Do I need a compo face?
Discussion
Difficult case and I am sorry to hear about your little one. Utter nightmare thing to happen.
I do think that the solicitor's experience carries weight here. In a different matter, I looked into negligence by a hospital that I believe resulted in my brother-in-laws death. I got the notes from the hospital, went through them, found various anomalies, and took it to a solicitor on a no win no fee basis. They probably spent minimum time compared to me, looking at it from their point of view - are we going to get anything out of it? I was not impressed by them at all, but then I held a very different stake in the situation and was hardly impartial. We took their advice that there would most likely be no case to answer, as it was something difficult if nigh on impossible to prove. You need to demonstrate what they, the supermarket, have done wrong.
Clearly there are lessons to learn and Morrisons have been less than spectacular with completing the accident record. I will expect that to have been completed and some form of follow up around 'what we as a supermarket could do do differently to prevent this happening again'.
Only you, your wife, and the staff member know precisely what happened and if there is adequate evidence to make a case. The regretful injury is not the evidence of wrong doing per se, but is a potential consequence.
I think all you can do to progress this is to take the matter to a no win no fee solicitor and get another opinion. It will not cost anything, plus you have the benefit of another pair of eyes being cast over the case.
I do think that the solicitor's experience carries weight here. In a different matter, I looked into negligence by a hospital that I believe resulted in my brother-in-laws death. I got the notes from the hospital, went through them, found various anomalies, and took it to a solicitor on a no win no fee basis. They probably spent minimum time compared to me, looking at it from their point of view - are we going to get anything out of it? I was not impressed by them at all, but then I held a very different stake in the situation and was hardly impartial. We took their advice that there would most likely be no case to answer, as it was something difficult if nigh on impossible to prove. You need to demonstrate what they, the supermarket, have done wrong.
Clearly there are lessons to learn and Morrisons have been less than spectacular with completing the accident record. I will expect that to have been completed and some form of follow up around 'what we as a supermarket could do do differently to prevent this happening again'.
Only you, your wife, and the staff member know precisely what happened and if there is adequate evidence to make a case. The regretful injury is not the evidence of wrong doing per se, but is a potential consequence.
I think all you can do to progress this is to take the matter to a no win no fee solicitor and get another opinion. It will not cost anything, plus you have the benefit of another pair of eyes being cast over the case.
Hondashark said:
I'll come and put scolding water in reach of your 1 year old and when you shout at me I'll laugh at you and tell you to keep your own child safe.
I didn't have too much sympathy after your OP but didn't like to be too harsh as it was obviously a very stressful situation. However after your last statement I'm afraid I have no sympathy at all for anyone in the BSE camp.Please do come round to my place and put a jug of scolding water in front of my 1 year old (grandchild). As I will be watching my grandchild like a hawk, I will move the hot jug and probably the child as well, then I will shout at you for being a moron. When you start laughing and tell me to keep my child safe, I will point out I just have, by paying attention to what's going on around.
Let me know when you want to pop over.
Hondashark said:
Thankfully solicitors are of a different opinion to the bellends blaming us.
Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted someone put her in danger.
That is fully blameable and rightly deserving of compensation. The issue is proving it when you have no CCTV evidence.
The solicitors that also told you you don't have a case?Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted someone put her in danger.
That is fully blameable and rightly deserving of compensation. The issue is proving it when you have no CCTV evidence.
Sounds like you better have your best compo face ready then. Terrible thing to have happened, could have been prevented.
Why was a 1yr old in a position to reach anything on the table?
Post story for opinions and doesn't like opinions.
Hondashark said:
Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted
If you were distracted she wasn't safe. Sorry.Why was a 1yr old in a position to reach anything on the table?
Post story for opinions and doesn't like opinions.
Edited by MightyBadger on Tuesday 30th April 17:40
Hondashark said:
Thankfully solicitors are of a different opinion to the bellends blaming us.
Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted someone put her in danger.
That is fully blameable and rightly deserving of compensation. The issue is proving it when you have no CCTV evidence.
You said they told you that you don't have a case? Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted someone put her in danger.
That is fully blameable and rightly deserving of compensation. The issue is proving it when you have no CCTV evidence.
I'm afraid this now reads like you were just wanting people to agree with you.
It was not even close to being this severe, but we were once out to eat with my 2-year-old and ordered a big sharing platter. The platter included mac and cheese, which came straight out of the oven. The waiter placed the platter in the middle of the table and before we could react, she put her finger right in the middle before letting out a scream.
We were upset but it never crossed my mind to blame the waiter who put the plate on the table. It blistered, but she recovered, maybe I would have felt different if she had pulled it on her lap
We were upset but it never crossed my mind to blame the waiter who put the plate on the table. It blistered, but she recovered, maybe I would have felt different if she had pulled it on her lap
Hondashark said:
Thankfully solicitors are of a different opinion to the bellends blaming us.
Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted someone put her in danger.
That is fully blameable and rightly deserving of compensation. The issue is proving it when you have no CCTV evidence.
Everything that's wrong with modern society in a post. Well done PH well done.Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted someone put her in danger.
That is fully blameable and rightly deserving of compensation. The issue is proving it when you have no CCTV evidence.
Every sympathy for the horrific injuries to your daughter, every parents nightmare, but why is it someone's fault, why is it not an accident why is it deserving of compensation.
Had she ran out in the road, god forbid, when you were both distracted and been hit by a car would that have been seeking compensation too.
This is an emotive thread given the childs terrible pain and injuries but that shouldn't distract from the fact that the intent/theme of the thread is very wrong.
b
hstewie said:
hstewie said: It sounds horrific and I'm not a lawyer but I'm trying to imagine if you're a cafe owner how you can possibly train your staff to legislate for that sort of awful random occurrence.
To be fair it's common sense not to put things containing scalding water within reach of toddlers. Harder to judge whether the parents are actively monitoring.
Hondashark said:
Thankfully solicitors are of a different opinion to the bellends blaming us.
Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted someone put her in danger.
That is fully blameable and rightly deserving of compensation. The issue is proving it when you have no CCTV evidence.
That's an interesting change of attitude. So everyone who disagrees with you a bellend. Super.Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted someone put her in danger.
That is fully blameable and rightly deserving of compensation. The issue is proving it when you have no CCTV evidence.
Evidently your daughter wasn't in a 'position of safety', and if she had been, you allowed it to be compromised. The CCTV would show that both parents left their child within grabbing distance of a boiling teapot wile they chose to attend to other things. That's what you told us.
Just as a reminder, there's no record that your solicitor agrees with you:
Hondashark said:
The solicitor has said to us that as it's now our word against theirs, and that is it as it's up to us to prove their negligence which without CCTV we can't.
I wish your daughter a speedy recovery.Hondashark said:
Thankfully solicitors are of a different opinion to the bellends blaming us.
Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted someone put her in danger.
That is fully blameable and rightly deserving of compensation. The issue is proving it when you have no CCTV evidence.
So why open this up for discussion on here, just tell them to get on with your claim Our daughter was in a position of safety and while we were distracted someone put her in danger.
That is fully blameable and rightly deserving of compensation. The issue is proving it when you have no CCTV evidence.
Countdown said:
simon_harris said:
usually with your house insurance you have some legal cover, you can use that without fear of the cost to pursue this matter.
IME you can only use Legal cover on your insurance policy if they think you've a very good chance of winning. If they think it's a 50:50 they won't cover you.Check your home insurance as stated above - they will want to ensure that you have prospects of success before funding a case as clearly they don't want to waste time and money on hopeless cases.
You can always go back to your current solicitor and ask for a review from a supervisor. Ditto you can try another firm.
The standard of proof in civil matters is the "balance of probabilities" (i.e. what is more likely than not) so not having CCTV isn't necessarily the end of it, your witness evidence (and that of your partner) would be relevant.
Although a lot of PI cases are run on "no win, no fee" models, there is always nothing stopping you from paying privately to take the case to trial.
Personally, I'd avoid the "go to the press" option as the correct forum to resolve something like this is court.
Hondashark said:
I don't know if anything else can be done as it seems slightly unfair.
Back in December I went to morrisons cafe with my 1 year old daughter and then 2 year old son. Ordered 2 pots of tea and some breakfasts.
1 year old was in the high chair and 2 year old playing with his cars. I saw the lady coming with the tea so I picked a couple of books that were in front of me so she could put the tray down and handed them to the Mrs. So when the woman arrived I was getting my 2 year old sat down and the Mrs putting the books away. The Mrs then shouted and I looked up just as my daughter was pulling one of the pots onto her lap as the tray had been put in the middle of the table, not directly infront of my daughter but then still within reach of a hooked finger of a 1 year old.
It peeled all the skin off one thigh, ended up with 5 staff helping us and phoning an ambulance. The ambulances were too busy so had to get her in the car take her to A&E. They then sent us to the specialist children's burns unit in a different hospital.
4 months later she's OK other than scarring which may or may not fade over the next few years.
The Mrs phoned the store the next day to speak to the store manager but she wasnt there so left her number. She then phoned the Mrs 2 days later and the Mrs gave her an update. 10 days after the incident I went in to speak to her to ask if there was any CCTV (there was none) and if we could have done anything different in her immediate first aid (gone through to the kitchen to use a tap etc.).
The Mrs then popped in with the kids a couple of days later to speak to her and by this point she seemed to be in the "oh well she'll live type of attitude".
It was at that point I thought stuff it and spoke to a solicitor recommend by my work union that deal in personal injury.
My main aim was to recoup the cost of 5 x 50 mile round trips to the burns unit, 5 lots of parking, loss of earning as I had to take time off work and the bloody breakfasts we never got. Then some recompense for my daughter which would go in her ISA (I think the going rate for a leg burn is about £10k)
The solicitor wrote to morriosons to ask if they accept liability and for a copy of the accident report.
They took an age to reply but their reply was that they had interviewed the staff member, she said she didn't put it close to my daughter so weren't accepting liability. Also there was no accident report, they didn't fill in the accident book as they didn't have our details. (Which is a ste excuse given all the contact we had with the store manager. I would have thought the incident required a RIDDOR report).
The solicitor has said to us that as it's now our word against theirs, and that is it as it's up to us to prove their negligence which without CCTV we can't.
Is that it though? It seems a bit unfair that they can just say "no we didn't injure her, prove it" and my daughter has to live with scars forever.
I hate the idea of "going to the papers" and don't really see what it would achieve.
There are solicitors and there are solicitors.Back in December I went to morrisons cafe with my 1 year old daughter and then 2 year old son. Ordered 2 pots of tea and some breakfasts.
1 year old was in the high chair and 2 year old playing with his cars. I saw the lady coming with the tea so I picked a couple of books that were in front of me so she could put the tray down and handed them to the Mrs. So when the woman arrived I was getting my 2 year old sat down and the Mrs putting the books away. The Mrs then shouted and I looked up just as my daughter was pulling one of the pots onto her lap as the tray had been put in the middle of the table, not directly infront of my daughter but then still within reach of a hooked finger of a 1 year old.
It peeled all the skin off one thigh, ended up with 5 staff helping us and phoning an ambulance. The ambulances were too busy so had to get her in the car take her to A&E. They then sent us to the specialist children's burns unit in a different hospital.
4 months later she's OK other than scarring which may or may not fade over the next few years.
The Mrs phoned the store the next day to speak to the store manager but she wasnt there so left her number. She then phoned the Mrs 2 days later and the Mrs gave her an update. 10 days after the incident I went in to speak to her to ask if there was any CCTV (there was none) and if we could have done anything different in her immediate first aid (gone through to the kitchen to use a tap etc.).
The Mrs then popped in with the kids a couple of days later to speak to her and by this point she seemed to be in the "oh well she'll live type of attitude".
It was at that point I thought stuff it and spoke to a solicitor recommend by my work union that deal in personal injury.
My main aim was to recoup the cost of 5 x 50 mile round trips to the burns unit, 5 lots of parking, loss of earning as I had to take time off work and the bloody breakfasts we never got. Then some recompense for my daughter which would go in her ISA (I think the going rate for a leg burn is about £10k)
The solicitor wrote to morriosons to ask if they accept liability and for a copy of the accident report.
They took an age to reply but their reply was that they had interviewed the staff member, she said she didn't put it close to my daughter so weren't accepting liability. Also there was no accident report, they didn't fill in the accident book as they didn't have our details. (Which is a s
te excuse given all the contact we had with the store manager. I would have thought the incident required a RIDDOR report).The solicitor has said to us that as it's now our word against theirs, and that is it as it's up to us to prove their negligence which without CCTV we can't.
Is that it though? It seems a bit unfair that they can just say "no we didn't injure her, prove it" and my daughter has to live with scars forever.
I hate the idea of "going to the papers" and don't really see what it would achieve.
Edited by Hondashark on Tuesday 30th April 13:52
You could try these. https://www.hudgellsolicitors.co.uk/ They have a very good rep.
I have a 10 month old baby. Anything within his body length is in his reach more or less. That looks wrong when he's at a table but he can move fast enough to take us by surprise, I couldn't expect some minimum wage waitress to know that. If they put it down close (like the width of the pot) to the table edge near the child I'd say you could have a case, but should also have taken it off the waitress rather than let them do that.
I have to say, morally it is your responsibility. You were at the table. The child is your responsibility. You knew the drinks contained boiling hot water. And if you hadn't have become distracted, the accident wouldn't have happened.
And, as you acknowledged, the waitress placed the tray in the centre of the table, which would seem reasonable to me.
Therefore your idea of "going to the papers" to try and shame them into giving you money could easily backfire. You could find the papers start to blame your negligence for the accident. And, regardless of whether you like the coverage you get, the story will be always be there on the internet. Personally, that isn't a risk I would take.
However, assuming you did want to exert leverage, I wouldn't bother with a solicitor. They are just going to cost you money.
I would raise a MoneyClaim online and formally claim from them. They will then need to contact their insurers and they will have to start spending money to prepare a defence. You can proceed with the claim right up to the court date and it won't cost you anything other than your time and the initial fee to start the process.
If you did this, whilst I don't think you are going to get the £15k you were probably hoping for, they would probably decide at the arbitration phase to pay you a few thousand to go away.
And, as you acknowledged, the waitress placed the tray in the centre of the table, which would seem reasonable to me.
Therefore your idea of "going to the papers" to try and shame them into giving you money could easily backfire. You could find the papers start to blame your negligence for the accident. And, regardless of whether you like the coverage you get, the story will be always be there on the internet. Personally, that isn't a risk I would take.
However, assuming you did want to exert leverage, I wouldn't bother with a solicitor. They are just going to cost you money.
I would raise a MoneyClaim online and formally claim from them. They will then need to contact their insurers and they will have to start spending money to prepare a defence. You can proceed with the claim right up to the court date and it won't cost you anything other than your time and the initial fee to start the process.
If you did this, whilst I don't think you are going to get the £15k you were probably hoping for, they would probably decide at the arbitration phase to pay you a few thousand to go away.
Someone is always to blame, must get a pay out. Fck me what have we become...yes there are lawyers and lawyers scumbags who seek blame when there is none.
We used to be better than this but it's a sad indictment that there are people encouraging him to seek recompense.
To steal an analogy from keith burkinshaw and modify it slightly.
There used to be a society here.
We used to be better than this but it's a sad indictment that there are people encouraging him to seek recompense.
To steal an analogy from keith burkinshaw and modify it slightly.
There used to be a society here.
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff