Secondhand car price crash? (Vol. 2)
Discussion
ChocolateFrog said:
There seems to be plenty of new cars knocking about.
The dealer overflow carpark I often drive past is still full.
Makes me wonder if people realise their brand new i7 or iX has been parked nose literally into the bushes with the new weeds now growing up above the cills in the damp end of a gravel carpark getting covered in rail dust.
Speaking of behomoth BMWs that dont sell. I see the XM is the subject of some "compelling" leasing dealsThe dealer overflow carpark I often drive past is still full.
Makes me wonder if people realise their brand new i7 or iX has been parked nose literally into the bushes with the new weeds now growing up above the cills in the damp end of a gravel carpark getting covered in rail dust.
One could be yours for 24 months for £24,000 all in.
Still horrendous outlay but not bad on a car with £130k ish price tag.
https://leasing.com/car-leasing/search/
Deep Thought said:
I would imagine they are paying for a set number of slots per month so not costing them specifically to list that car.
But yes, after a couple of months I'd be getting tired looking at that and have started to reduce the price accordingly.
Its still costing them because they could have filled the slot with another car, last year wasn't a year dealers were struggling to find stock.But yes, after a couple of months I'd be getting tired looking at that and have started to reduce the price accordingly.
buyerandseller said:
I'd be interested to know what business is it that you run where you get everything right, 100% of the time?
I am not criticizing them for not selling this car, I just think if they were paying £100 a month to keep it advertised they probably would have dropped the price long to get shot of it at the end of the summer, or taken the advert off and relisted it in spring.Which is why I think it was on a fixed price deal, they paid an amount and it is there until it's sold.
This was something auto trader have offered in the past but I don't think they do now at all.
e-honda said:
I am not criticizing them for not selling this car, I just think if they were paying £100 a month to keep it advertised they probably would have dropped the price long to get shot of it at the end of the summer, or taken the advert off and relisted it in spring.
Which is why I think it was on a fixed price deal, they paid an amount and it is there until it's sold.
This was something auto trader have offered in the past but I don't think they do now at all.
When you have a full Autotrader account you have a contract to list a defined amount of cars, it may be 5,10,12 20, 50, 100 or whatever, you do not pay for each individual listing but a monthly cost whether you utilise the numbers or not. The dealer with the Smart car you identified has 58 cars listed, their contract maybe 60, or it might be 70 or 80 so it makes no difference if the car is there or not if that's what they are contracted to and they haven't enough cars to list. Your guess at about £100 a car per month is pretty accurate to what I was paying a few years ago so it is very expensive. You will need to give 30 days notice to reduce your contract which makes trying to balance your stock to your advertising commitment nearly impossible. Of course you'd like to turn your stock as soon as you can but I had occasions when if I cleared a car at a lost after say six months I couldn't then go to the auction to replace it for less money than I'd bought it for in the first place, so you have a dilemma as to what to do, stick or twist. I know everyone thinks the motor trade is easy, and it is, as long as you have more winners than losers you'll be ahead. Which is why I think it was on a fixed price deal, they paid an amount and it is there until it's sold.
This was something auto trader have offered in the past but I don't think they do now at all.
ChocolateFrog said:
There seems to be plenty of new cars knocking about.
The dealer overflow carpark I often drive past is still full.
Makes me wonder if people realise their brand new i7 or iX has been parked nose literally into the bushes with the new weeds now growing up above the cills in the damp end of a gravel carpark getting covered in rail dust.
I guess there are 2 ways to look at itThe dealer overflow carpark I often drive past is still full.
Makes me wonder if people realise their brand new i7 or iX has been parked nose literally into the bushes with the new weeds now growing up above the cills in the damp end of a gravel carpark getting covered in rail dust.
- Business is great - look at all the new cars that dealers are bringing in
- Business is bad - dealer group ordered a load of new i7/iX, people aren't buying them and now they sit in a car park/field while the dealer works out what to do with them
e-honda said:
Deep Thought said:
I would imagine they are paying for a set number of slots per month so not costing them specifically to list that car.
But yes, after a couple of months I'd be getting tired looking at that and have started to reduce the price accordingly.
Its still costing them because they could have filled the slot with another car, last year wasn't a year dealers were struggling to find stock.But yes, after a couple of months I'd be getting tired looking at that and have started to reduce the price accordingly.
Perhaps they have a set 60 car per month agreement.
Edited by Deep Thought on Friday 17th May 23:55
e-honda said:
Deep Thought said:
At the minute they have 54 car listed.
Perhaps they have a set 60 car per month agreement.
Or perhaps they have 50 and are paying for 4 additional adverts, it's a fair amount of money per slot and you don't seem to get much in the way of discounts commiting to more.Perhaps they have a set 60 car per month agreement.
They are absolutely not paying £100 a month to advertise a £3k car for a year and they clearly have a pretty big monthly car advert allocation given how many cars they are advertising with AT
Edited by Deep Thought on Saturday 18th May 00:05
Deep Thought said:
I think we have to assume here they know they're business and what adverts are costing them and maybe take on board what the trade / those who have been in the trade are saying. No?
They are absolutely not paying £100 a month to advertise a £3k car for a year and they clearly have a pretty big monthly car advert allocation given how many cars they are advertising with AT
I am assuming they know what they are doing to, I never said I think they have been paying £100 a month for this car, I said I think they paid a fix price to advertise until sold.They are absolutely not paying £100 a month to advertise a £3k car for a year and they clearly have a pretty big monthly car advert allocation given how many cars they are advertising with AT
Edited by Deep Thought on Saturday 18th May 00:05
They have 54 cars, and our of them 5 are a completely different style, and are all over 6 months old, 3 out of the 5 are all older cheap convertibles which started out very speculatively priced and didn't start to move down until the end of last year. The rest of their adverts seem to be no more than about 60 days.
I can't find the article now, but I remember reading something about autotrader withdrawing advertise until sold options, I've looked and it is still there as an option for private sales, so I think it was probably just for trade accounts.
So to me it seems most likely they are paying for 50 slots, using 49 of them currently and have 5 adverts from a different time where they had an option to purchase adverts at a fixed cost and advertise until sold.
Unless you can tell me that no, they've never offered traders advertise until sold to trader accounts why can't you accept this as a probable scenario.
e-honda said:
I am assuming they know what they are doing to, I never said I think they have been paying £100 a month for this car, I said I think they paid a fix price to advertise until sold.
They have 54 cars, and our of them 5 are a completely different style, and are all over 6 months old, 3 out of the 5 are all older cheap convertibles which started out very speculatively priced and didn't start to move down until the end of last year. The rest of their adverts seem to be no more than about 60 days.
I can't find the article now, but I remember reading something about autotrader withdrawing advertise until sold options, I've looked and it is still there as an option for private sales, so I think it was probably just for trade accounts.
So to me it seems most likely they are paying for 50 slots, using 49 of them currently and have 5 adverts from a different time where they had an option to purchase adverts at a fixed cost and advertise until sold.
Unless you can tell me that no, they've never offered traders advertise until sold to trader accounts why can't you accept this as a probable scenario.
I explained above how a trade account works you seem to have ignored it, you simply pay for the number of cars on your contract whether that is 5 or 500, there is no hangover from a car that was listed last year and no paying for an individual car until sold. It's not a difficult concept to grasp. They have 54 cars, and our of them 5 are a completely different style, and are all over 6 months old, 3 out of the 5 are all older cheap convertibles which started out very speculatively priced and didn't start to move down until the end of last year. The rest of their adverts seem to be no more than about 60 days.
I can't find the article now, but I remember reading something about autotrader withdrawing advertise until sold options, I've looked and it is still there as an option for private sales, so I think it was probably just for trade accounts.
So to me it seems most likely they are paying for 50 slots, using 49 of them currently and have 5 adverts from a different time where they had an option to purchase adverts at a fixed cost and advertise until sold.
Unless you can tell me that no, they've never offered traders advertise until sold to trader accounts why can't you accept this as a probable scenario.
buyerandseller said:
I explained above how a trade account works you seem to have ignored it, you simply pay for the number of cars on your contract whether that is 5 or 500, there is no hangover from a car that was listed last year and no paying for an individual car until sold. It's not a difficult concept to grasp.
What makes you so certain there is no hang overProducts come and go.
Are you telling me you are certain that 6 months or a year ago auto trader was not offering any traders the option to purchase adverts on an advertise untill sold basis? There was no article I read a few months back about them withdrawing it, I must have misremembered or got the wrong end of the stick?
ChocolateFrog said:
Makes me wonder if people realise their brand new i7 or iX has been parked nose literally into the bushes with the new weeds now growing up above the cills in the damp end of a gravel carpark getting covered in rail dust.
It's not the 1970s with cars rusting away you know. A bit of dirt on them that has to be washed off and weeds that have no effect on the car are irrelevant. And there's a damp end in a car park??
e-honda said:
What makes you so certain there is no hang over
Products come and go.
Are you telling me you are certain that 6 months or a year ago auto trader was not offering any traders the option to purchase adverts on an advertise untill sold basis? There was no article I read a few months back about them withdrawing it, I must have misremembered or got the wrong end of the stick?
Autotrader have not offered trade advertisers the option of hold till sold (at least not in the past 5 years) just retail which I think has stopped.Products come and go.
Are you telling me you are certain that 6 months or a year ago auto trader was not offering any traders the option to purchase adverts on an advertise untill sold basis? There was no article I read a few months back about them withdrawing it, I must have misremembered or got the wrong end of the stick?
What a dealer can do is leave the car live on their portal but not sell include it on their advertised car package, this means it will show in saved app searches and when selecting see other cars from seller but won’t appear in live searches.
Auto810graphy said:
Autotrader have not offered trade advertisers the option of hold till sold (at least not in the past 5 years) just retail which I think has stopped.
What a dealer can do is leave the car live on their portal but not sell include it on their advertised car package, this means it will show in saved app searches and when selecting see other cars from seller but won’t appear in live searches.
Ok Fair enough I must have got the wrong end of the stick.What a dealer can do is leave the car live on their portal but not sell include it on their advertised car package, this means it will show in saved app searches and when selecting see other cars from seller but won’t appear in live searches.
They are currently Offering advertise until sold on private https://www.autotrader.co.uk/cars/sell/advertising...
So perhaps it was stopped and came back, or maybe it hasn't yet been stopped.
Still looking at cars, fortunately in the position of wanting rather than needing, I have the spec I want, would really like to be in the 3 year / 30,000 mile range, what I'm finding is that cars going back to 2018 really aren't dropping in price, and there isn't much of a price spread between those and cars up to 2020, 2021 there was a face lift on what I'm looking at, and those are substantially more.
So for what I'm looking to buy, nothing seems to be significantly dropping, apart from the price on my PX
So for what I'm looking to buy, nothing seems to be significantly dropping, apart from the price on my PX
av185 said:
According to Autocar Cox Automotive confirm average values of used 2 to 4 year old EVs are now £2k below average values of 2 to 4 year old diesels at £16k and £18k respectively.
I don't know if those figures are based on guide figures or actual sales. EVs very rarely achieve CAP Average and usually £1-2k below.It has become an ever decreasing circle where people mentally won't pay more than CAP Average even for a clean car so the guides reduce but then the next month people will still only pay below CAP Average.....
It'll stop somewhere but at the moment the theoretical prices are still playing catch up with reality and need a big cut (possibly 15-20% in some cases) to truly reflect the market.
EVs are selling in the trade but have been and continue to really, really struggle and are still falling.
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