Dist. Seller will only refund if they find fault or resell?

Dist. Seller will only refund if they find fault or resell?

Author
Discussion

porterpainter

Original Poster:

685 posts

39 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
Hi folks,

Under a month ago I bought a 'smart' lock and accompanying keypad for entry.

It's sold as an item pros or DIYs can install. I believe it is installed correctly, but unfortunately it only works about half the time to open my door.

My door doesn't have a handle, just a bar, but the smart lock is designed with this as an option. Theoretically I should be able to walk up to the door and the app should sense I'm close to the house and open the door. Alternatively I can click the open door button on the app, or use the key pad to open the door.

It's really hit and miss as to whether it works, maybe only 50% success. The rest of the time the lock unlocks the door by doesn't open the door (there's two stages to the process). The app thinks the door is open, when really it's just unlocked.

I've gone through the support desk of the manufacturer and they've not been able to offer any solutions to resolve. The manufacturer replied to say they recommend that I carry a back up key, but that defeats the purpose of the smart lock.

I'm at the point now where I don't trust the smart lock to work.

I contacted the selling company (different to the manufacturer) to say that I don't believe the lock is fit for purpose and I would like a refund. Their reply was:

"If there is a fault with the product then a return is absolutely fine, and we would return this to Nuki and you would receive a refund but if there is no fault then a refund would depend on the product being saleable condition."

I am troubled by this. Clearly the boxes for the products have been opened, unwrapped from plastic and I've stuck the keypad on my door frame. It's not therefore in saleable condition anymore.

I have also already been through support and they haven't been able to find a fault or offer a fix. The UK company wants to send this lock back to Austria for them to investigate to see if they can find the fault. The lock moves to an extend when you use the app, but doesn't work on my door, so I'm fairly certain they're going to say it works ... but it's not fit for purpose in my view. Then that gets me back to the point it's not resalable.

It wasn't cheap at best part of £600, so want to check with the greater PH minds before I reply to the seller. Thanks

mcpoot

800 posts

109 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
If you bought it using a credit card you could raise a Section 75 claim.

porterpainter

Original Poster:

685 posts

39 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
mcpoot said:
If you bought it using a credit card you could raise a Section 75 claim.
Thanks for the reply, no it was debit card.

Ham_and_Jam

2,308 posts

99 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
Not sure I know what your exact problem is. So is it-

1. Lock works. Not compatible with your door.

2. Lock works. Maybe needs professional fitting

3. Lock works. Technical issues (wifi / GPS etc)

4. Lock doesn’t work.

5. Something else.

lancslad58

637 posts

10 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
porterpainter said:
Hi folks,

Under a month ago I bought a 'smart' lock and accompanying keypad for entry.

It's sold as an item pros or DIYs can install. I believe it is installed correctly, but unfortunately it only works about half the time to open my door.

My door doesn't have a handle, just a bar, but the smart lock is designed with this as an option. Theoretically I should be able to walk up to the door and the app should sense I'm close to the house and open the door. Alternatively I can click the open door button on the app, or use the key pad to open the door.

It's really hit and miss as to whether it works, maybe only 50% success. The rest of the time the lock unlocks the door by doesn't open the door (there's two stages to the process). The app thinks the door is open, when really it's just unlocked.

I've gone through the support desk of the manufacturer and they've not been able to offer any solutions to resolve. The manufacturer replied to say they recommend that I carry a back up key, but that defeats the purpose of the smart lock.

I'm at the point now where I don't trust the smart lock to work.

I contacted the selling company (different to the manufacturer) to say that I don't believe the lock is fit for purpose and I would like a refund. Their reply was:

"If there is a fault with the product then a return is absolutely fine, and we would return this to Nuki and you would receive a refund but if there is no fault then a refund would depend on the product being saleable condition."

I am troubled by this. Clearly the boxes for the products have been opened, unwrapped from plastic and I've stuck the keypad on my door frame. It's not therefore in saleable condition anymore.

I have also already been through support and they haven't been able to find a fault or offer a fix. The UK company wants to send this lock back to Austria for them to investigate to see if they can find the fault. The lock moves to an extend when you use the app, but doesn't work on my door, so I'm fairly certain they're going to say it works ... but it's not fit for purpose in my view. Then that gets me back to the point it's not resalable.

It wasn't cheap at best part of £600, so want to check with the greater PH minds before I reply to the seller. Thanks
It could be a fault with the app not the door lock itself.Have you got the latest version of the app.

porterpainter

Original Poster:

685 posts

39 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
Ham_and_Jam said:
Not sure I know what your exact problem is. So is it-

1. Lock works. Not compatible with your door.

2. Lock works. Maybe needs professional fitting

3. Lock works. Technical issues (wifi / GPS etc)

4. Lock doesn’t work.

5. Something else.
3, 4 or 5

porterpainter

Original Poster:

685 posts

39 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
lancslad58 said:
It could be a fault with the app not the door lock itself.Have you got the latest version of the app.
Yes, all the latest versions of the app and firmware.

FMOB

1,130 posts

14 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
porterpainter said:
Ham_and_Jam said:
Not sure I know what your exact problem is. So is it-

1. Lock works. Not compatible with your door.

2. Lock works. Maybe needs professional fitting

3. Lock works. Technical issues (wifi / GPS etc)

4. Lock doesn’t work.

5. Something else.
3, 4 or 5
Could be anything, can you share make/model? At least it failed safe rather opening the door for anyone.

What was the insurers view of fitting a smart lock?

Rough101

1,859 posts

77 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
Th Nuki locks I have seen simply spin the key in the existing lock, so I’d imagine there would be an issue if there was any significant friction on the bolt or lock.

If it’s one of those doors that need pulled or pushed when locking, I can’t see it working.

I’d say if it works fine locking and unlocking with the door open that you are probably on a hiding to nothing.

Edited by Rough101 on Tuesday 21st May 19:48

porterpainter

Original Poster:

685 posts

39 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
FMOB said:
Could be anything, can you share make/model? At least it failed safe rather opening the door for anyone.

What was the insurers view of fitting a smart lock?
Not looking for solutions or insurance matters to be honest. Just the situation with regards to returning the item and my rights.

Ive been exchanging emails with the manufacturer support and they’ve not been able to solve when it’s sometimes working and sometimes not.

Ham_and_Jam

2,308 posts

99 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
Rough101 said:
Th Nuki locks I have seen simply spin the key in the existing lock, so I’d imagine there would be an issue if there was any significant friction on the bolt or lock.

If it’s one of those doors that need pulled or pushed when locking, I can’t it working.

I’d say if it works fine locking and unlocking with the door open that you are probably on a hiding to nothing.
Thats why I asked the questions earlier.

I was going to put one on my elderly parents front door for ease of access for various people.

Their door occasionally requires a bit of a pull or jiggle to lock / unlock and the handle lifted. After a bit of research I realised the Nuki would be suitable.

porterpainter

Original Poster:

685 posts

39 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
Rough101 said:
Th Nuki locks I have seen simply spin the key in the existing lock, so I’d imagine there would be an issue if there was any significant friction on the bolt or lock.

If it’s one of those doors that need pulled or pushed when locking, I can’t it working.

I’d say if it works fine locking and unlocking with the door open that you are probably on a hiding to nothing.
I can’t name and shame but good guess wink

It’s 100% compatible with my door type.

The problem is that it’s not working, it opens (ie pulls the catches all the way back) only about half the time.

Ham_and_Jam

2,308 posts

99 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
porterpainter said:
I can’t name and shame but good guess wink

It’s 100% compatible with my door type.

The problem is that it’s not working, it opens (ie pulls the catches all the way back) only about half the time.
It sounds that it may be compatible with your ‘door type’ but not your exact door model.

porterpainter

Original Poster:

685 posts

39 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
Ham_and_Jam said:
Thats why I asked the questions earlier.

I was going to put one on my elderly parents front door for ease of access for various people.

Their door occasionally requires a bit of a pull or jiggle to lock / unlock and the handle lifted. After a bit of research I realised the Nuki would be suitable.
At this point I can’t recommend one.

My door is only 2 years old, no issues with the mechanism.

My mother in law lost her key to our house, so my other half wanted our lock changed. Decided to get the smart lock so the MIL could just use a code on the keypad (and not have another key to use) but you can’t trust it to work.

porterpainter

Original Poster:

685 posts

39 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
Ham_and_Jam said:
It sounds that it may be compatible with your ‘door type’ but not your exact door model.
huh?

Ham_and_Jam

2,308 posts

99 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
porterpainter said:
At this point I can’t recommend one.

My door is only 2 years old, no issues with the mechanism.

My mother in law lost her key to our house, so my other half wanted our lock changed. Decided to get the smart lock so the MIL could just use a code on the keypad (and not have another key to use) but you can’t trust it to work.
Thanks for heads up, although just realised the big typo in that quote.

Should read ‘the Nuki wouldn’t be suitable’

Ham_and_Jam

2,308 posts

99 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
porterpainter said:
huh?
Door type covers all manufacturers and door styles. Your model may have a quirk that they haven’t allowed for.

porterpainter

Original Poster:

685 posts

39 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
From the website:


“No lever? No problem.

If your door has a long handle instead of a lever, then XXX will still work just fine. There’s an escutcheon version included in the box that brings full smart functionality to your door, without having to change the exterior handle.”

My door is an escutcheon lock. There’s no other details of models or compatibility beyond that, so I think I should be able to assume it works.



dundarach

5,152 posts

230 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
From their perspective, you bought a £600 Nuki Smartlock over a month ago which has developed a fault, or is faulty.

One would assume it wasn't delivered faulty as you've taken 30 days to discover the fault, or you've waited to install it or report it, either way the seller has an item which is a month old and has developed a fault.

If it had been faulty, or not suitable within 14 days you could have simply returned it.

If this was a TV, you'd expect the seller to attempt to fix the product, not sure what's different here?

So either it is faulty, in which case they are legally allowed to try and repair or replace it, it's £600 you should expect them to want to determine whether it is faulty.

It's installed incorrectly, sorry not sure it's the sellers issue.

Or it doesn't meet the specification it claims, in which case explain this very clearly and refer to the data where it states something it doesn't do.

Sounds to me that the issues are choppy wifi - do you have a booster is this the issue?

The app, does your phone meet the specs, is it too old \ new?

Or it's just duff, in which case return it.

At this point, what has the seller done wrong?

FMOB

1,130 posts

14 months

Tuesday 21st May
quotequote all
Having just watched the installation guide I would never install that on a property.

Yes it might be smart tech but it is just a glorified key turner that requires the actual key to be in the lock and looks very vulnerable to just being levered or kicked off the door to reveal the key.

Easier than snapping a euro barrel.