Reform UK - A symptom of all that is wrong?
Discussion
Wombat3 said:
Is anyone seriously against free school meals for kids that need them? I doubt it.
The problem with making that a much bigger/wider operation is that there is a cost, and knowing the daft way we do things in this country it will be far higher than it should be or needs to be.
Some daft (and likely underqualified) civil servant will give an inflated, minimum volume guaranteed contract to some behemoth like Sodhexo who will then take the piss royally by charging 15 quid a plate for inedible/unidentifiable slop, pizza slices you could tile a floor with and cold chicken nuggets you could use on a snooker table !!
It'll be hospital food only worse because you are not trying to feed 30 or 40 thousand people, there are just over 9 million kids in UK schools.
All these things would be great IF we could deliver them properly and companies didn't take the piss, but they can't and companies will and do.
I believe the cost of a school meal is about £2.40.The problem with making that a much bigger/wider operation is that there is a cost, and knowing the daft way we do things in this country it will be far higher than it should be or needs to be.
Some daft (and likely underqualified) civil servant will give an inflated, minimum volume guaranteed contract to some behemoth like Sodhexo who will then take the piss royally by charging 15 quid a plate for inedible/unidentifiable slop, pizza slices you could tile a floor with and cold chicken nuggets you could use on a snooker table !!
It'll be hospital food only worse because you are not trying to feed 30 or 40 thousand people, there are just over 9 million kids in UK schools.
All these things would be great IF we could deliver them properly and companies didn't take the piss, but they can't and companies will and do.
borcy said:
Wombat3 said:
Is anyone seriously against free school meals for kids that need them? I doubt it.
The problem with making that a much bigger/wider operation is that there is a cost, and knowing the daft way we do things in this country it will be far higher than it should be or needs to be.
Some daft (and likely underqualified) civil servant will give an inflated, minimum volume guaranteed contract to some behemoth like Sodhexo who will then take the piss royally by charging 15 quid a plate for inedible/unidentifiable slop, pizza slices you could tile a floor with and cold chicken nuggets you could use on a snooker table !!
It'll be hospital food only worse because you are not trying to feed 30 or 40 thousand people, there are just over 9 million kids in UK schools.
All these things would be great IF we could deliver them properly and companies didn't take the piss, but they can't and companies will and do.
I believe the cost of a school meal is about £2.40.The problem with making that a much bigger/wider operation is that there is a cost, and knowing the daft way we do things in this country it will be far higher than it should be or needs to be.
Some daft (and likely underqualified) civil servant will give an inflated, minimum volume guaranteed contract to some behemoth like Sodhexo who will then take the piss royally by charging 15 quid a plate for inedible/unidentifiable slop, pizza slices you could tile a floor with and cold chicken nuggets you could use on a snooker table !!
It'll be hospital food only worse because you are not trying to feed 30 or 40 thousand people, there are just over 9 million kids in UK schools.
All these things would be great IF we could deliver them properly and companies didn't take the piss, but they can't and companies will and do.
Or in that case, how no one in the entire government machine could possibly make it work. Which of course, is merely shorthand for the standard right wing view on hardship - suck it up, buttercup. But even they realise they can't get away with that level of honesty, hence tortuous arguments around structure, process and so on.
President Merkin said:
borcy said:
Wombat3 said:
Is anyone seriously against free school meals for kids that need them? I doubt it.
The problem with making that a much bigger/wider operation is that there is a cost, and knowing the daft way we do things in this country it will be far higher than it should be or needs to be.
Some daft (and likely underqualified) civil servant will give an inflated, minimum volume guaranteed contract to some behemoth like Sodhexo who will then take the piss royally by charging 15 quid a plate for inedible/unidentifiable slop, pizza slices you could tile a floor with and cold chicken nuggets you could use on a snooker table !!
It'll be hospital food only worse because you are not trying to feed 30 or 40 thousand people, there are just over 9 million kids in UK schools.
All these things would be great IF we could deliver them properly and companies didn't take the piss, but they can't and companies will and do.
I believe the cost of a school meal is about £2.40.The problem with making that a much bigger/wider operation is that there is a cost, and knowing the daft way we do things in this country it will be far higher than it should be or needs to be.
Some daft (and likely underqualified) civil servant will give an inflated, minimum volume guaranteed contract to some behemoth like Sodhexo who will then take the piss royally by charging 15 quid a plate for inedible/unidentifiable slop, pizza slices you could tile a floor with and cold chicken nuggets you could use on a snooker table !!
It'll be hospital food only worse because you are not trying to feed 30 or 40 thousand people, there are just over 9 million kids in UK schools.
All these things would be great IF we could deliver them properly and companies didn't take the piss, but they can't and companies will and do.
b
hstewie said:
hstewie said: I love how all these people who are definitely not against free school meals out of ideology start off by making it really clear how they're not against free school meals then write paragraphs of why free school meals are a terrible idea 
The sad thing is that there are a number of what I would class as good ideas but the question is how to afford them.12% of all government expenditure is now on debt interest. I can't be bothered to double check the number but that must be around 120bn GBP per year and I would expect, with the Government borrowing 120bn this year alone that 12% on debt interest will be 15% before too long.
and apparently, our highly skilled migration strategy is not helping to reverse that but the 'forecast' is good so lets keep the taps flowing?
I can agree (as I am sure others would agree too) on free school meals, if the portion of the 120bn yearly public borrowing budget deficit, to fund non-capital expenditure is entirely eliminated so it reads +5%
Only then you can expand the welfare state beyond where it is.
To do that you would need to reduce the money we spend on NHS staff, Adult Welfare (tax credits included) and Pensions and give it to the kids.
Vanden Saab said:
Baroque attacks said:
I see the current count results haven’t been refreshed yet. For some reason reform is showing as zero…
16.9% and 117 votes behind the tories.I think a recent poll had them at 15% but it seems apathy is a stronger force at present and if they were to achieve 15% in a GE, under current leadership, I would have expected more than 17% in this by-election.
It is not that surprising as Tice seems a bit of a nonentity. If Farage does decide to return then chances of 15%+ are far stronger. He is very much a marmite politician but has a chunk of the electorate for whom he is an asset.
Carl_VivaEspana said:
bhstewie said:
hstewie said: I love how all these people who are definitely not against free school meals out of ideology start off by making it really clear how they're not against free school meals then write paragraphs of why free school meals are a terrible idea
The sad thing is that there are a number of what I would class as good ideas but the question is how to afford them.12% of all government expenditure is now on debt interest. I can't be bothered to double check the number but that must be around 120bn GBP per year and I would expect, with the Government borrowing 120bn this year alone that 12% on debt interest will be 15% before too long.
and apparently, our highly skilled migration strategy is not helping to reverse that but the 'forecast' is good so lets keep the taps flowing?
I can agree (as I am sure others would agree too) on free school meals, if the portion of the 120bn yearly public borrowing budget deficit, to fund non-capital expenditure is entirely eliminated so it reads +5%
Only then you can expand the welfare state beyond where it is.
To do that you would need to reduce the money we spend on NHS staff, Adult Welfare (tax credits included) and Pensions and give it to the kids.
In the 90s were had a budget SURPLUS and had started paying down debt.
Then Labour went on a spending spree, some of which was needed (NHS, schools, etc), but a lot was wasted on pet projects. Then 2008 happened and the taps got really opened on bailouts. I thought that was bad, and then COVID happened and that's really pushed us over the brink IMO.
The latest increases in IRs have really brought the chickens home to roost. We're now facing a huge debt interest burden.
So IMO we're a bit f*cked.
We've got a nationalist desire from an aging population that want zero immigration
COVID and lockdowns have re-prioritised the workforce's desires for WFH and work/life balance
The NHS is on its knees due to lack of staff and bleeding money on private contracts
Councils are bankrupt after years of underfunding and wastage
Plus there's not the young workforce coming through:
The young have little hope of owning a home, so why bother?
University is eye-wateringly expensive, yet we have a lack of vocational/apprenticeship options
The cupboard is pretty bare. We've already asset stripped ourselves and borrowed ourselves up to our eyeballs.
And more recently a nationalist ideology has come along that has pushed ideas to the forefront that aren't in the best interests of the country.
We desperately need young, fit, enthusiastic, educated people to come here to dig us out of this hole.
£660M so far on the Rwanda thing and it'll only take 6% of the 30k migrants that the govt wants to ship over. Wouldn't it be cheaper to just give them a free house and let them stay?
It's an utterly disgraceful situation TBH.
Edited by LowTread on Friday 3rd May 10:05
President Merkin said:
Interested in the mindset that looks on at a government falling apart in real time over culture wars, an obsession bordering on the prurient with immigration and demonising the vulnerable & thinks what the country needs is this but more.
Interested in a mind set, which after all the evidence of the last 50 years, thinks that voting blue, or red, is going to make any difference for the people of the UK. Except perhaps, for the possibility that they actually make it even worse.They're appealing to their demographic though
Raise the tax free threshold to lift pensioners with private income out of tax
Reduce/remove NHS waiting lists
Stop immigration
Remove wastage in govt spending (which in their terms will mean diversity, mental health, social care, etc)
Get 20% of benefit claimants back into work (somehow)
Basically it's "get the young working more to pay for your better retirement and health care".
Only the young are already disadvantaged and disenfranchised.
And the contradiction in their manifesto is alarming. Stopping immigration AND ending NHS waiting lists?? Really? Have you seen the list of dentists or doctors at your local surgery lately? How many names are from white-british people?
Raise the tax free threshold to lift pensioners with private income out of tax
Reduce/remove NHS waiting lists
Stop immigration
Remove wastage in govt spending (which in their terms will mean diversity, mental health, social care, etc)
Get 20% of benefit claimants back into work (somehow)
Basically it's "get the young working more to pay for your better retirement and health care".
Only the young are already disadvantaged and disenfranchised.
And the contradiction in their manifesto is alarming. Stopping immigration AND ending NHS waiting lists?? Really? Have you seen the list of dentists or doctors at your local surgery lately? How many names are from white-british people?
Pan Pan Pan said:
Interested in a mind set, which after all the evidence of the last 50 years, thinks that voting blue, or red, is going to make any difference for the people of the UK. Except perhaps, for the possibility that they actually make it even worse.
I wonder if at some far off point in the future, the thought might intrude that having made this exact point 450 times in the past month, it needs no further airing? A record with a scratch in human form, a sentient Groundhog day, more repeats than Dad's Army. Sisyphus but with a line of thought instead of a boulder.
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