2001 Honda Insight ZE1 - Citrus Yellow
Discussion
Blackpuddin said:
Ran one of these for a few months when they first came out. I loved the 'concept car' feel and basically everything about it except for the hard suspension which reduced grip on a bumpy road to a pretty low level. Would have another one any day though.
Jonny Smith mentioned a suspension mod for Insights on his Late Brake Show fleet roundup video a few weeks ago, I think it was new shocks and Daewoo Matiz springs.
A common issue with the ZE1 is 'wet seatbelt syndrome', often accompanied by other leaks and damp in the cabin. Luckily, the community have several decent youtube and forum guides on how to deal with this, and Honda supply all the clips required to refit the trim. I have been tooling around now for a few thousand miles and the damp seats, and especially the prospect of a diagonal soaking actually means I can't wear 'nice' cloths, and my wife (truly a patient lady) has asked if we could find a seat liner...
Not so great dripping onto my lovely new battery pack...
r
The overarching issue is failed bonding around the door trim and roof clips, as well as dry/cracked Hondabond (no, really) in the roof gutter.
There are 11 fasteners on each side for the door trim:
1. A 10mm bolt visible in above the hinge.
2. A 'button' round fastener by the wiper/scuttle - this is a slot and did not break/does not need to be bought.
3. Seven standard pillar clips - 91503-S3Y-003.
4. One 'locator' pillar clip - 91511-S3Y-003 - simialr to 3 but with an additional clippy bit thing widgit bit (Japanese translation).
5. One 'Square clip' - the primary suspect in most leaks - this didnt break on my removal and rarely seems to on the forums.
Plus a load of metal clips. This is a well fastned piece of trim.
Items 3. and 4. need to be bought from Honda - £55 for 16 clips in total - they break on removal.
In addition, there is a small 3 in piece of trim in the gutter to the boot - I decided to do them all on the same day. In addition to a good knife, rubber mallet, normal trim tools and coffee you will need some 3M double sided adhesive to reattach the rear 3in trim bit, plus a cylinder of your favourite sealant. I chose OB1 as it seems tough, I couldn't buy Hondabond and its held up being waterproof elsewhere in my life.
First up, masking worthy of Kubrick:
Then a stanley knife, on full extension, slips underneath and down the underside, with a rubber mallet to cut the 8 clips... This is hard to photo, just imagine these tools and hands in the right place. I also undid the 10mm bolt.
Lower plastic clips done, the top square clip can be gently teased out ("Careful now, Dougal")
Next a tricky bit - the upper metal clips, which need to be teased apart to release the trim - I used a small pair of pliers with a curved end (for hose clamps).
Once all out, it should just be the front 'button' which can be released by moving the trim towards the rear of the car. Phew.
Mmmm... lovely. A good clean up and removal of the clip corpses from the battefield.
Rear trim was a combination of screwdrivers and trim removal tools to remove, with patience...
Here's the 'locator' clip with its extra slot.
Some gently prodding at cracks revealed large holes in the bonding.
Also at the rear of the gutter:
Much scrape-age and cleanage later, this is the 3M tape I used for the two rear trim metal clips:
Test fit. Key is to have the clips high enough to retain a channel for the water to run out below. Like a stream eroding a canyon.
Expensive clips in and ready.
OB1 clear sealant perhaps isnt the easiest to see, but careful application to all joins, crack and holes, especially around the 'square clip' and also around the hole for each trim clip.
Done!
Bolt back in, masking off - exterior unchanged, it all clipped back correctly - now the test of the next serious British February to see if I have sealed it correctly.
Oh. The other side. Well... that will have to be another day.
Not so great dripping onto my lovely new battery pack...
rThe overarching issue is failed bonding around the door trim and roof clips, as well as dry/cracked Hondabond (no, really) in the roof gutter.
There are 11 fasteners on each side for the door trim:
1. A 10mm bolt visible in above the hinge.
2. A 'button' round fastener by the wiper/scuttle - this is a slot and did not break/does not need to be bought.
3. Seven standard pillar clips - 91503-S3Y-003.
4. One 'locator' pillar clip - 91511-S3Y-003 - simialr to 3 but with an additional clippy bit thing widgit bit (Japanese translation).
5. One 'Square clip' - the primary suspect in most leaks - this didnt break on my removal and rarely seems to on the forums.
Plus a load of metal clips. This is a well fastned piece of trim.
Items 3. and 4. need to be bought from Honda - £55 for 16 clips in total - they break on removal.
In addition, there is a small 3 in piece of trim in the gutter to the boot - I decided to do them all on the same day. In addition to a good knife, rubber mallet, normal trim tools and coffee you will need some 3M double sided adhesive to reattach the rear 3in trim bit, plus a cylinder of your favourite sealant. I chose OB1 as it seems tough, I couldn't buy Hondabond and its held up being waterproof elsewhere in my life.
First up, masking worthy of Kubrick:
Then a stanley knife, on full extension, slips underneath and down the underside, with a rubber mallet to cut the 8 clips... This is hard to photo, just imagine these tools and hands in the right place. I also undid the 10mm bolt.
Lower plastic clips done, the top square clip can be gently teased out ("Careful now, Dougal")
Next a tricky bit - the upper metal clips, which need to be teased apart to release the trim - I used a small pair of pliers with a curved end (for hose clamps).
Once all out, it should just be the front 'button' which can be released by moving the trim towards the rear of the car. Phew.
Mmmm... lovely. A good clean up and removal of the clip corpses from the battefield.
Rear trim was a combination of screwdrivers and trim removal tools to remove, with patience...
Here's the 'locator' clip with its extra slot.
Some gently prodding at cracks revealed large holes in the bonding.
Also at the rear of the gutter:
Much scrape-age and cleanage later, this is the 3M tape I used for the two rear trim metal clips:
Test fit. Key is to have the clips high enough to retain a channel for the water to run out below. Like a stream eroding a canyon.
Expensive clips in and ready.
OB1 clear sealant perhaps isnt the easiest to see, but careful application to all joins, crack and holes, especially around the 'square clip' and also around the hole for each trim clip.
Done!
Bolt back in, masking off - exterior unchanged, it all clipped back correctly - now the test of the next serious British February to see if I have sealed it correctly.
Oh. The other side. Well... that will have to be another day.
Spinakerr said:
Some gently prodding at cracks revealed large holes in the bonding.
<snip>
Bolt back in, masking off - exterior unchanged, it all clipped back correctly - now the test of the next serious British February to see if I have sealed it correctly.
Oh. The other side. Well... that will have to be another day.
Is the hole a result of rust taking hold or where bonding was bridging when it was built?<snip>
Bolt back in, masking off - exterior unchanged, it all clipped back correctly - now the test of the next serious British February to see if I have sealed it correctly.
Oh. The other side. Well... that will have to be another day.
Nice work - good luck with the other side
Good work, it is a faff. I had to redo mine after Autoglass changed the screen and made a right pigs ear of it and only refitted every other clip! I didn’t remove the metal strips like you so bravo. No rust, it’s all aluminium. Just confirms the borderline prototype nature of the car.
Thanks all - appreciate the well-wishes and yes it was the normal combination of annoying, fiddly and satisfying you would expect!
Today we used the Insight for a central London trip - front left tyre was strangely down to 20psi so pumped it up (will keep an eye on that...) and it sat out in the rain, plus there was a good deluge overnight. There is no (fresh) water on the driver's side.
We may have a success - passenger side to follow, but historically the right was far, far worse.
If this all goes to plan I'm then taking out the interior for a proper dry and deep clean, then sorting the fuel pump sender. And hopefully the seatbelt modules can be dried out fully and I can somehow reset the system...
Today we used the Insight for a central London trip - front left tyre was strangely down to 20psi so pumped it up (will keep an eye on that...) and it sat out in the rain, plus there was a good deluge overnight. There is no (fresh) water on the driver's side.
We may have a success - passenger side to follow, but historically the right was far, far worse.
If this all goes to plan I'm then taking out the interior for a proper dry and deep clean, then sorting the fuel pump sender. And hopefully the seatbelt modules can be dried out fully and I can somehow reset the system...
Seems to be a bit of an issue that effected other Hondas as well. Had an issue with a mk6 Accord which i couldn't trace, until i looked at the roof guttering and saw a rather large crack in the bonding material. Once that was sealed up, the car stayed dry!
But great detail and effort as ever!
But great detail and effort as ever!
ajprice said:
Surely that is mostly pointless. The kamm-back or "K-Tail" design if done properly has minimal increased drag over a full tear drop. Marginal gains and all that I guess! Though he's added extra weight.
You see this design feature on a lot of eco cars like the Prius and Ioniq to name two. Its a pretty old solution, I think discovered in the 1920s or 30s!
I've often wondered with a bit of skill and space how retro-moddable these are. From the intervening years since manufactured you could prob get some lighter wheels, updated batteries, a bit lighter interior.... and then have some real spec creep!
The geek in me loves the idea of turning what was already a piece of brilliant Honda engineering up to 11.
The geek in me loves the idea of turning what was already a piece of brilliant Honda engineering up to 11.
firemunki said:
I've often wondered with a bit of skill and space how retro-moddable these are. From the intervening years since manufactured you could prob get some lighter wheels, updated batteries, a bit lighter interior.... and then have some real spec creep!
The geek in me loves the idea of turning what was already a piece of brilliant Honda engineering up to 11.
Get yourself onto Insightcentral.net it's all been/being done. The geek in me loves the idea of turning what was already a piece of brilliant Honda engineering up to 11.
...and the other side is done. Another 100 miles and all weather conditions - so far - dry as a Stewart Lee set.
Before declippage:
During, with similar amounts of detritus pouring into the cabin.
The left side was not at bad as the right, but I had a good poke to dislodge any loose hondabond and pre-empt havign to revisit this...
Then it was time to give the Insight a proper wash for the first time this year at a friend's house. WIth the sun shinign it felt more like summer at 15 degrees - perfect car washing weather.
The D-ZUS fasteners for the spats made it wonderfully easy to remove them and dislodge the grime.
The colour really comes alive in the sun. Roll on summer!
Before declippage:
During, with similar amounts of detritus pouring into the cabin.
The left side was not at bad as the right, but I had a good poke to dislodge any loose hondabond and pre-empt havign to revisit this...
Then it was time to give the Insight a proper wash for the first time this year at a friend's house. WIth the sun shinign it felt more like summer at 15 degrees - perfect car washing weather.
The D-ZUS fasteners for the spats made it wonderfully easy to remove them and dislodge the grime.
The colour really comes alive in the sun. Roll on summer!
B'stard Child said:
Excellent work - hopefully dry for the forseable
Any plans to refurb the wheels??
I know the paintwork is a little faded in places but to me refurbed wheels make such a difference
They certainly do, eventually, but there's plenty of maintenance and fixes left to do on this and other cars. Any plans to refurb the wheels??
I know the paintwork is a little faded in places but to me refurbed wheels make such a difference
Finding someone in the UK who can replicate the correct finish and also match the (fragile) centre caps is proving a challenge. Recommendations welcome.
Om said:
That looks great in the sun. Fantastic colour.
The photos flatter the fading and miles, but yes the sun transforms it. Next up - some minor paint tidying and black trim rejuvination.Gassing Station | Readers' Cars | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff