Scottish Politics / Independence - Vol 12

Scottish Politics / Independence - Vol 12

Author
Discussion

biggbn

27,174 posts

235 months

Friday 10th May 2024
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Yahonza said:
biggbn said:
Evercross said:
Snow and Rocks said:
I actually think you're both agreeing with each other.
Probably, but Scots wasn't the issue (and its amazing how some people get defensive when you mention it). Harper is the issue, and her showboating insistence on talking what she thinks is 'Scots' makes her incompetence at it all the more galling, because she is a person who literally struggles to string a coherent sentence together even when she isn't attempting to effect what she believes to be 'talking in Scots'.

She should practice the basic skills before attempting something more esoteric.

Angela Constance is another one - intellectually challenged and incapable of anything beyond basic communication and I wouldn't put her in charge of running a bath, yet both her and Harper have become permanent fixtures in the upper echelons of the SNP.
Nae defensiveness here EV, the conversation took a tangential diversion is all. I don't think Scots is a language, hardly defensive!!
It certainly is and has old English / Germanic roots. I'm not keen on people being down on our culture and I am definitely with the nats on that one.
But I'm not being down on 'our culture', if Scots is a language, so are other local dialects that have grown from similar roots. This was and is the point I'm making. There is still lots of debate over whether Scots is a language or a dialect, for me it's a bdisation of English, which itself has its roots in the Germanic language of early settlers. I think its a hugely important part of our culture, which is another point I'm making, is still evolving and is still in use every day. Whether its a stand alone language or not does not diminish its importance to our cultural heritage, and those trying to deny it exists or suggest its only an 'old' language run the risk of condemning it to the status of Gaelic, a vibrant language that was banned in an act of cultural apartheid. I meet people from all over the world who have thick accents, or a poor grasp of 'our' language or simply don't use the same intonations and rhythms that we do. It never occurs to me to exhort them to speak properly, why would I do so to a Glaswegian, a Dundonian, whatever? Hell, call it a language of you like, I struggle with that concept but again, that's just me out in my lonely furrow...and whatever its called, embrace it, its part of our collective soul.

Anyhoo, my opinion ain't worth a damn because it IS a language and is recognised as such, so my linguistic pedantry matters not a jot beer

Edited by biggbn on Friday 10th May 21:01

csd19

2,343 posts

132 months

Friday 10th May 2024
quotequote all
irc said:
sherman said:
Swinneys says Indy is achievable by 2029 rofl
https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/12655739/joh...
Continuity. Indy always just round the next corner. Actually just dishonest. There is a good chance Labour will need Scottish MPs for a comfortable majority after the next election. No chance of another indyref unless support for it is well over 50% for a good period of time. If they couldn't move the dial with Brexit and Boris no chance with a UK Labour govt.
Continuity fkwittery of the highest order, wouldn't expect anything less!

irc

8,889 posts

151 months

Friday 10th May 2024
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The cabinet reacts to John Swinney claiming we can be independent by 2029.

biggbn

27,174 posts

235 months

Friday 10th May 2024
quotequote all
irc said:


The cabinet reacts to John Swinney claiming we can be independent by 2029.
Caption time....

'Then, Yousaf said she'd be no loss to the SNP....'

'Then, Yousaf binned the greens off....'

'Then he tried to sue the nursery...'

'Then they made ME leader of the party....'

Big Rod

6,251 posts

231 months

Friday 10th May 2024
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biggbn said:
<snip>
Anyhoo, my opinion ain't worth a damn because it IS a language and is recognised as such, so my linguistic pedantry matters not a jot beer
I disagree entirely.

So called 'Scots' is a pathetic attempt at indoctrinating some sort of national identity when it's not actually required.

Everyone knows we speak 'funny'. So does the rest of the world.

Some sort of mutual benchmark should be embraced rather than try to establish something that doesn't exist for the sake of being 'Scottishy'. There's plenty of Scottishness to go around without shoving it down other people's thrapples.

biggbn

27,174 posts

235 months

Friday 10th May 2024
quotequote all
Big Rod said:
biggbn said:
<snip>
Anyhoo, my opinion ain't worth a damn because it IS a language and is recognised as such, so my linguistic pedantry matters not a jot beer
I disagree entirely.

So called 'Scots' is a pathetic attempt at indoctrinating some sort of national identity when it's not actually required.

Everyone knows we speak 'funny'. So does the rest of the world.

Some sort of mutual benchmark should be embraced rather than try to establish something that doesn't exist for the sake of being 'Scottishy'. There's plenty of Scottishness to go around without shoving it down other people's thrapples.
....again, I don't think it's a language. Interesting debate though.

Big Rod

6,251 posts

231 months

Friday 10th May 2024
quotequote all
biggbn said:
....again, I don't think it's a language. Interesting debate though.
OK, I'll acknowledge that I maybe misread and I apologise.

I'm still aggrieved that it was needlessly foisted upon my children. It serves no purpose and a complete waste of funds that could be used more productively elsewhere.


csd19

2,343 posts

132 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
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irc said:


The cabinet reacts to John Swinney claiming we can be independent by 2029.
Maybe he meant they'll all be standing as independents by 2029? scratchchin

Composer62

2,130 posts

101 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
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Big Rod said:
biggbn said:
....again, I don't think it's a language. Interesting debate though.
OK, I'll acknowledge that I maybe misread and I apologise.

I'm still aggrieved that it was needlessly foisted upon my children. It serves no purpose and a complete waste of funds that could be used more productively elsewhere.
"Scots" isn't a "language" it's a collection of local dialects in the same way that "English" is. The version that Robert Burns wrote down is no more definitive than "Scouse" is to English.

Mercdriver

3,000 posts

48 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
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Interesting debate though.



No it’s not!

biggbn

27,174 posts

235 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
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Composer62 said:
"Scots" isn't a "language" it's a collection of local dialects in the same way that "English" is. The version that Robert Burns wrote down is no more definitive than "Scouse" is to English.
A point I made earlier...

Leithen

13,045 posts

282 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
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Composer62 said:
"Scots" isn't a "language" it's a collection of local dialects in the same way that "English" is. The version that Robert Burns wrote down is no more definitive than "Scouse" is to English.
scratchchin

I see what you are getting at, but English is a "Language". All languages change over time - the modern version being the dominant language of the world, if not by numbers (Mandarin far outstripping everything else), but by being the standard in so many areas.

Klippie

3,608 posts

160 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
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The Greens...they must be raging, first being kicked out of government and now Swinney back tracking on thier policies, the other day Harvie was cleary very angry at FMQ, I wonder how long it will be till the toys are well and truly chucked out the pram.

As much as they all want to keep their snouts in the trough Harvie can't help being an angry wee man when he doesn't get his own way and may at some point think to hell with them were off.

Just a thought.

biggbn

27,174 posts

235 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
quotequote all
About time we got back on topic in this wonderful area where all people want is to be able to voice an alternative view to the accepted one without being vilified and victimised... thumbup

A.J.M

8,193 posts

201 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
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The talk of Scot’s language reminded me of the poem from the baby box we got last October.

Is this the caricature of “Scot’s” she’s trying to mimic?
As it’s utter cringe gibberish.

Does anyone on here speak like this in real life?

irc

8,889 posts

151 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
quotequote all
Klippie said:
The Greens...they must be raging, first being kicked out of government and now Swinney back tracking on thier policies, the other day Harvie was cleary very angry at FMQ, I wonder how long it will be till the toys are well and truly chucked out the pram.

As much as they all want to keep their snouts in the trough Harvie can't help being an angry wee man when he doesn't get his own way and may at some point think to hell with them were off.

Just a thought.
Just real life kicking over ambitious green virtue signalling targets in the baws. They were never going to meet the 2030 targets. The easy wins have been done. Shut coal power stations. Shut Ravenscraig etc while offshoring manufacturing and CO2 to China. Once they started coming for people's cars, gas boilers, and wood burners there was always going to be a reckoning.

As for Harvie? Shut your face until you are using a heat pump in your flat before telling other people how to heat their homes.

And the gender bill? Which part of Supreme Court don't you understand? That bill is as dead as the bottle return scheme.

biggbn

27,174 posts

235 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
quotequote all
A.J.M said:


The talk of Scot’s language reminded me of the poem from the baby box we got last October.

Is this the caricature of “Scot’s” she’s trying to mimic?
As it’s utter cringe gibberish.

Does anyone on here speak like this in real life?
I hear almost every one of those words if not daily then weekly, but used in conversation. But christ, that poem, whilst not gibberish...you can understand it after all, is appalling, isn't it? And yes, cringeworthy

sherman

14,429 posts

230 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
quotequote all
biggbn said:
A.J.M said:


The talk of Scot’s language reminded me of the poem from the baby box we got last October.

Is this the caricature of “Scot’s” she’s trying to mimic?
As it’s utter cringe gibberish.

Does anyone on here speak like this in real life?
I hear almost every one of those words if not daily then weekly, but used in conversation. But christ, that poem, whilst not gibberish...you can understand it after all, is appalling, isn't it? And yes, cringeworthy
If you spoke like that in Edinburgh you would definetly be regarded as a Ned.

alangla

5,652 posts

196 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
quotequote all
Front page of today’s Herald https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c72pg9geezko
Jack McConnell saying “I felt that we had to create a Scottish Parliament to take control of our education system and then drive it to be world class again”

That went well…

Anyway, hasn’t education always been a responsibility of the Scottish Office and not something (practically) dealt with by Westminster?

Ian974

3,092 posts

214 months

Saturday 11th May 2024
quotequote all
sherman said:
biggbn said:
A.J.M said:


The talk of Scot’s language reminded me of the poem from the baby box we got last October.

Is this the caricature of “Scot’s” she’s trying to mimic?
As it’s utter cringe gibberish.

Does anyone on here speak like this in real life?
I hear almost every one of those words if not daily then weekly, but used in conversation. But christ, that poem, whilst not gibberish...you can understand it after all, is appalling, isn't it? And yes, cringeworthy
If you spoke like that in Edinburgh you would definetly be regarded as a Ned.
How many different versions of "one" do you need to include in a single two verse poem?