987.1 Cayman S - First Foray into the world of Porsche
Discussion
The mission? Deliver the thrills of my 240bhp/tonne E30 trackday car, whilst being easier to live with and without significantly multiplying budget. And also be something mrs motorhole would drive and be happy to spend time in - making memories and all that.
For anyone interested, the E30 story starts and ends here: https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
I've always had a thing for Porsches. 911s in particular. It started with a ride in a 1980 3-litre carrera race car. What a thing! My E30 ended being much quicker, but the 911, at least from the passenger seat, just felt so mechanical, so adjustable on the limit. And looked fantastic.
Then I got that Lego Technic kit, the Orange 991 GT3 RS with working PDK. This is a fantastic model for a petrolhead, especially a Porsche fan, to have and what a pleasure it is to put together.
I'd thought about trading the E30 for a 996 a little while ago, but their interiors are a bit of a letdown, they all look tired with out spending a lot of money and a Carrera 2 would still need even more money throwing at it to get close to the E30 around a track.
Then about 12 months ago, I wondered whether a 992 C2S would fit the bill. Yet again, the man maths just didn't add up. By the time I'd put enough money into it to be capable on track along with the borkage factor offered by the M97 engine, I was at real risk of being over £40k deep in a car that does 3k miles a year. That, to me, just didn't make sense.
A Cayman though? They start a lot cheaper. The 1st generation 987s have a classic Porsche look to the styling. The entry price for a nice example was more than £10k less than a similar condition/age/mileage 997 C2S. And they are more trackable out of the box with a lower kerb weight.
Thing is, is a Z4 3.0Si a better car for me? It's certainly cheaper, I love the styling and it doesn't have the M97 borkage factor. I checked one out with the wife and it was indeed a very nice car. But felt a lot more cramped than the Porsche and it had a lot less storage capacity. Plus the missus didn't think it was as comfortable as the Porsche. Decision made then, the search began.
I looked at quite a few. Some cheap. Some low mileage. Some new, some old. None of them the car for me. Then I came across a 2007 example that stood out from the rest. It looked pretty immaculate inside and out. Furthermore, the rear ARB and drop links didn't look like they'd been raised from the bottom of the sea. The manifolds weren't crusty. Inside the wheel arches looked like new all round. Even the shocks looked pretty new. It was by far the cleanest I'd seen underneath, even including the 38k mile example I checked out the week before.
It was also a nice spec as a road/track car, with the 'special' feeling extended leather and sports chrono pack, PASM, yet without the rear wash wipe, electric memory seats or the Bose sound system. Just under 72k miles on the odometer and it drove great. No, it hadn't been borescoped. But it didn't tick when hot or smoke when cold and ran smooth as you like, so I took a risk...
It also has lots of brake and tyre, along with a new clutch having been fitted some 7k miles previous. A Topgear cat-back system means it sounds great when you give the beans but it's nice and quiet on a motorway cruise. Braided brake lines and GT3 brake cooling panels have also already been fitted.
Yet it's not perfect. Now I've driven it a bit and have given it a pretty thorough inspection, I do have a list of jobs to do / get done...
1) Needs new aircon condensers
2) Looks like its still on original water pump. So this needs to be done and will fit a low-temp thermostat and new drive belt for good measure
3) Oil leak from RMS. This doesn't look bad, I had to properly get under the car to see it and it doesn't drip. But it is annoying given the clutch has recently been changed!
4) Oil leak from chain tensioner
5) Probably needs front coffin arms within the next 12 months
Still, the cost of getting this sorted should be less than a new set of PS4S, pads and discs. Given many of the examples I looked at needed both, or more doing (along with whatever else was lurking under the skin) I think I've done okay. Fingers crossed it's a good un!
For anyone interested, the E30 story starts and ends here: https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
I've always had a thing for Porsches. 911s in particular. It started with a ride in a 1980 3-litre carrera race car. What a thing! My E30 ended being much quicker, but the 911, at least from the passenger seat, just felt so mechanical, so adjustable on the limit. And looked fantastic.
Then I got that Lego Technic kit, the Orange 991 GT3 RS with working PDK. This is a fantastic model for a petrolhead, especially a Porsche fan, to have and what a pleasure it is to put together.
I'd thought about trading the E30 for a 996 a little while ago, but their interiors are a bit of a letdown, they all look tired with out spending a lot of money and a Carrera 2 would still need even more money throwing at it to get close to the E30 around a track.
Then about 12 months ago, I wondered whether a 992 C2S would fit the bill. Yet again, the man maths just didn't add up. By the time I'd put enough money into it to be capable on track along with the borkage factor offered by the M97 engine, I was at real risk of being over £40k deep in a car that does 3k miles a year. That, to me, just didn't make sense.
A Cayman though? They start a lot cheaper. The 1st generation 987s have a classic Porsche look to the styling. The entry price for a nice example was more than £10k less than a similar condition/age/mileage 997 C2S. And they are more trackable out of the box with a lower kerb weight.
Thing is, is a Z4 3.0Si a better car for me? It's certainly cheaper, I love the styling and it doesn't have the M97 borkage factor. I checked one out with the wife and it was indeed a very nice car. But felt a lot more cramped than the Porsche and it had a lot less storage capacity. Plus the missus didn't think it was as comfortable as the Porsche. Decision made then, the search began.
I looked at quite a few. Some cheap. Some low mileage. Some new, some old. None of them the car for me. Then I came across a 2007 example that stood out from the rest. It looked pretty immaculate inside and out. Furthermore, the rear ARB and drop links didn't look like they'd been raised from the bottom of the sea. The manifolds weren't crusty. Inside the wheel arches looked like new all round. Even the shocks looked pretty new. It was by far the cleanest I'd seen underneath, even including the 38k mile example I checked out the week before.
It was also a nice spec as a road/track car, with the 'special' feeling extended leather and sports chrono pack, PASM, yet without the rear wash wipe, electric memory seats or the Bose sound system. Just under 72k miles on the odometer and it drove great. No, it hadn't been borescoped. But it didn't tick when hot or smoke when cold and ran smooth as you like, so I took a risk...
It also has lots of brake and tyre, along with a new clutch having been fitted some 7k miles previous. A Topgear cat-back system means it sounds great when you give the beans but it's nice and quiet on a motorway cruise. Braided brake lines and GT3 brake cooling panels have also already been fitted.
Yet it's not perfect. Now I've driven it a bit and have given it a pretty thorough inspection, I do have a list of jobs to do / get done...
1) Needs new aircon condensers
2) Looks like its still on original water pump. So this needs to be done and will fit a low-temp thermostat and new drive belt for good measure
3) Oil leak from RMS. This doesn't look bad, I had to properly get under the car to see it and it doesn't drip. But it is annoying given the clutch has recently been changed!
4) Oil leak from chain tensioner
5) Probably needs front coffin arms within the next 12 months
Still, the cost of getting this sorted should be less than a new set of PS4S, pads and discs. Given many of the examples I looked at needed both, or more doing (along with whatever else was lurking under the skin) I think I've done okay. Fingers crossed it's a good un!
Rethw said:
Great buy OP, I bought one last year, then got rid of my M2, the more analogue feel of the Cayman is much better as a daily for me.
Needing to replace the discs and pads, head over to GSF parts, I just replaced mine with Brembo items £260 !
Watching with interest any upgrades you do. I’m currently looking at swapping out the old PCM2.1 Bose system with something more modern.
Now you can't say that without posting up pictures of your own! Cheers Needing to replace the discs and pads, head over to GSF parts, I just replaced mine with Brembo items £260 !
Watching with interest any upgrades you do. I’m currently looking at swapping out the old PCM2.1 Bose system with something more modern.
It should be getting condensers etc sorted on Friday. After that, well the plan is to keep it standard for a few months and see how I get on with it after the Porsche novelty has worn off. Only if I decide to keep it after that will I start thinking about mods to help it deal with a handful of trackdays a year on top of being a fun GT car and summer drive blaster.
The oiling issues are what keep me up at night. But from forum reports it's hard to make head or tail of it all. There are those that have done 10 days a year for 5 or 6 years with track tyres and no issues at all on standard oiling setups and those that have fitted uprated baffles and pumps only for the engine to eat #6 main bearing on day 1 using street tyres. As always, this suggests there are many factors at play in the failures including:
- Oil grade & temperature
- Coolant temperature
- How well an aftermarket baffle is fitted - if it doesn't seal against the engine block it could prove worse than the standard baffle
- Ability to rev match (Aggressive clutch engagement on downchanges will put load on #6 bearing and won't help oil surge either)
- Fuelling and fuel quality (detonation also puts a huge load on main & rod bearings)
So I figure when the time comes, do what an experienced specialist recommends for such use (occasional track use on street tyres), just drive the wheels off the thing and hope for the best! Just a new experience for me, coming from a BMW where for a relatively low cost, I'd been able to build an engine that could take literally hours of redline treatment on a trackday with no ill effects. Worried I'll break this beautiful thing if I treat it the same way!
Edited by motorhole on Tuesday 26th July 12:42
Thank you for all the feedback folks and great to see photos of other great looking Caymans!
I've now had new air conditioning condensers fitted so that works as it should, timing chain tensioner leaked, cooling system refresh with low temp thermostat and fresh Millers 5w40. It drives great.
Also washed the car yesterday so felt obliged to take better pictures. I should add I'm most definitely not a spit and polish kinda guy...but I wanted to clean it up myself the first time to give everything a good close up look.
Couple of little jobs I've spotted on my way round the car. The interior wing mirror trim on the offside needs refitting, looks like a clip or something has broken. And there's a rattle from the nearside door on certain road surfaces that's going to do my nut in if I leave it! Unfortunately that means door trim is going to have to come off, which it's a sad job on anything remotely modern. I want to fit some mesh to the bumper too to protect the shiny new condensers. Jobs for a quiet weekend
I've now had new air conditioning condensers fitted so that works as it should, timing chain tensioner leaked, cooling system refresh with low temp thermostat and fresh Millers 5w40. It drives great.
Also washed the car yesterday so felt obliged to take better pictures. I should add I'm most definitely not a spit and polish kinda guy...but I wanted to clean it up myself the first time to give everything a good close up look.
Couple of little jobs I've spotted on my way round the car. The interior wing mirror trim on the offside needs refitting, looks like a clip or something has broken. And there's a rattle from the nearside door on certain road surfaces that's going to do my nut in if I leave it! Unfortunately that means door trim is going to have to come off, which it's a sad job on anything remotely modern. I want to fit some mesh to the bumper too to protect the shiny new condensers. Jobs for a quiet weekend
Missus was away this weekend in my daily (Octavia vRS TDi estate) because of the amount of stuff she had to take so I spent the weekend bumbling around in this, which was just grand! The air-conditioning is absolutely beautiful with no noticeable heat soak into the cabin, even in standing traffic in 30+ degrees. Very comfortable and a pleasure to be in. Covered about 300-400 miles in it so far.
Few jobs done this weekend. New fuel cap first. Tether for the old one had rotted off, which annoyed me. Easy fix.
Then I set out to do the brake fluid. Maybe I made a bit of a meal of it, but it took a while as I went round the whole car ensuring all 8 bleed nipples loosened freely before I did anything else. And the back wheels only came off with a fight, figure they haven't been off for a while. Nevertheless, flushed through with fresh RBF660 which has made a huge change to the pedal. Lovely, firm and confidence inspiring.
It had DOT 5.1 in it previously going by service invoices from the specialist who looked after it. Wasn't impressed with it on my BMW, not impressed with it now. Especially with advised 6 monthly changes, for a road or dual purpose road/track car it doesn't make a lot of sense compared with a good high performance DOT 4. RBF660 is adequately cheap and has always given me great pedal feel compared with other popular DOT 4s I've used, and AP DOT 5.1 too.
Nevertheless, something else I noticed - outer bleed nipples were all much cleaner and freer than the inner ones. Does this suggest previous servicing has only used the outer nipples for bleeding? Is this common? Workshop manual says both, outer then inner at each caliper in the correct order so that's what I did.
I noticed the wheels are fitted with spacers - 12 mm on the rear I think, all good, and 5 mm on the front. On the front, this doesn't leave much hub for the wheel to sit on! This is something that might concern me for track use, but then it seems Porsche fitted some wheels with 5 mm spacers on these as OEM - so surely must be okay right? Anyone in the know here?
Oh yeah, nearside rear tyre had two massive screws in it too. I'll need to get that sorted
Few jobs done this weekend. New fuel cap first. Tether for the old one had rotted off, which annoyed me. Easy fix.
Then I set out to do the brake fluid. Maybe I made a bit of a meal of it, but it took a while as I went round the whole car ensuring all 8 bleed nipples loosened freely before I did anything else. And the back wheels only came off with a fight, figure they haven't been off for a while. Nevertheless, flushed through with fresh RBF660 which has made a huge change to the pedal. Lovely, firm and confidence inspiring.
It had DOT 5.1 in it previously going by service invoices from the specialist who looked after it. Wasn't impressed with it on my BMW, not impressed with it now. Especially with advised 6 monthly changes, for a road or dual purpose road/track car it doesn't make a lot of sense compared with a good high performance DOT 4. RBF660 is adequately cheap and has always given me great pedal feel compared with other popular DOT 4s I've used, and AP DOT 5.1 too.
Nevertheless, something else I noticed - outer bleed nipples were all much cleaner and freer than the inner ones. Does this suggest previous servicing has only used the outer nipples for bleeding? Is this common? Workshop manual says both, outer then inner at each caliper in the correct order so that's what I did.
I noticed the wheels are fitted with spacers - 12 mm on the rear I think, all good, and 5 mm on the front. On the front, this doesn't leave much hub for the wheel to sit on! This is something that might concern me for track use, but then it seems Porsche fitted some wheels with 5 mm spacers on these as OEM - so surely must be okay right? Anyone in the know here?
Oh yeah, nearside rear tyre had two massive screws in it too. I'll need to get that sorted
Edited by motorhole on Sunday 14th August 21:59
Long overdue update and a story of both success and failures...
October:
It began with tackling the rear discs and pads. Decided to do the nearside first, given that I would've expected most seizing of bolts etc to be more profound on that side as it probably receives most in the way of filth. It went perfectly. So I was all gee'd up for tackling the offside.
Second caliper bolt felt a bit gnarly as it wound out. Came out with a load of aluminium in the threads and part of a helicoil. Nice - thread previously stripped. Not only that, the helicoil repair had been drilled ever so slightly off square - which probably explained the aluminium in the threads at the end of the nut and the binding that caused the helicoil to partially back out. Repaired badly. So now I was stuck with a non-functional car on my drive...
Long story short, chucked it back together and stuck it in the garage until I could get an engineer out to sort it. Finally, a couple weeks later, I had it all back together. First drive out to bed in the brakes, lost gears some 10 miles from home. AA man came out, gear cable had popped off the gearbox so he managed to secure it to get me home, then it went into Ninemeister for some new cables. Drove way better when I got it back.
November:
Due to being away on holiday, family engagements and with work, didn't get much use out of the car. Faith in it very much shaken at this point.
December & January:
Much like November, but at least got out in it with the missus for a nice night away at my work's Christmas party. Also, after discovering an egg on the sidewall of my daily, it was forced into service for an overnight trip in the Pennines too. All good, and it was really nice to spend some time with it.
Also as I do intend to track the car, I picked up an oil pressure gauge with user-defined alarm function and used it to replace the sport chrono stopwatch. I used a remote take-off to put the sensor in the spare port at the back of the nearside cylinder head. It's rather tight in there! Getting everything in place and nipped up tight needed some ingenuity. Also - why did Porsche use steel fuel rails? The aluminium ones on the BMW M52 look like new after 20 years and 200k miles. Value engineering? Or does the steel have a functional benefit? Anyway, brought the loom through the bulkhead and looked for a switched 12v source (the sport chrono stop watch receives a permanent live, which is annoying as otherwise you'd jest need a plug adapter). After removing a few panels, I thought 'screw this' and put it all back together again. Yes, I've rewired an entire car before. But a stripped out saloon car is a rather different proposition to a compact, fully trimmed sports car. I decided to leave that bit to those who know what they're doing with these cars.
February:
When I'd bought the rear brake pad bits, I'd also bought all the bits to refresh the front suspension; coffin arms, drop links, top mounts, tuning forks. As well as new discs and Bluestuff pads. After that lot sitting in my garage while the weather was rubbish and fearing another stripped bolt saga, I caved and dropped the lot off at Ninemeister, and got them to wire in the gauge. With proper alignment and new parts on the front, it feels really fresh and tight. And the gauge has been done properly through the OEM fusebox with its own fuse. Clean as a factory installation.
So I did some miles! Best part of 200 miles since I got it back. Loving it.
So what's next? At 72k miles the AOS is probably overdue; even thought it seems to be functioning fine, allegedly track abuse can quickly kill an old one. So a new genuine AOS and lines have been ordered. Then time to get some laps in at Oulton I think and see how it deals under duress
October:
It began with tackling the rear discs and pads. Decided to do the nearside first, given that I would've expected most seizing of bolts etc to be more profound on that side as it probably receives most in the way of filth. It went perfectly. So I was all gee'd up for tackling the offside.
Second caliper bolt felt a bit gnarly as it wound out. Came out with a load of aluminium in the threads and part of a helicoil. Nice - thread previously stripped. Not only that, the helicoil repair had been drilled ever so slightly off square - which probably explained the aluminium in the threads at the end of the nut and the binding that caused the helicoil to partially back out. Repaired badly. So now I was stuck with a non-functional car on my drive...
Long story short, chucked it back together and stuck it in the garage until I could get an engineer out to sort it. Finally, a couple weeks later, I had it all back together. First drive out to bed in the brakes, lost gears some 10 miles from home. AA man came out, gear cable had popped off the gearbox so he managed to secure it to get me home, then it went into Ninemeister for some new cables. Drove way better when I got it back.
November:
Due to being away on holiday, family engagements and with work, didn't get much use out of the car. Faith in it very much shaken at this point.
December & January:
Much like November, but at least got out in it with the missus for a nice night away at my work's Christmas party. Also, after discovering an egg on the sidewall of my daily, it was forced into service for an overnight trip in the Pennines too. All good, and it was really nice to spend some time with it.
Also as I do intend to track the car, I picked up an oil pressure gauge with user-defined alarm function and used it to replace the sport chrono stopwatch. I used a remote take-off to put the sensor in the spare port at the back of the nearside cylinder head. It's rather tight in there! Getting everything in place and nipped up tight needed some ingenuity. Also - why did Porsche use steel fuel rails? The aluminium ones on the BMW M52 look like new after 20 years and 200k miles. Value engineering? Or does the steel have a functional benefit? Anyway, brought the loom through the bulkhead and looked for a switched 12v source (the sport chrono stop watch receives a permanent live, which is annoying as otherwise you'd jest need a plug adapter). After removing a few panels, I thought 'screw this' and put it all back together again. Yes, I've rewired an entire car before. But a stripped out saloon car is a rather different proposition to a compact, fully trimmed sports car. I decided to leave that bit to those who know what they're doing with these cars.
February:
When I'd bought the rear brake pad bits, I'd also bought all the bits to refresh the front suspension; coffin arms, drop links, top mounts, tuning forks. As well as new discs and Bluestuff pads. After that lot sitting in my garage while the weather was rubbish and fearing another stripped bolt saga, I caved and dropped the lot off at Ninemeister, and got them to wire in the gauge. With proper alignment and new parts on the front, it feels really fresh and tight. And the gauge has been done properly through the OEM fusebox with its own fuse. Clean as a factory installation.
So I did some miles! Best part of 200 miles since I got it back. Loving it.
So what's next? At 72k miles the AOS is probably overdue; even thought it seems to be functioning fine, allegedly track abuse can quickly kill an old one. So a new genuine AOS and lines have been ordered. Then time to get some laps in at Oulton I think and see how it deals under duress
phazed said:
Glad it is all coming together.
Just renewed my AOS on my 87K mile Boxster. as far as I am aware, I had the original one fitted.
When tracking, all well while driving, but after the car was parked up for half an hour on restart, lots of white smoke that disappears within a minute. Hence new AOS fitted and hopefully solves that problem.
Hope so! What flavour boxster do you have?Just renewed my AOS on my 87K mile Boxster. as far as I am aware, I had the original one fitted.
When tracking, all well while driving, but after the car was parked up for half an hour on restart, lots of white smoke that disappears within a minute. Hence new AOS fitted and hopefully solves that problem.
Replaced the AOS last weekend. Ended up being a pretty straightforward job, but ratcheting hose clip pliers make it so much easier. Then it was Oulton Park on 17th March. I took the father-in-law along for some laps too as he enjoyed his time out in the E30 last year (even if it did beat him up a bit!).
A day of many red flags (8 by lunchtime iirc and I think 12 by close of play? Very unusual for Oulton Park). Track was damp to start out, but quickly dried out giving me the chance to get a feel for things. Without going into too much detail - car was great, plenty grip, brakes, reasonably quick. But I just couldn't get on it...why? The oil pressue gauge scared the cr*p out of me. It was dropping to 10 psi round some of the bends and I didn't even feel like I was pushing that hard...
Lodge was the worst, probably followed by the first right into Knickerbrook complex. But if I tried getting on it, I saw it drop pretty much everywhere except Cascades & Island. Holy oil surge batman! So I capped my entry and apex speeds for most of the day. Yes I know lot's of folk have tracked them and not had issues - but no gauge, no awareness of the problem. Treat an engine to repeated events like that and it's only a matter of time before a bearing catches and spins. It's a little disappointing given I was only on OEM sized PS4S, but I'll sort the issue with an aftermarket sump and a 50-weight oil before I go pushing the boundaries.
Still, I got what I wanted from it - car was super easy to drive quickly and never missed a beat. It was also a lot more economical on track than the E30 - an unexpected positive - and I wasn't dreading the drive home through Warrington's awful stop-start traffic either
Some (slow!) video footage:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRjvYnPFHHY
A day of many red flags (8 by lunchtime iirc and I think 12 by close of play? Very unusual for Oulton Park). Track was damp to start out, but quickly dried out giving me the chance to get a feel for things. Without going into too much detail - car was great, plenty grip, brakes, reasonably quick. But I just couldn't get on it...why? The oil pressue gauge scared the cr*p out of me. It was dropping to 10 psi round some of the bends and I didn't even feel like I was pushing that hard...
Lodge was the worst, probably followed by the first right into Knickerbrook complex. But if I tried getting on it, I saw it drop pretty much everywhere except Cascades & Island. Holy oil surge batman! So I capped my entry and apex speeds for most of the day. Yes I know lot's of folk have tracked them and not had issues - but no gauge, no awareness of the problem. Treat an engine to repeated events like that and it's only a matter of time before a bearing catches and spins. It's a little disappointing given I was only on OEM sized PS4S, but I'll sort the issue with an aftermarket sump and a 50-weight oil before I go pushing the boundaries.
Still, I got what I wanted from it - car was super easy to drive quickly and never missed a beat. It was also a lot more economical on track than the E30 - an unexpected positive - and I wasn't dreading the drive home through Warrington's awful stop-start traffic either
Some (slow!) video footage:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRjvYnPFHHY
phazed said:
I run a Millers 10/50 Motorsport oil in my 987.1 and run Triple 8’s on it.
Never had any oil pressure issues, but there again I haven’t got a gauge! Your experience is a bit worrying.
Have contemplated the extended baffled sump so maybe I should bite the bullet.
By comparison, on my track ready 1.8T Octávia, I fitted a baffled sump before tracking it and have done a dozen track days per year in the last two years without missing a beat, so hopefully it is doing its job! Just to say with the Octávia, it is driven flat out all the time on triple 8’s.
Shame you can't read the gauge in the videos!Never had any oil pressure issues, but there again I haven’t got a gauge! Your experience is a bit worrying.
Have contemplated the extended baffled sump so maybe I should bite the bullet.
By comparison, on my track ready 1.8T Octávia, I fitted a baffled sump before tracking it and have done a dozen track days per year in the last two years without missing a beat, so hopefully it is doing its job! Just to say with the Octávia, it is driven flat out all the time on triple 8’s.
Yeah I saw surge in my E30 too, mostly under hard braking. In that though, aftermarket baffles for the E34 sump (used on an E30 when using the later 24v engines) looked like they'd do nothing for braking. So I designed & made my own and it worked perfectly when driven hard on track rubber, braking, cornering the lot. Oil management looks like a rather more complicated subject in a flat engine though. And I think the heavier weight oil makes a difference as pressure drops definitely got larger after the first couple laps when the oil was hotter and less viscous. So the 10W50 is a good shout
conanius said:
Thought I'd give this a nudge as I want to do track days in my 987.1 Cayman S I've just picked up.
My shopping list was going to be:
- Low Temp Thermostat
- Centre Radiator kit - As I intend to fit zunsport grills
- TRW PMN166 Master Cylinder (997 GT3 part)
- Millers 10w50 CFS NT+ Oil Change
- Bigger Baffled Sump
I've put links above to the cheapest places I've found for the above, but interested how you've got on. My car was borescope clear for any scoring when I got it a few weeks ago and I want to keep it that way ! (just over 70k miles).
I've found a few people who say the centre radiator makes a significant difference over just the low temp thermostat, and kept the oil temperatures below 100 on track, which I guess will obviously help pressure.
I'm a bit torn on what sump to go for - did you ever change yours?
Another long overdue update and an opportunity to answer your question! I went with the Hartech deep sump. It is certainly not the cheapest, but the reason for my decision were the various data traces from the US from 986 race cars on slicks demonstrating its effectiveness. I've done two trackdays since fitting it and the oil pressure gauge has not alarmed on either (32 psi). Clearly a decent bit of kit. My shopping list was going to be:
- Low Temp Thermostat
- Centre Radiator kit - As I intend to fit zunsport grills
- TRW PMN166 Master Cylinder (997 GT3 part)
- Millers 10w50 CFS NT+ Oil Change
- Bigger Baffled Sump
I've put links above to the cheapest places I've found for the above, but interested how you've got on. My car was borescope clear for any scoring when I got it a few weeks ago and I want to keep it that way ! (just over 70k miles).
I've found a few people who say the centre radiator makes a significant difference over just the low temp thermostat, and kept the oil temperatures below 100 on track, which I guess will obviously help pressure.
I'm a bit torn on what sump to go for - did you ever change yours?
Unlike yours, a borsecope revealed some scoring in 4, 5 and 6 on mine with 6 being the worst (typical). Other than some oil usage, there are no symptoms as yet but I intend to use this as an opportunity for a 3.7 or 3.9 build, perhaps over winter.
I also have more upgrades inbound. A set of KW v3s, adjustable rear toe control arms and a GT3 master cylinder. Hopefully get all of these fitted this month. I'm going down to some lightweight 18" wheels too to reduce unsprung weight, offset some of the harshness of the coilovers with additional sidewall and to reduce tyre costs. After that, a couple of Scotland trips and a couple more trackdays in order I think before the rebuild!
Some video from last time out at Oulton. Yes, it was quiet. Road car only trackdays are the way forward here. MSV run a few a year and in my experience, for all the moaning on here about race cars on trackdays, nobody turns up to the road car days. So lots of clear track and a free garage for those who do
Almost felt like a private day. Enjoy.https://youtu.be/51GhoLrx9hQ?si=pUiS5wM8j0oA6FHP
https://youtu.be/jANSTC2cJWY?si=WfLlYmoRdcP_h-xC
and31 said:
Shame that you’ve suffered scoring -how bad is the oil consumption?
A Hartech 3.9 will be very nice
My Cayman S was on 65,000 odd and no issues I knew of,oil consumption was negligible,unfortunately it was written off late last year.
I’ve gone back to my roots and bought an old mini
I did love my Porsche though-I spent a lot of time and money rebuilding the suspension and lowering it,did it all myself,and learnt a lot in the process.I’ll have another at some point!
Looks stunning that! Definitely need to get a paint correction and professional detail done on mine at some point...A Hartech 3.9 will be very nice
My Cayman S was on 65,000 odd and no issues I knew of,oil consumption was negligible,unfortunately it was written off late last year.
I’ve gone back to my roots and bought an old mini
I did love my Porsche though-I spent a lot of time and money rebuilding the suspension and lowering it,did it all myself,and learnt a lot in the process.I’ll have another at some point!
Edited by and31 on Saturday 4th May 18:19
My main concern with a 3.9 is the additional crank cost - circa £2k for a decent used one (if one can be found) or £4k new from Porsche as a huge chunk of cost on top of the rebuild cost. Not a problem if it turns out a crank is needed anyway, but in most cases that don't concern main/big end or IMS bearing failure, it's not. Plus in principle, a 3.7 should be more rev happy. Will need to start asking around for services offered.
conanius said:
Thanks for the really useful reply. I've got my centre radiator kit and just need to get it and other parts fitted.
Obvious answer inbound I'm sure, did you get the deep sump from Hartech direct? Do you mind saying how much it was?
Yeah, only available via Hartech or Slakker Racing in the US. I took it to them for the borescope and got it fitted whilst there. Iirc about £1700 fitted with oil, filter etc? Obvious answer inbound I'm sure, did you get the deep sump from Hartech direct? Do you mind saying how much it was?
In other news, my fun day out may have killed the offside cat. Exhaust has started rattling from cold - its quite loud too but goes away when warmed up. I tracked down various rusty clamps, some loose, some loose heat shield material and fixed/replaced the lot. But it still rattles when cold. Hammer test seems to indicate the offside cat. This might mean bringing the build forward because I wanted to fit sports manifolds when the engine was done anyway but don't really want to pay the labour twice!
This is the thread re. oil pressure monitoring data:
https://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum/1251933-oil-...
Huge thread, but post 1429 shows a comprehensive data trace from the Hartech sump. Other deep sump options also tested
https://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum/1251933-oil-...
Huge thread, but post 1429 shows a comprehensive data trace from the Hartech sump. Other deep sump options also tested
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