the fastest things, or the most efficient, but these interactions and the feelings can be fun and enjoyable. I'm not too convinced many cars in the future will offer that ability, certainly on the manual gearbox side of things. Or is that wrong?

If you are a straight line hero and just want efficiency, then yes, the future is indeed very bright, I will grant you that.

If autonomous driving ever comes to fruition it will be because the vast majority of the populous accept it and no doubt will result a worthwhile reduction in deaths and serious injuries, something that no one should argue against.

Nothing is or will stop existing cars being used whether manual or automatic, certainly in the lifetime of current PH posters.

Your last paragraph is ill informed and already evidenced as being inaccurate.

I do wonder how long the likes of BMW will keep developing this type of car, impressive though it is.

Your first point doesn't actually address the issue I was trying to get across.

I basically said that those that enjoy driving will eventually succomb to automated driving. You said that it'd result in fewer deaths. That will most likely be the case, but that doesn't actually address the issue of automated driving being less enjoyable for those that enjoy driving, does it?

Nobody is stopping existing car, etc.... But cars don't last forever, and eventually do need replacing. It doesn't take a genius to understand what that eventually means for the person who enjoys a certain type of driving experience.

"if you are a straight line hero and just want efficiency the future is very bright....."

Is that particularly ill informed, or are you saying that cars are going to get generally slower and less efficient?

[stuart100]

E90_M3Ross said:

Nomme de Plum said:

E90_M3Ross said:

It wouldn't surprise me if the future eventually goes 100% AI/automatic driving (i.e. no driver input). Sure, many years off yet, but I wouldn't bet against it. For someone who enjoys driving, I'd say that is a bit grim. Many people also quite enjoy driving a lightweight sports car round and using a manual gearbox. Sure, they aren't the fastest things, or the most efficient, but these interactions and the feelings can be fun and enjoyable. I'm not too convinced many cars in the future will offer that ability, certainly on the manual gearbox side of things. Or is that wrong?

If you are a straight line hero and just want efficiency, then yes, the future is indeed very bright, I will grant you that.

If autonomous driving ever comes to fruition it will be because the vast majority of the populous accept it and no doubt will result a worthwhile reduction in deaths and serious injuries, something that no one should argue against.

Nothing is or will stop existing cars being used whether manual or automatic, certainly in the lifetime of current PH posters.

Your last paragraph is ill informed and already evidenced as being inaccurate.

I do wonder how long the likes of BMW will keep developing this type of car, impressive though it is.

Your first point doesn't actually address the issue I was trying to get across.

I basically said that those that enjoy driving will eventually succomb to automated driving. You said that it'd result in fewer deaths. That will most likely be the case, but that doesn't actually address the issue of automated driving being less enjoyable for those that enjoy driving, does it?

Nobody is stopping existing car, etc.... But cars don't last forever, and eventually do need replacing. It doesn't take a genius to understand what that eventually means for the person who enjoys a certain type of driving experience.

"if you are a straight line hero and just want efficiency the future is very bright....."

Is that particularly ill informed, or are you saying that cars are going to get generally slower and less efficient?

I understand you. Also we have low emissions zones popping up everywhere. Councils wanting to charge more for parking environmentally unfriendly cars. Higher VED. The beauracrats are against cars.

[chunder]

mrclav said:

GT9 said:

200k global M division sales last year says to me BMW know exactly what they are doing.

Indeed, it's clear BMW know what their customers want more than anyone on here - this is the bit that people on the forum don't seem to (or want to) understand.

PH probably has a higher representation of the likely buying market than the general public so maybe BMW should take note as perhaps they could have sold 400k last year

[Water Fairy]

GT9 said:

hungry_hog said:

Aside from the hooter, that weird slab display looks terrible, not integrated at all

Not sure what is going on at BMW for both internal and external design, or is this all designed to appeal to the Chinese market, bit like those awful Balenciaga trainers?

200k global M division sales last year says to me BMW know exactly what they are doing.
Having said that, the car photographed does have too many bright colours going on for my liking.
Black or tanzanite paint would sort that.

What's the demographic of the modern M buyer these days (genuine question)? I imagine a fair chunk of them wouldn't know what an E30 is to be fair.

[oedipus]

Do they no longer test your eyesight before getting a driving licence? Too pricey, too fast, too ugly.

[GT9]

chunder said:

PH probably has a higher representation of the likely buying market than the general public so maybe BMW should take note as perhaps they could have sold 400k last year

Do you genuinely believe that?
PH has a higher representation of people who have strong opinions about these cars, actually buying them en-masse, I very much doubt it.
If the car was made to appeal to people who think the E46 was the pinnacle, whilst those people might sleep easier at night, they still wouldn't buy them new.

[cerb4.5lee]

oedipus said:

Do they no longer test your eyesight before getting a driving licence? Too pricey, too fast, too ugly.

You do realise this is PistonHeads and not Mumsnet don't you?

You did make me laugh/smile with the eyesight bit though thanks!

[raspy]

hungry_hog said:

Aside from the hooter, that weird slab display looks terrible, not integrated at all

Not sure what is going on at BMW for both internal and external design, or is this all designed to appeal to the Chinese market, bit like those awful Balenciaga trainers?

China was not even in the top 3 markets for BMW M cars last year, and ha, the UK was the 3rd biggest market!

"The USA was once again the most important single market for BMW M GmbH automobiles in the 2023 financial year.

The German home market again took second place in the ranking of sales regions, while the UK remained the third most important market, as in the previous year."

https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/global/article/deta...

[HazzaT]

hungry_hog said:

Aside from the hooter, that weird slab display looks terrible, not integrated at all

Not sure what is going on at BMW for both internal and external design, or is this all designed to appeal to the Chinese market, bit like those awful Balenciaga trainers?

The single screen display looks awful. The pre facelift interior looked really good for me at least, the current design with no binnacle at all just seems cheap in a 6 figure car.
It takes away from the seats and wheel

[CountyAFC]

It looks like one those cars from my youth where they've put a massive body kit on a cooking model and then run of money before they bought bigger alloys and so have to run it on the standard wheels until they can save up the necessary funds.