Late 997 or early 991
Discussion
As per the title, if you were to choose between a late 997.2 base Carrera PDK or an early 991.1 Carrera PDK , both coupe , which would you choose & why.
I’m coming from a 996.1 manual coupe, but I’d be looking to use the newer car a bit more daily.
I’m coming from a 996.1 manual coupe, but I’d be looking to use the newer car a bit more daily.
Edited by jonny996 on Saturday 18th May 10:51
jonny996 said:
As per the title, if you were to choose between a late 997.2 base Carrera PDK or an early 991.1 Carrera PDK , both coupe , which would you choose & why.
I’m coming from a 996.1 manual coupe, but I’d be looking to use the newer car a bit more daily.
Got to be the 991.1 all day. Just bought one last October. Lighter than the 997 with more space, no risk of IMS bearing issues, faster, louder engine wail thanks to the refined sports exhaust, wider track at the front so no more bobbing at the front at higher speeds and prettier (very subjective), and significantly improved interior compared to the 997. Basically the 991 is the last of the NA engines in the carrera model range. I’m coming from a 996.1 manual coupe, but I’d be looking to use the newer car a bit more daily.
Edited by jonny996 on Saturday 18th May 10:51
People like to complain about the move to EPAS. Here is the reality....the vast majority of Porsche drivers do not have a racing pedigree and will not track their cars so what they are in reality doing is parroting what motor journalists say. I have come from a Mercedes SL 63 with 600HP. The 991.1 is more capable, obviously better handling and surprisingly much better suspension damping than the SL (that really shocked me). As an all rounder the 991 is fantastic.
FrancisA said:
Got to be the 991.1 all day. Just bought one last October. Lighter than the 997 with more space, no risk of IMS bearing issues, faster, louder engine wail thanks to the refined sports exhaust, wider track at the front so no more bobbing at the front at higher speeds and prettier (very subjective), and significantly improved interior compared to the 997. Basically the 991 is the last of the NA engines in the carrera model range.
People like to complain about the move to EPAS. Here is the reality....the vast majority of Porsche drivers do not have a racing pedigree and will not track their cars so what they are in reality doing is parroting what motor journalists say. I have come from a Mercedes SL 63 with 600HP. The 991.1 is more capable, obviously better handling and surprisingly much better suspension damping than the SL (that really shocked me). As an all rounder the 991 is fantastic.
The irony is strong with this one …People like to complain about the move to EPAS. Here is the reality....the vast majority of Porsche drivers do not have a racing pedigree and will not track their cars so what they are in reality doing is parroting what motor journalists say. I have come from a Mercedes SL 63 with 600HP. The 991.1 is more capable, obviously better handling and surprisingly much better suspension damping than the SL (that really shocked me). As an all rounder the 991 is fantastic.
The 991.1 EPAS was sub-optimal, that’s why Porsche refined and evolved it into something considerably closer to a hydraulic system in feel…
OP, suggest you drive both and decide for yourself, rather than relying on the biased opinions from strangers on the internet.
And whilst I hate to bring this back to values, a manual 997.2 will retain considerably more of its value than any 991.1 manual or PDK in years to come.
Slippydiff said:
FrancisA said:
Got to be the 991.1 all day. Just bought one last October. Lighter than the 997 with more space, no risk of IMS bearing issues, faster, louder engine wail thanks to the refined sports exhaust, wider track at the front so no more bobbing at the front at higher speeds and prettier (very subjective), and significantly improved interior compared to the 997. Basically the 991 is the last of the NA engines in the carrera model range.
People like to complain about the move to EPAS. Here is the reality....the vast majority of Porsche drivers do not have a racing pedigree and will not track their cars so what they are in reality doing is parroting what motor journalists say. I have come from a Mercedes SL 63 with 600HP. The 991.1 is more capable, obviously better handling and surprisingly much better suspension damping than the SL (that really shocked me). As an all rounder the 991 is fantastic.
The irony is strong with this one …People like to complain about the move to EPAS. Here is the reality....the vast majority of Porsche drivers do not have a racing pedigree and will not track their cars so what they are in reality doing is parroting what motor journalists say. I have come from a Mercedes SL 63 with 600HP. The 991.1 is more capable, obviously better handling and surprisingly much better suspension damping than the SL (that really shocked me). As an all rounder the 991 is fantastic.
The 991.1 EPAS was sub-optimal, that’s why Porsche refined and evolved it into something considerably closer to a hydraulic system in feel…
OP, suggest you drive both and decide for yourself, rather than relying on the biased opinions from strangers on the internet.
And whilst I hate to bring this back to values, a manual 997.2 will retain considerably more of its value than any 991.1 manual or PDK in years to come.
SlippyDiff is right - you have to drive them and decide for yourself....just like I did and chose the 991.
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/1281913-modifying-...
On another PH thread, someone with a 981 had it done at GT One.
On another PH thread, someone with a 981 had it done at GT One.
When you drive them both, you will find they are significantly different cars.
991 is still a 911, but it's more refined (quieter, more relaxed PDK gearbox), rides better and feels more solid. It is a sports car, but is more of a GT and can do decent miles/daily dives very well. The tech had moved on a lot so it's just a more modern place to sit.
997 is a more raw experience, even in base Carrera trim. You'll find it a little noisier, suspension is decent but more firm and it just needs a bit more effort from the heavier steering. It's from an era when cars were more about the driving experience and less about NVH considerations.
Tough one as a daily, I chose a 997 because I don't drive it every day, but as a 1-2 times a week car i'd go for the 997 every day.
991 is still a 911, but it's more refined (quieter, more relaxed PDK gearbox), rides better and feels more solid. It is a sports car, but is more of a GT and can do decent miles/daily dives very well. The tech had moved on a lot so it's just a more modern place to sit.
997 is a more raw experience, even in base Carrera trim. You'll find it a little noisier, suspension is decent but more firm and it just needs a bit more effort from the heavier steering. It's from an era when cars were more about the driving experience and less about NVH considerations.
Tough one as a daily, I chose a 997 because I don't drive it every day, but as a 1-2 times a week car i'd go for the 997 every day.
jonny996 said:
As per the title, if you were to choose between a late 997.2 base Carrera PDK or an early 991.1 Carrera PDK , both coupe , which would you choose & why.
I’m coming from a 996.1 manual coupe, but I’d be looking to use the newer car a bit more daily.
drive both, depending on where you are there's probably a specialist - Ashgoods, 911V, JZM, Criffords or such with both - 991 PDK better than 997. I have a 997GTS manual so not a comparison, but the on-the-road footprint is smaller and feels it. It is less refined. more analog. weight diff on coupe is minimal and slightly in favour of the 997, but you'd never know on the road. I’m coming from a 996.1 manual coupe, but I’d be looking to use the newer car a bit more daily.
Edited by jonny996 on Saturday 18th May 10:51
You may want familarity in feel - if so the 997 is more likely your choice, or you may want a bigger sense of difference and the 991 will definitely achieve that. Both great choices either way
For comparison, directly from Porsche press releases:
2009 997.2 Carrera S Coupe:
Length: 175.83 inches
Width: 71.2 inches
Height: 51.18 inches
Weight: 3.208 lbs. (with PDK)
2012 991.1 Carrera S Coupe:
Length: 176.81 inches
Width: 71.18 inches
Height: 50.98 inches
Weight: 3,120 lbs. (with PDK)
991 is lighter and smaller (less height and marginally narrower, albeit longer by an inch).
2009 997.2 Carrera S Coupe:
Length: 175.83 inches
Width: 71.2 inches
Height: 51.18 inches
Weight: 3.208 lbs. (with PDK)
2012 991.1 Carrera S Coupe:
Length: 176.81 inches
Width: 71.18 inches
Height: 50.98 inches
Weight: 3,120 lbs. (with PDK)
991 is lighter and smaller (less height and marginally narrower, albeit longer by an inch).
I chose a 997.2 GTS over a 991.1 - it felts smaller and more raw. It was less insulated so felt fun at 60 rather than needing to always wind it up to licence losing speeds - almost like a grown up Lotus. The cabin reminds me more of 80s hero cars, rather than my Macan as the 991 did - I like the contrast.
I expect I’ll do 1500 miles a year so definitely not a daily so I wanted something a bit different, but still useable. You might have different needs!
I’m maybe quite extreme as I had a 992 GTS on order too and cancelled that as the 997 gave me all I wanted in a sports car (cancelled after an extended test drive). I figured the 80k difference buys me another whole car to sit with the 997, although yet to break that news to the committee
I expect I’ll do 1500 miles a year so definitely not a daily so I wanted something a bit different, but still useable. You might have different needs!
I’m maybe quite extreme as I had a 992 GTS on order too and cancelled that as the 997 gave me all I wanted in a sports car (cancelled after an extended test drive). I figured the 80k difference buys me another whole car to sit with the 997, although yet to break that news to the committee
Personally, I prefer the 997 (the perfect looking 911 in my eyes). It appears smaller and more of a sports car and the 997.2 didn't suffer from the often-highlighted engine issues of the earlier cars. The 991's started to bloat a bit and are getting more into the GT territory. That said, if it's a daily then the 991 has a more up to date cabin and I'm led to believe the PDK is better too. If your option was a 997 manual or a 991 PDK then I'd go for the 997 but both PDK, then I'd probably opt for the 991. Both great machines either way.
Specifically because your coming from the 996 generation, I would lean heavily towards getting the 991 but as others have said, go drive both:
I was comparing in a similar way...
I had a leggy 996 C4S and was deciding between a 997.2 and 981 Cayman, my budget at the time (about 2019) was about £30-35k at the time. That didn't quite stretch to a special edition 997 (like the the GTS series) but it was lower mileage 997 PDK cars. I looked at a couple and then drove a 981 Cayman and was blown away by the fact it felt like a much much newer design.
I know a 981 isn't a 991 but the step change from 996/977 generation was too big for me not to buy the newer car.
I was comparing in a similar way...
I had a leggy 996 C4S and was deciding between a 997.2 and 981 Cayman, my budget at the time (about 2019) was about £30-35k at the time. That didn't quite stretch to a special edition 997 (like the the GTS series) but it was lower mileage 997 PDK cars. I looked at a couple and then drove a 981 Cayman and was blown away by the fact it felt like a much much newer design.
I know a 981 isn't a 991 but the step change from 996/977 generation was too big for me not to buy the newer car.
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