USA Gratuity And/Or Tip?
Discussion
unrepentant said:
Not at all. But that is a typically British comment.
Ask a server what they would like, no salary but tips or what you would think of a reasonable salary and no tips. They will quickly tell you that they would rather be in control of their earnings. Same with sales people.
Americans actually understand the system, you clearly don’t.
If only there was a third option like, I dunno, an employer paying a liveable wage and tips at the customers discretion?Ask a server what they would like, no salary but tips or what you would think of a reasonable salary and no tips. They will quickly tell you that they would rather be in control of their earnings. Same with sales people.
Americans actually understand the system, you clearly don’t.
Matt Harper said:
We've now arrived at 15 pages of UK tourist outrage at the concept of rewarding wait staff for good service.
Just a reminder - tipping is not a legal requirement. If the idea is so abhorrent (because it is not the norm at home), then don't f
king do it.
Granted, that will just confirm to US servers that the tight-fisted reputation of British tourists is justified - but you won't be going back there anyway, so who cares?
Either that, or we could just continue pissing and moaning about it for another chapter or two....
You’re quite right. If we don’t like it, etc. So when I am in the US I don’t waste time and money eating out. It’s largely a dreadful experience and the food’s seldom worth the money (net or gross). But I doubt my contribution will be missed.Just a reminder - tipping is not a legal requirement. If the idea is so abhorrent (because it is not the norm at home), then don't f
king do it.Granted, that will just confirm to US servers that the tight-fisted reputation of British tourists is justified - but you won't be going back there anyway, so who cares?
Either that, or we could just continue pissing and moaning about it for another chapter or two....
But, fair points have been made: while it might be the norm in the US, so is the effective toleration of school shootings and an infant mortality rate worse than Kenya’s. The American way is not obviously always the right way.
romft123 said:
unrepentant said:
snuffy said:
Matt Harper said:
Granted, that will just confirm to US servers that the tight-fisted reputation of British tourists is justified - but you won't be going back there anyway, so who cares?
As opposed to the tight-fisted nature of said US server's employers who don't pay them properly ?That, I have found, is a concept that has never entered an America's head.
Ask a server what they would like, no salary but tips or what you would think of a reasonable salary and no tips. They will quickly tell you that they would rather be in control of their earnings. Same with sales people.
Americans actually understand the system, you clearly don’t.
This is the difference here. People have freedom to choose. Freedom to choose where they eat, how to tip and how much money they want to make based on their own efforts..
snuffy said:
unrepentant said:
snuffy said:
As I say, you don't people properly.
You set up a website to brag about the cars you’ve owned?We have a word for that over here.
unrepentant said:
romft123 said:
unrepentant said:
snuffy said:
Matt Harper said:
Granted, that will just confirm to US servers that the tight-fisted reputation of British tourists is justified - but you won't be going back there anyway, so who cares?
As opposed to the tight-fisted nature of said US server's employers who don't pay them properly ?That, I have found, is a concept that has never entered an America's head.
Ask a server what they would like, no salary but tips or what you would think of a reasonable salary and no tips. They will quickly tell you that they would rather be in control of their earnings. Same with sales people.
Americans actually understand the system, you clearly don’t.
This is the difference here. People have freedom to choose. Freedom to choose where they eat, how to tip and how much money they want to make based on their own efforts..
unrepentant said:
It’s an automotive website where we have always been encouraged to post details and photos of our cars in our profile. A bit different from making your own website to demonstrate what a high roller you are, I would have thought.
So your list of cars is just a list of cars, but mine is bragging.unrepentant said:
romft123 said:
Who is this ....."You lot"? Freedom to choose, waffle and BS. "Good servers" get paid more....yeh maybe slightly more than "bad servers". Whats the differance in %. 10 to maybe 15....20%??? Dont be so condescending.
I think you need to read the thread. romft123 said:
unrepentant said:
romft123 said:
Who is this ....."You lot"? Freedom to choose, waffle and BS. "Good servers" get paid more....yeh maybe slightly more than "bad servers". Whats the differance in %. 10 to maybe 15....20%??? Dont be so condescending.
I think you need to read the thread. 
You really don’t get it at all. I hate Donald Trump with every sinew in my body and I despise the Republican Party that he has created. I am a card carrying member of the Democratic Party and about as far from being a Trumper as can be.
Self reliance, entrepreneurship and caring for the wellbeing of others are Democratic values.
unrepentant said:
romft123 said:
unrepentant said:
romft123 said:
Who is this ....."You lot"? Freedom to choose, waffle and BS. "Good servers" get paid more....yeh maybe slightly more than "bad servers". Whats the differance in %. 10 to maybe 15....20%??? Dont be so condescending.
I think you need to read the thread. You really don’t get it at all. I hate Donald Trump with every sinew in my body and I despise the Republican Party that he has created. I am a card carrying member of the Democratic Party and about as far from being a Trumper as can be.
Self reliance, entrepreneurship and caring for the wellbeing of others are Democratic values.
unrepentant said:
romft123 said:
unrepentant said:
romft123 said:
Who is this ....."You lot"? Freedom to choose, waffle and BS. "Good servers" get paid more....yeh maybe slightly more than "bad servers". Whats the differance in %. 10 to maybe 15....20%??? Dont be so condescending.
I think you need to read the thread. You really don’t get it at all. I hate Donald Trump with every sinew in my body and I despise the Republican Party that he has created. I am a card carrying member of the Democratic Party and about as far from being a Trumper as can be.
Self reliance, entrepreneurship and caring for the wellbeing of others are Democratic values.
The problem is you are “supposed” to be the leaders of the free world but all I see is a very worrying choice of candidates to the point that it is actually scary.
Not that the UK has ANYTHING to brag about in that respect. The entire world is completely screwed.
Please transport me to rural France where none of this matters!
snuffy said:
TriumphStag3.0V8 said:
Just wondering what percentage Unrepentant tipped the server for bringing him the massive chip he now has on his shoulder.
Anything less that 25% would make him a cheapskate, clearly.
Boxster5 said:
Please transport me to rural France where none of this matters!
France has a big immigrant/racism problem, same as the UK. And its own governmental problems (notably their inability to reform welfare / pensions...if they weren't in the Euro their currency would be tanking right now same as Sterling has)....and I'm not sure anywhere else in central/southern Europe is that much better, sadly. Not when you drill into the underlying cultures.
So got to be Southern hemisphere.
NZ, or one of the (less low-lying) island nations. Far enough away not to be a target for the millions of refugees we'll see over the coming decade, far enough removed from "globalism" not to be subject to its whims and the current trend towards feudal capitalism, and (so far) with a good trend in governments.
I visit the USA most years and tip the suggested (often requested) 18%-20%, as whilst I think the system is ridiculous I take it like I would any cultural norm - I know it exists before I visit and either go and accept it or don't go.
I'm not going to tip on top of any tip that is already automatically included however, and when I pay the bill and zero that off make a point of confirming that I see it has already been included.
However, I don't for a second think it encourages good service - fast service yes - but getting my bill thrown at me the second I say I don't want dessert isn't a convenience for me as they like to pretend it is. It's a confirmation that my bill and therefore tip amount has now been crystallized, so pay up and let another paying customer sit down.
The idea of a relaxing meal then sitting to enjoy a couple of glasses of wine afterwards doesn't seem to exist in the US, you go, eat up and get out pronto!
I'm not going to tip on top of any tip that is already automatically included however, and when I pay the bill and zero that off make a point of confirming that I see it has already been included.
However, I don't for a second think it encourages good service - fast service yes - but getting my bill thrown at me the second I say I don't want dessert isn't a convenience for me as they like to pretend it is. It's a confirmation that my bill and therefore tip amount has now been crystallized, so pay up and let another paying customer sit down.
The idea of a relaxing meal then sitting to enjoy a couple of glasses of wine afterwards doesn't seem to exist in the US, you go, eat up and get out pronto!
there's an interesting article in Times Travel WRT to tipping:
" The galleries! The hip-hop! The bagels! It’s hard to think of a city more up my graffiti-splashed alley than New York. But the thing that’s always put me off? The price of basically everything, from restaurant meals to accommodation. And with the cost of living in the USA soaring and American tipping culture still as excessive as ever — not to mention travellers now getting just $1.25 to the pound — it doesn’t seem like things are going to change anytime soon. So, how can you make your next US trip cheaper? Our chief travel writer has 17 expert hacks to cut back on costs, whether you’re planning a city break, road trip, rail journey or family holiday to Disney. Turns out you could save thousands before you even land.
Outraged, in particular, by the OTT surcharges that seem to end up on every bill? You’re not alone. One survey last year found that 75 per cent of Americans think tipping has gone out of control. With 20 per cent gratuities now the norm, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/why-is-tipping-... — without being called an asshole by a waiter, as our writer once was. "
Far from being encouraged and happily accepted by most Americans the above seems to suggest that the opposite is actually true - so not so much 'stingy Brits' as 'greedy servers'...
" The galleries! The hip-hop! The bagels! It’s hard to think of a city more up my graffiti-splashed alley than New York. But the thing that’s always put me off? The price of basically everything, from restaurant meals to accommodation. And with the cost of living in the USA soaring and American tipping culture still as excessive as ever — not to mention travellers now getting just $1.25 to the pound — it doesn’t seem like things are going to change anytime soon. So, how can you make your next US trip cheaper? Our chief travel writer has 17 expert hacks to cut back on costs, whether you’re planning a city break, road trip, rail journey or family holiday to Disney. Turns out you could save thousands before you even land.
Outraged, in particular, by the OTT surcharges that seem to end up on every bill? You’re not alone. One survey last year found that 75 per cent of Americans think tipping has gone out of control. With 20 per cent gratuities now the norm, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/why-is-tipping-... — without being called an asshole by a waiter, as our writer once was. "
Far from being encouraged and happily accepted by most Americans the above seems to suggest that the opposite is actually true - so not so much 'stingy Brits' as 'greedy servers'...
Oakey said:
If only there was a third option like, I dunno, an employer paying a liveable wage and tips at the customers discretion?
There most certainly is. It's called France.UK is caught in limbo, sitting on the fence between two competing objectives. 12.5% service charge is usually indicated as "discretionary" but in reality they kick up a real stink if you don't want to pay it!
yellowbentines said:
However, I don't for a second think it encourages good service - fast service yes - but getting my bill thrown at me the second I say I don't want dessert isn't a convenience for me as they like to pretend it is. It's a confirmation that my bill and therefore tip amount has now been crystallized, so pay up and let another paying customer sit down.
The idea of a relaxing meal then sitting to enjoy a couple of glasses of wine afterwards doesn't seem to exist in the US, you go, eat up and get out pronto!
It's just a different cultural norm. Yesterday I sat with a business associate and 2 hours after I paid the bill (and tipped!!) we were still sitting there chatting and still getting free refills of our tea and coffee. That's not unique.The idea of a relaxing meal then sitting to enjoy a couple of glasses of wine afterwards doesn't seem to exist in the US, you go, eat up and get out pronto!
The Moose said:
yellowbentines said:
However, I don't for a second think it encourages good service - fast service yes - but getting my bill thrown at me the second I say I don't want dessert isn't a convenience for me as they like to pretend it is. It's a confirmation that my bill and therefore tip amount has now been crystallized, so pay up and let another paying customer sit down.
The idea of a relaxing meal then sitting to enjoy a couple of glasses of wine afterwards doesn't seem to exist in the US, you go, eat up and get out pronto!
It's just a different cultural norm. Yesterday I sat with a business associate and 2 hours after I paid the bill (and tipped!!) we were still sitting there chatting and still getting free refills of our tea and coffee. That's not unique.The idea of a relaxing meal then sitting to enjoy a couple of glasses of wine afterwards doesn't seem to exist in the US, you go, eat up and get out pronto!
I always get the feeling that once I'm done ordering more items, that they want me gone and the bill quickly appears without asking.
I've also experienced the opposite here in the UK, sitting chatting with extended family after eating and my American cousin confused as to why the bill hadn't arrived and why we weren't leaving immediately after eating.
Different cultural norms as you say.
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