Sportsmanship - Does it exist in F1?
Discussion
Someone mentioned - I forget who - that there were no winners in sport, including F1, that were sportsmen and that they would do anything to achieve the "W". Whilst many will lower themselves (in my opinion) and show a lack of character in order to do so, I do not believe that is true, also of many.
In answering the poster, I put Efren "The Magician" Reyes forward as an example of a consummate sportsman. He has gained the respect of anyone and everyone that has ever held a cue, including the likes of Steve Davis and Rocket Ron, Bob Seigel and Earl Strickland to name a few.
His story is incredible. From sleeping on his uncle's table in a billiards hall as a boy, to inspiring the Tom Cruise film, "The Color of Money" - based around a money game for $100,000 in the 1980's that took place in HK between Efren and Earl Strickland. Efren's claw back to win was the stuff of legend.
Efren is the best ever rotation player I have ever witnessed (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotation_(pool) ), a game that is incredibly difficult in complexity. He introduced the attacking kick and kick safe the the US pool game... The Buddha of Billiards.
Always a consummate gentleman. An approachable, unassuming and humble sportsman, who will be remembered forevermore as one of the best ever to wield a stick.
Please forgive his English.
I believe F1 does have, and has had, sporting champions. My modern era choices are:
Mika
Kimi
Lewis
Button
In no particular order....and all have minimal slightly dubious moments, but overall they were/are sporting in their behavior
But the floor is open for debate. Off you go....!!
In answering the poster, I put Efren "The Magician" Reyes forward as an example of a consummate sportsman. He has gained the respect of anyone and everyone that has ever held a cue, including the likes of Steve Davis and Rocket Ron, Bob Seigel and Earl Strickland to name a few.
His story is incredible. From sleeping on his uncle's table in a billiards hall as a boy, to inspiring the Tom Cruise film, "The Color of Money" - based around a money game for $100,000 in the 1980's that took place in HK between Efren and Earl Strickland. Efren's claw back to win was the stuff of legend.
Efren is the best ever rotation player I have ever witnessed (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotation_(pool) ), a game that is incredibly difficult in complexity. He introduced the attacking kick and kick safe the the US pool game... The Buddha of Billiards.
Always a consummate gentleman. An approachable, unassuming and humble sportsman, who will be remembered forevermore as one of the best ever to wield a stick.
Please forgive his English.
I believe F1 does have, and has had, sporting champions. My modern era choices are:
Mika
Kimi
Lewis
Button
In no particular order....and all have minimal slightly dubious moments, but overall they were/are sporting in their behavior
But the floor is open for debate. Off you go....!!
fizzwheel said:
Stirling Moss defending Mike Hawthorn to reverse a disqualification that the stewards were about to apply in 1958 which meant Moss lost that years championship to Hawthorn springs to mind.
Different era, different times, but that one always springs to mind when this sort of thing is discussed.
Can't see any driver in the modern era doing anything like that now though.
Yes, that took immense strength of character and understanding of what defines sportsmanship. A similar strength that Lewis showed after AD, but for accepting the decision of the stewards.Different era, different times, but that one always springs to mind when this sort of thing is discussed.
Can't see any driver in the modern era doing anything like that now though.
FeelingLucky said:
Difficult to debate any of those four, except perhaps to say Mika (IMO) was both an exceptionally sporting competitor and lovely person in general.
I only ever recall Mika being the same. Before his accident he was quicker over one lap than Schumi, but marginally less consistent over a full race distance. I may be wrong, but I only ever remember him mentioning on one occasion him being slightly unimpressed, and that was when he saw on German media that Schumi said he had seen Mika overtaking at Macau, to take him out for the F3 title. Just after the race he had said he had not seen him. Otherwise he generally praised.Mika's racing was, as you say, exceptionally sporting given the lengths/track limits Schumi would go to, especially given they were so closely matched in terms of talent.
chris_gilmartin said:
Peter Collins gave his car to Fangio, and gave up his crack at the championship in the process, see https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2016/nov/25...
Yes indeed. Different times, but still the best of their times.entropy said:
PhilAsia said:
chris_gilmartin said:
Peter Collins gave his car to Fangio, and gave up his crack at the championship in the process, see https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2016/nov/25...
Yes indeed. Different times, but still the best of their times.He died at the 1958 French GP, a race allegedly he supposed to have to won to pay off gambling debts but due to the friendship of Hawthorn and Collins, Musso was pushed to the limits and to his death.
LukeBrown66 said:
paul, I would say those drivers were similarly able to drive within their limits to win, and Mario had a huge advantage with the 79 let's face it. Graham, was a grafter, and a hard taskmaster just like Colin, Rindt was a total natural and butted heads with Champman a lot, and Emmo, I dont really know much about, before my time, and not really written about much despite his winning.
Nobody could take their focus off his huge conk!"I..., I'm sorry....., what did you say again?"
entropy said:
PhilAsia said:
entropy said:
PhilAsia said:
chris_gilmartin said:
Peter Collins gave his car to Fangio, and gave up his crack at the championship in the process, see https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2016/nov/25...
Yes indeed. Different times, but still the best of their times.He died at the 1958 French GP, a race allegedly he supposed to have to won to pay off gambling debts but due to the friendship of Hawthorn and Collins, Musso was pushed to the limits and to his death.
It’s been said Musso should have been allowed to win the 1958 French GP to help pay off those debts but this was never formally confirmed and only his then girlfriend alleges this and blames the rivalry with Hawthorn/Collins – the Brits were best mates and pooled their prized money together.
Whatever you think of Musso and the background to his death it is perhaps easy to look back on past eras and say they were different times when there were possible shades of grey. The driving standards were generally far, far better than today but then there was Giuseppe Farina who was notorious for his chopping and blocking manoeuvres.
paulguitar said:
Bo_apex said:
philasia - are you really trying to compare the generosity of Stirling Moss with LH losing in AD and not sticking his bottom lip out ?
Referring to Hamilton's extraordinarily dignified behaviour after the disgrace of AD as 'not sticking his bottom lip out' is properly pathetic, even for you.Bo_apex said:
paulguitar said:
Bo_apex said:
paulguitar said:
Bo_apex said:
philasia - are you really trying to compare the generosity of Stirling Moss with LH losing in AD and not sticking his bottom lip out ?
Referring to Hamilton's extraordinarily dignified behaviour after the disgrace of AD as 'not sticking his bottom lip out' is properly pathetic, even for you.Hamilton only kept his bottom lip tucked in because Anthony had a word in his ear before the microphone appeared.
It was a very smart move by Anthony. Always there when his boy needs him.
and vice versa
Cute
Bo_apex said:
PhilAsia said:
Bo_apex said:
paulguitar said:
Bo_apex said:
paulguitar said:
Bo_apex said:
philasia - are you really trying to compare the generosity of Stirling Moss with LH losing in AD and not sticking his bottom lip out ?
Referring to Hamilton's extraordinarily dignified behaviour after the disgrace of AD as 'not sticking his bottom lip out' is properly pathetic, even for you.Hamilton only kept his bottom lip tucked in because Anthony had a word in his ear before the microphone appeared.
It was a very smart move by Anthony. Always there when his boy needs him.
and vice versa
Cute
Sounds like you're missing a good ole fashioned sausagefest in Soho.
Grab your lycra shorts.
Standard lashing out.
Bo_apex said:
PhilAsia said:
Bo_apex said:
PhilAsia said:
Bo_apex said:
paulguitar said:
Bo_apex said:
paulguitar said:
Bo_apex said:
philasia - are you really trying to compare the generosity of Stirling Moss with LH losing in AD and not sticking his bottom lip out ?
Referring to Hamilton's extraordinarily dignified behaviour after the disgrace of AD as 'not sticking his bottom lip out' is properly pathetic, even for you.Hamilton only kept his bottom lip tucked in because Anthony had a word in his ear before the microphone appeared.
It was a very smart move by Anthony. Always there when his boy needs him.
and vice versa
Cute
Sounds like you're missing a good ole fashioned sausagefest in Soho.
Grab your lycra shorts.
Standard lashing out.
Please report to Peter Windsor
Bo_apex said:
DOCG said:
But what about the incident with Alonso in Hungary qualifying? The media fully blamed Alonso for it, and of course as an 11 year old I believed them. Then years later I found out that it was Hamilton who broke the internal team agreement to give Alonso the optimum qualifying lap (it alternated race-by-race), but the media never said a word about it! Alonso was simply portrayed as the villain for the rest of the season.
Marc Priestley did a YouTube video explaining the circumstances in detail.
Biased British media are very good at what they doMarc Priestley did a YouTube video explaining the circumstances in detail.
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