Christian Horner

[paulguitar]

DonkeyApple said:

Yup. Time by the Lakes on the Italian Euro is certainly not a bad gig. Retirement for someone like that wouldn't be daytime TV and Viking cruises but just doing the things work prevented.

Did you have a bad cruise with Viking?

[Megaflow]

poosemon said:

So, question is....whoever lit a flame underneath this - have they got what they want?

Presuming the deck of cards has now fallen and AN is the only movement, whoever lit the flame has still got CH now as a principle, but has lost the P1 preferred F1 car designed and perhaps biggest asset to Red Bull current day so the possibility that Red Bull 2026 onwards has been weakened significantly?

Assuming there is a single person behind it, I assume not. In fact I suspect this has backfired horribly

[DonkeyApple]

paulguitar said:

Did you have a bad cruise with Viking?

I wouldn't imagine it would be possible to have anything remotely resembling a good one?

[paulguitar]

DonkeyApple said:

paulguitar said:

Did you have a bad cruise with Viking?

I wouldn't imagine it would be possible to have anything remotely resembling a good one?

Never worked for that particular line. But I think they are probably a long way better than, say, Carnival.

[suffolk009]

thegreenhell said:

The pressure on RB and CH will now switch to questioning MV's commitment to the team now that their star designer has quit the team.

Past the end of 2025, I imagine MVs commitment is about zero.

[DonkeyApple]

suffolk009 said:

thegreenhell said:

The pressure on RB and CH will now switch to questioning MV's commitment to the team now that their star designer has quit the team.

Past the end of 2025, I imagine MVs commitment is about zero.

MV, like any temporary hired driver, has never had a commitment to the team, or any team. They have a commitment to themselves and for a moment in time companies can use money and trinkets to hold that aligned to their ambitions.

It's a basic formula. Opportunity for trinkets + money + fame = Willing to do as asked for a while + roll play about being part of a team that they're not ever going to be a part of.

They are just contract workers and MV will go where those around him suggest in both most lucrative for them and him and has the best potential for trophies and more entries in booklets and on boards.

I agree that MV's commitment is zero beyond what his legal co tract obliges. We'll just have to wait and see which other team will pay enough to rent him for a while or whether RB will dig into their pockets and rent him for a bit longer but after what his father has been doing, the trick Marko pulled on him and the whole general mess it would seem a bit weird if he were to hang around.

[NRS]

DonkeyApple said:

suffolk009 said:

thegreenhell said:

The pressure on RB and CH will now switch to questioning MV's commitment to the team now that their star designer has quit the team.

Past the end of 2025, I imagine MVs commitment is about zero.

MV, like any temporary hired driver, has never had a commitment to the team, or any team. They have a commitment to themselves and for a moment in time companies can use money and trinkets to hold that aligned to their ambitions.

It's a basic formula. Opportunity for trinkets + money + fame = Willing to do as asked for a while + roll play about being part of a team that they're not ever going to be a part of.

They are just contract workers and MV will go where those around him suggest in both most lucrative for them and him and has the best potential for trophies and more entries in booklets and on boards.

I agree that MV's commitment is zero beyond what his legal co tract obliges. We'll just have to wait and see which other team will pay enough to rent him for a while or whether RB will dig into their pockets and rent him for a bit longer but after what his father has been doing, the trick Marko pulled on him and the whole general mess it would seem a bit weird if he were to hang around.

It's a lot more likely he will be pulled away elsewhere. Money is of course one thing, but winning is probably equally if not more important. It's less likely RB can offer that going forward, and if he's not on good terms with the boss it becomes easier to pull him away elsewhere. Same for the "normal" workers - with a cost cap for most workers they will get similar wages at each team. In recent times it would make sense for the best to go to RB, as they get a similar wage but also get a very good team. With some of the key players starting to move/tensions in the team it is less likely the 2026 car will be the best, so makes it more likely they might try another team.

[DonkeyApple]

NRS said:

It's a lot more likely he will be pulled away elsewhere. Money is of course one thing, but winning is probably equally if not more important. It's less likely RB can offer that going forward, and if he's not on good terms with the boss it becomes easier to pull him away elsewhere. Same for the "normal" workers - with a cost cap for most workers they will get similar wages at each team. In recent times it would make sense for the best to go to RB, as they get a similar wage but also get a very good team. With some of the key players starting to move/tensions in the team it is less likely the 2026 car will be the best, so makes it more likely they might try another team.

Yup. You've got two strong effects going on. RB still winning, still being the best team which is keeping employees and contractors keen to remain associated and then you have the other effect which is a team potentially heading down and where any employee or contractor who doesn't see a very clear career upside to being in that environment should be cashing chips in.

However, turmoil always brings opportunity. AN has gone but we need to wait and see just how critical that is. Arguably he'd already tried to go before and at 65 really wasn't likely to be there much longer so RB will have created a team around AN to mitigate that. I imagine the real risk to AN leaving isn't actually AN himself but the risk that he might go elsewhere and then rip out the key parts of the team in RB that was created to protect RB from his departure. As a competitor you'd definitely not just want AN but to also lift out a few others to specifically destabilise. Those are your holes below the waterline.

And every team, every competitor for the last few months will have been reviewing the CVS of every key RB employee to see if anyone is of use to them with an aim to capitalise on the opportunity.

It's a mess being inside one of these firms when this sort of thing happens, that I can tell you. . If you want to bail and no one comes to you then everyone low balls when you make the approach as they know the situation. And if you stay you have to completely change alignments to not just protect what you have but to ensure progress for acquiring more.

It's generally why slotting the help is really just such a bad idea and real amateur hour.

[Forester1965]

Yep. Your value as an RB employee will never be higher than now.

Potentially your Red Bull F1 team will never be more valuable than now, although possibly left it too late on the open market as down is the only way from the top. New in-house engine facility and Ford's appetite for buying the whole thing in a couple or three years are the unknowns.

[Muzzer79]

Sgt Joe Roberts said:

Given the history EJ has with moving people into Ferrari that's where I'd be putting my money on for Newey's next employer.

EJ bit Jean Todt's hand off when they came knocking for Eddie Irvine for the 1996 season.

Who else has he moved into Ferrari?

[PlywoodPascal]

DonkeyApple said:

paulguitar said:

Did you have a bad cruise with Viking?

I wouldn't imagine it would be possible to have anything remotely resembling a good one?

Pillage a few monasteries, steal a few relics, kidnap a few slaves, hope for a decent return crossing with decent visibility for navigation….

[Wills2]

deadslow said:

This whole thread is incredibly biased, but wasn't aware Craig Slater was biased - he seems kinda normal.

The last thing Slater seems like is normal, he's a massive odd bod, seems to be having an internal conversation with himself on every piece to camera, appears to have strings attached to his limbs that are under the control of someone else and clearly moonlights as an Alan Partridge impersonator.

But I wouldn't say he was biased as that's impossible to say given that he just serves up a meaningless stream of alphabet soup.

Edited by Wills2 on Thursday 2nd May 10:40

[PlywoodPascal]

He’s 10 years in to a long running bet where he is only allowed to construct sentences from cliches chained back-to-back.

[paulguitar]

PlywoodPascal said:

DonkeyApple said:

paulguitar said:

Did you have a bad cruise with Viking?

I wouldn't imagine it would be possible to have anything remotely resembling a good one?

Pillage a few monasteries, steal a few relics, kidnap a few slaves, hope for a decent return crossing with decent visibility for navigation….

[Tim the pool man]

paulguitar said:

DonkeyApple said:

paulguitar said:

Did you have a bad cruise with Viking?

I wouldn't imagine it would be possible to have anything remotely resembling a good one?

Never worked for that particular line. But I think they are probably a long way better than, say, Carnival.

Is that what you'd call "damning with faint praise"?

I've got Viking on my future cruise list as well as Seaborn and more likely for the next, Celebrity (despite the name which is a word I detest). So far mostly Princess and 1 RC

[DonkeyApple]

PlywoodPascal said:

DonkeyApple said:

paulguitar said:

Did you have a bad cruise with Viking?

I wouldn't imagine it would be possible to have anything remotely resembling a good one?

Pillage a few monasteries, steal a few relics, kidnap a few slaves, hope for a decent return crossing with decent visibility for navigation….

There's an appeal to the traditional Viking cruise but I got the distinct feeling that A: when you watch reruns of the Sweeney the target audience is notably older than oneself and B: modern Viking warriors have a lot of joint and pile discomfort as well as struggling with incontinence and dementia judging by the other adverts.

All in, the he observation being posited was that AN's idea of retirement is likely to be someone busier and more action packed than just buying solar panels and gold coins from cold callers and taking palliative care trips on a boat so as to not agitate the old roids?

[HocusPocus]

Tim the pool man said:

paulguitar said:

DonkeyApple said:

paulguitar said:

Did you have a bad cruise with Viking?

I wouldn't imagine it would be possible to have anything remotely resembling a good one?

Never worked for that particular line. But I think they are probably a long way better than, say, Carnival.

Is that what you'd call "damning with faint praise"?

I've got Viking on my future cruise list as well as Seaborn and more likely for the next, Celebrity (despite the name which is a word I detest). So far mostly Princess and 1 RC

I'd pass on all that and would much prefer a sail on Newey's Oyster 885. Classier way to cruise...which no doubt will have all usual super yacht accoutrements.

[paulguitar]

Tim the pool man said:

paulguitar said:

DonkeyApple said:

paulguitar said:

Did you have a bad cruise with Viking?

I wouldn't imagine it would be possible to have anything remotely resembling a good one?

Never worked for that particular line. But I think they are probably a long way better than, say, Carnival.

Is that what you'd call "damning with faint praise"?

I've got Viking on my future cruise list as well as Seaborn and more likely for the next, Celebrity (despite the name which is a word I detest). So far mostly Princess and 1 RC

Haha, very faint praise!

If I were a cruise punter, I'd be tempted to go with Seabourne.

[TheDeuce]

paulguitar said:

Tim the pool man said:

paulguitar said:

DonkeyApple said:

paulguitar said:

Did you have a bad cruise with Viking?

I wouldn't imagine it would be possible to have anything remotely resembling a good one?

Never worked for that particular line. But I think they are probably a long way better than, say, Carnival.

Is that what you'd call "damning with faint praise"?

I've got Viking on my future cruise list as well as Seaborn and more likely for the next, Celebrity (despite the name which is a word I detest). So far mostly Princess and 1 RC

Haha, very faint praise!

If I were a cruise punter, I'd be tempted to go with Seabourne.

Cruises.. hideous.

I can't get my head around the joy of exploring new places if it's all organised and there's a fixed time limit for how long you stay in each place.

Also the people... Pasty befuddled dumb dumbs that plonk themselves down at the most obvious, most touristy restaurants each time they waddle off the ship

It's just a floating retirement home.

I'm not really a fan of cruises

[paulguitar]

TheDeuce said:

Cruises.. hideous.

I can't get my head around the joy of exploring new places if it's all organised and there's a fixed time limit for how long you stay in each place.

Also the people... Pasty befuddled dumb dumbs that plonk themselves down at the most obvious, most touristy restaurants each time they waddle off the ship

It's just a floating retirement home.

I'm not really a fan of cruises

Depends very much on the cruise line. If you are prepared to pay the money, it can be completely different to your idea of it.