Potholes - Porsche Driver Killed
Discussion
FMOB said:
That is awful.
I hope the Police can find clear evidence that the presence of the pothole was the root cause of the incident and the Council gets prosecuted for manslaughter.
When has a council or its members ever been done for anything dodgy?I hope the Police can find clear evidence that the presence of the pothole was the root cause of the incident and the Council gets prosecuted for manslaughter.
The way they all carry on is ridiculous!
FMOB said:
Why can't the Council prosecuted?
Had the Council been issued with a Section 56 notice which they failed to action? Who exactly would you prosecute? The Chief Executive, The Councillors maybe or perhaps the department that deals with road maintenance.
The existence of the pothole is not evidence in itself without evidence that the driver was driving at an appropriate speed and with due care and attention.
Nomme de Plum said:
FMOB said:
That is awful.
I hope the Police can find clear evidence that the presence of the pothole was the root cause of the incident and the Council gets prosecuted for manslaughter.
A rather silly suggestion. A council cannot be prosecuted for manslaughter nor can the government who have underfunded authorities or even the tax payers who clearly do not contribute enough to make the whole system function correctlyI hope the Police can find clear evidence that the presence of the pothole was the root cause of the incident and the Council gets prosecuted for manslaughter.
There is only one person responsible and unfortunately he has died.
Had the driver been travelling at an appropriate speed he would not have lost control and created so much damage. At least there were no other fatalities.
BTW Taxes including VED are not hypothecated.
Or do you know differently? If so, please post the link.
Nomme de Plum said:
FMOB said:
Why can't the Council prosecuted?
Had the Council been issued with a Section 56 notice which they failed to action? Who exactly would you prosecute? The Chief Executive, The Councillors maybe or perhaps the department that deals with road maintenance.
The existence of the pothole is not evidence in itself without evidence that the driver was driving at an appropriate speed and with due care and attention.
And as I said, if the Police can build a case.
Potholes are a scourge on our roads, everyone who can do something wrings their hands and nothing changes. If that pothole with raised iron work were not there I strongly doubt any incident would have occured. Did the Council drop the speed limit, put up signs warning of the pothole or just stick it on a list somewhere and let someone drive up to 60mph with a hidden catastrophie waiting up the road.
Where do you draw the line? Someone is dead.
911Spanker said:
Nomme de Plum said:
FMOB said:
That is awful.
I hope the Police can find clear evidence that the presence of the pothole was the root cause of the incident and the Council gets prosecuted for manslaughter.
A rather silly suggestion. A council cannot be prosecuted for manslaughter nor can the government who have underfunded authorities or even the tax payers who clearly do not contribute enough to make the whole system function correctlyI hope the Police can find clear evidence that the presence of the pothole was the root cause of the incident and the Council gets prosecuted for manslaughter.
There is only one person responsible and unfortunately he has died.
Had the driver been travelling at an appropriate speed he would not have lost control and created so much damage. At least there were no other fatalities.
BTW Taxes including VED are not hypothecated.
Or do you know differently? If so, please post the link.
One could assume that this pothole may have caused many similar incidents albeit not fatal. Is this the case.
It is unfortunate that our economy is not in a great place so councils have other priorities on which to spend scant resource. Many people suffer and some die due to lack of resource.
PH seems to attract a few posters who like to point the finger. It is rarely so black and white in real life.
911Spanker said:
I thought it was found that excess speed was not a factor?
Or do you know differently? If so, please post the link.
The paper reported that it was believed not to be a factor yet the police appeal is asking for people in the area to supply CCTV footage which I assume is to see what the driving was like in the lead up to the incident. Or do you know differently? If so, please post the link.
FMOB said:
It is obvious you start at the top i.e. the Chief Executive but your statement implies some form of blanket immunity which I do not believe they have.
And as I said, if the Police can build a case.
Potholes are a scourge on our roads, everyone who can do something wrings their hands and nothing changes. If that pothole with raised iron work were not there I strongly doubt any incident would have occured. Did the Council drop the speed limit, put up signs warning of the pothole or just stick it on a list somewhere and let someone drive up to 60mph with a hidden catastrophie waiting up the road.
Where do you draw the line? Someone is dead.
It could be argued that the elected councillors are the top or even the electorate that empowered them. The CE is just an employee. And as I said, if the Police can build a case.
Potholes are a scourge on our roads, everyone who can do something wrings their hands and nothing changes. If that pothole with raised iron work were not there I strongly doubt any incident would have occured. Did the Council drop the speed limit, put up signs warning of the pothole or just stick it on a list somewhere and let someone drive up to 60mph with a hidden catastrophie waiting up the road.
Where do you draw the line? Someone is dead.
I mentioned the section 56 for a reason. Did the council even know of the current state of this section of road? If no, how would they find out, except from the public?
Are you content to pay much more to fund public services adequately?
Edited by Nomme de Plum on Sunday 5th May 15:12
FMOB said:
It is obvious you start at the top i.e. the Chief Executive but your statement implies some form of blanket immunity which I do not believe they have.
And as I said, if the Police can build a case.
Potholes are a scourge on our roads, everyone who can do something wrings their hands and nothing changes. If that pothole with raised iron work were not there I strongly doubt any incident would have occured. Did the Council drop the speed limit, put up signs warning of the pothole or just stick it on a list somewhere and let someone drive up to 60mph with a hidden catastrophie waiting up the road.
Where do you draw the line? Someone is dead.
Other sources report that avoiding the pothole is one of the theories the Police are investigating.And as I said, if the Police can build a case.
Potholes are a scourge on our roads, everyone who can do something wrings their hands and nothing changes. If that pothole with raised iron work were not there I strongly doubt any incident would have occured. Did the Council drop the speed limit, put up signs warning of the pothole or just stick it on a list somewhere and let someone drive up to 60mph with a hidden catastrophie waiting up the road.
Where do you draw the line? Someone is dead.
Locals also quoted saying 'everyone speeds down that hill'.
Daily Telegraph states 'speed not believed to be a factor' I think, can't see behind paywall.
Possibly jumping the gun to state conclusively that the pothole caused the crash and the council are to blame.
What we do know is a GT2 can stop from 60 mph in 30 metres in dry conditions.
I don't think that clipping an oncoming car (especially in a LHD car) is something you can lay squarely at the feet of the council, it appears the driver had some choices at his disposal, including slowing down and going over the pothole, swerving left of it, if indeed it's the raised ironwork one and if indeed he was trying to avoid it.
There were 4 cars involved in total, we can't be sure he wasn't looking to overtake and clipped the BMW.
Other report say he was driving to a track day at Goodwood at 7:30 am on Monday morning, which was quite chilly if I recall.
Did the back step out on cold track day tyres?
There are way too many variable here to be certain the council is to blame.
Nomme de Plum said:
Are you content to pay much more to fund public services adequately?
Edited by Nomme de Plum on Sunday 5th May 15:12
I do wonder if referring to them as potholes is somewhat undermining things. The article briefly refers to it as a crater, which while going a little other way, might make a difference. It's one thing thinking of a road with a few potholes, which typically are small, against thinking of one with craters... which usually are much bigger.
The reality is where now verging on craters, especially when what was quite small takes so long to be addressed, that it further disintegrates.
The whole thing is a shambles, and as possibly in this case a dangerous one. I doubt anything much will change as it's all embedded in council mindsets, procedures and policies.
The reality is where now verging on craters, especially when what was quite small takes so long to be addressed, that it further disintegrates.
The whole thing is a shambles, and as possibly in this case a dangerous one. I doubt anything much will change as it's all embedded in council mindsets, procedures and policies.
georgeyboy12345 said:
This is what you get when you vote conservative, who cut funding on everything like this while still raising taxes even though they say they won’t. The roads were never this bad pre 2010.
An alternative theory is that climate change is f
king the roads up like everything else outdoors.Not even going to start to suggest what's behind that though.
Nomme de Plum said:
FMOB said:
It is obvious you start at the top i.e. the Chief Executive but your statement implies some form of blanket immunity which I do not believe they have.
And as I said, if the Police can build a case.
Potholes are a scourge on our roads, everyone who can do something wrings their hands and nothing changes. If that pothole with raised iron work were not there I strongly doubt any incident would have occured. Did the Council drop the speed limit, put up signs warning of the pothole or just stick it on a list somewhere and let someone drive up to 60mph with a hidden catastrophie waiting up the road.
Where do you draw the line? Someone is dead.
It could be argued that the elected councillors are the top or even the electorate that empowered them. The CE is just an employee. And as I said, if the Police can build a case.
Potholes are a scourge on our roads, everyone who can do something wrings their hands and nothing changes. If that pothole with raised iron work were not there I strongly doubt any incident would have occured. Did the Council drop the speed limit, put up signs warning of the pothole or just stick it on a list somewhere and let someone drive up to 60mph with a hidden catastrophie waiting up the road.
Where do you draw the line? Someone is dead.
I mentioned the section 56 for a reason. Did the council even know of the current state of this section of road? If no, how would they find out, except from the public?
Are you content to pay much more to fund public services adequately?
Edited by Nomme de Plum on Sunday 5th May 15:12
The CE has responsibility for running the day to day operations of the council.
RE: funding would you pay more?
Total lack of any kind of maintenance by the council.
I report potholes frequently and normally get the copy/paste response of "our inspector found the surface to be within the standard contained in the highway manual". No further action to be taken.
I only report potholes that are deep enough and large enough.
Its absolutely scandalous.
If they do deem it's big enough to fix a man comes round with a pot of hot black porridge and put it in the hole with no prep. It's back out again a few days later.
Or we get spray paint round the hole and nothing else done to it.
I dive the 4x4 98% of the time now. It's not safe to use the nice cars.
I report potholes frequently and normally get the copy/paste response of "our inspector found the surface to be within the standard contained in the highway manual". No further action to be taken.
I only report potholes that are deep enough and large enough.
Its absolutely scandalous.
If they do deem it's big enough to fix a man comes round with a pot of hot black porridge and put it in the hole with no prep. It's back out again a few days later.
Or we get spray paint round the hole and nothing else done to it.
I dive the 4x4 98% of the time now. It's not safe to use the nice cars.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff