Domestic a/c

[Somebody]

What's the verdict on this from Costco?

[Cow Corner]

Have you identified passive options to reduce overheating, such as external shading - which can be very effective for southerly facing rooms (and probably cheaper and less visually intrusive than a full AC system).

[Simpo Two]

C n C said:

Fair enough. I'm guessing that the issue with what you want is that it's not the "normal" way that domestic A/C is provided in the UK, hence your issues with finding a suitable supplier.

Yes; I'm annoyed that this company quoted but then ran away. If I ask a question I think it courteous to answer, not hide.

Cow Corner said:

Have you identified passive options to reduce overheating, such as external shading - which can be very effective for southerly facing rooms (and probably cheaper and less visually intrusive than a full AC system).

I'm looking at window film this afternoon, though it will be a few hundred £ and I'm not sure how much cooler it will keep the rooms.

The two rooms both have south and west walls so in periods of hot weather they soak it up like a storage heater.

Edited by Simpo Two on Friday 17th May 17:17

[JD]

What window types has the flat got?

You can buy window fitted splits, but likely they only really work if you have sash windows (or you are happy to take a pane out and blank off the rest)

[littlebasher]

Somebody said:

What's the verdict on this from Costco?

There is an air con engineer active on the hotukdeals website, where this deal was posted

He says the recent Daikin units are pretty unreliable.

[Simpo Two]

JD said:

What window types has the flat got?

You can buy window fitted splits, but likely they only really work if you have sash windows (or you are happy to take a pane out and blank off the rest)

3-bed detached house. The windows in both places are 3-section d/g units with the outer sections opening and the centre one fixed.

For the lounge I was thinking of keeping the unit under the dining table, which is fairly central in the area, and drilling a hole through the west wall. But I wouldn't want to do that only to find that a standalone unit can't cool a room 25' x 10'.

[119]

We have a multi split and it is pure bliss in the summer and gives us some warmth in the winter.

I wouldnt waste my time pissing about with the portable units.

[ctdctd]

If you don't want unit outside and you are prepared to drill big holes in the wall, how about one of these?
https://www.aircondirect.co.uk/p/1449870/10000-btu...

P.S. What everyone else says - don't waste time on portable units. Noisy, compressor clunking on and off and not very effective!

Edited by ctdctd on Saturday 18th May 10:24

Edited by ctdctd on Saturday 18th May 10:35

[Simpo Two]

ctdctd said:

If you don't want unit outside and you are prepared to drill big holes in the wall, how about one of these?
https://www.aircondirect.co.uk/p/1449870/10000-btu...

P.S. What everyone else says - don't waste time on portable units. Noisy, compressor clunking on and off and not very effective!

Novel, but the wrong way round - a unit outside is OK, a wall unit is tolerable in bedroom, but not in lounge/diner because the only wall spare is at the narrow north end which is 25'' from the south window.

[ctdctd]

Simpo Two said:

Novel, but the wrong way round - a unit outside is OK, a wall unit is tolerable in bedroom, but not in lounge/diner because the only wall spare is at the narrow north end which is 25'' from the south window.

These go on the floor against a wall - in the same place as you were thinking about putting a portable unit?
(Or were you running the 6" hose across the carpet to the wall!)

[Simpo Two]

ctdctd said:

Simpo Two said:

Novel, but the wrong way round - a unit outside is OK, a wall unit is tolerable in bedroom, but not in lounge/diner because the only wall spare is at the narrow north end which is 25'' from the south window.

These go on the floor against a wall - in the same place as you were thinking about putting a portable unit?
(Or were you running the 6" hose across the carpet to the wall!)

Oh I see, same sort of 'footprint' as a storage heater.

1000 x 205 x 585mm is a big chunk though, and it would come out behind an armchair, so I'd get a very cold chair but not sure about the rest of the room.

All I want is a vent in the middle of the ceiling that has cold air blowing down it, and a knob going from 'Off' to 'Max'. But blowing cold air through a tube seems to defy every a/c expert.

[shirt]

C n C said:

Simpo Two said:

C n C said:

TL:DR - get a proper split A/C system - you won't regret it.

What I actually want is a ducted system with an FCU in the loft, but this seems beyond the grasp of a/c companies in the area; they either only quote for boxes on walls, or run away and hide....

Fair enough. I'm guessing that the issue with what you want is that it's not the "normal" way that domestic A/C is provided in the UK, hence your issues with finding a suitable supplier.

I'm not going to say, "just go for a split unit system", as I assume you have very good reasons for wanting the ducted system, but there's no doubt a split unit system would be the easiest to find a supplier for.

If you do successfully get a ducted system installed, please post up details as it would be interesting to see what that entails and any advantages of that approach.

The main advantage is looks. No boxes on show, just the grilles. I’m not sure how a retrofit would be handled into a typical uk house construction though and the complexity / rework required is likely what is putting off suppliers from quoting. I’d have thought you’d need a builder or plasterer / decorator to work with the system design to advise on that.

[Ken_Code]

Funk said:

Completely agree and I would have a split system....if I wasn't in a flat; the options are few and expensive in my situation. I have plans to move to a house later this year all being well and proper AC will be one of the things I'll have installed.

In my flat we have one that vents the waste heat into the cold water system which can (if you want) then be used to partially heat your hot water. The exchanger sits under the bench in the kitchen.

[Simpo Two]

shirt said:

The main advantage is looks. No boxes on show, just the grilles. I’m not sure how a retrofit would be handled into a typical uk house construction though and the complexity / rework required is likely what is putting off suppliers from quoting. I’d have thought you’d need a builder or plasterer / decorator to work with the system design to advise on that.

It's actually very simple - the FCU would be in the loft with a short duct through the upstairs ceiling to the bedroom, and another duct (or the same one with a flap valve) descending vertically through a built-in wardrobe to the centre of the lounge/diner directly below.




The (potential) installers seemed overly concerned with control systems, talking about return ducts and fretting over where the air would go. But I'm not demanding perfect climate control, just a simple way to turn the unit on/off/up/down which could be wired or wireless. I could make the holes and fit ducting myself, I just need someone to specify and install the equipment.

[C n C]

Simpo Two said:

Novel, but the wrong way round - a unit outside is OK, a wall unit is tolerable in bedroom, but not in lounge/diner because the only wall spare is at the narrow north end which is 25'' from the south window.

Simpo, I hadn't realised that this was the reason you wanted to go for a ducted solution.

I don't know if it's any help, but when we put our system in, the 3.5kW internal unit is in a room with an extension which is 30 feet long, and 15 feet wide. The internal unit is mounted on one of the "side" walls, in the extension about 2 feet away from the patio doors, which are at the end of the extension, so in theory far from an ideal placement, as it's right at the end of the 30 foot long room, and facing across the room rather than in line with the longest axis.

Our internal units have variable direction vents, so can be directed to left/right, and down/straight in front.

Setting the unit in this long room to direct the air to the side and straight (rather than down), it has no problem at all in cooling the whole room, and doesn't cause an uncomfortable cold draught. I know this as I usually sit roughly mid way along the room on the opposite side to the unit to watch tv, so am effectively directly in the firing line so to speak.

To be honest, once the a/c has been running in a warm room for 5-10 minutes, and the temperature drops, the fan speed automatically reduces and you hardly notice it is even on.

If your problem with a split system is that in one 25 foot room, the only location for the wall unit would be on one of the end walls, I personally wouldn't see this as a problem. A wall mounted unit set to blow straight ahead (rather than left or right) and as high as possible (rather than down) should have absolutely no problem in keeping the room at a comfortable temperature, even if it is at the "cold" end of the room, away from the south facing window.

For reference, because this was the largest of the 4 rooms we put a/c units in, it got a 3.5kW wall unit, whereas the others got 2.5kW units.

[Phil.]

This guy fitted mine and he’s very good. Worth a call and I believe he travels for work:

https://www.facebook.com/aircon4home

[shakindog]

ctdctd said:

If you don't want unit outside and you are prepared to drill big holes in the wall, how about one of these?
https://www.aircondirect.co.uk/p/1449870/10000-btu...

P.S. What everyone else says - don't waste time on portable units. Noisy, compressor clunking on and off and not very effective!

Edited by ctdctd on Saturday 18th May 10:24

Having just fitted one of these units this week they are brilliant.
I’ve had portable units for years and they are noisy and with the hose to run out the window a bit of a pain.
I chose this unit as it’s been put in my bedroom at front of the house.
I did want the big unit outside on the front wall.
Fitted it myself fairly easily as my house is engineered brick and a nightmare to core through.
Once the holes are cored and a fairly extended clean up fits in minutes and the vents outside look ok. Mwill look better when the outside is rendered next month.
Had it in for coulpe hours last night when I got in from work and house still cool this morning when I got up.
The indoor unit if fairly large but much quieter than a portable.
It cools,heats,dehumidifies or just a fan depending on what setting.
Only thing I found was a 180mm core drill was difficult to find and about £50 when I did find one.
You’llneed a sds drill and more time than you think to core the holes

Edited by ctdctd on Saturday 18th May 10:35

[C n C]

Simpo Two said:

It's actually very simple - the FCU would be in the loft with a short duct through the upstairs ceiling to the bedroom, and another duct (or the same one with a flap valve) descending vertically through a built-in wardrobe to the centre of the lounge/diner directly below.




The (potential) installers seemed overly concerned with control systems, talking about return ducts and fretting over where the air would go. But I'm not demanding perfect climate control, just a simple way to turn the unit on/off/up/down which could be wired or wireless. I could make the holes and fit ducting myself, I just need someone to specify and install the equipment.

I'm not an expert, but I can see why they would be concerned about return ducts, and where the air would go.

With a split system, the air remains in the room and is recirculated, so the cooling effect of the unit is effectively cumulative. It's one of the reasons they are far more effective than the portable units as those continually vent hot air outside, but therefore draw in warm ambient air to replace it.

With a ducted system as you've described it, just having "input" ducts introducing cold air would fill the room and cool it, but would be very inefficient, as if you're continually pumping cool air into the room, you're also forcing (cool) air out of the room through cracks around the door etc.. I'd also imagine that if the room was relatively well sealed, it would put an increased load on the FCU as it tries to pump air into a closed container (your room).

I'd imagine an efficient ducted system would have both an input duct and an extract duct so as cold air is introduced, ambient air from the room would go out of the extract duct, return to the FCU, be cooled, and then re-circulated into the room, so you're not continually forcing (cool) air out of the room and having to replace it.

ETA - I'd also imagine that the loft space would be far from the most ideal place (from an efficiency point of view) to put the FCU, if our loft is anything to go by, as it gets incredibly hot in sunny weather - much warmer than the outside ambient temperature where a conventional split unit condenser would be.

Edited by C n C on Saturday 18th May 12:35

[Funk]

Ken_Code said:

Funk said:

Completely agree and I would have a split system....if I wasn't in a flat; the options are few and expensive in my situation. I have plans to move to a house later this year all being well and proper AC will be one of the things I'll have installed.

In my flat we have one that vents the waste heat into the cold water system which can (if you want) then be used to partially heat your hot water. The exchanger sits under the bench in the kitchen.

I looked into water-cooled ones; they were really expensive, bulky and apparently very wasteful of both water and electricity...?

What system do you have - sounds like something different?

[Phil.]

Phil. said:

This guy fitted mine and he’s very good. Worth a call and I believe he travels for work:

https://www.facebook.com/aircon4home

He fits exactly what you want:

https://www.facebook.com/100057456668760/posts/pfb...

I know he works commercially on a big scale, as well as residentially, so has access to all sorts of solutions.