Why aren't all cars LPG?
Discussion
micawrx said:
I'm guessing the HGV's mix it with the Diesel, rather than replacing
Partly right, not actually mix, but it is called "LPG assistance" and, quite frankly isn't worth doing.The problem is LPG needs either a spark, or A.N.Other source of ignition, as it will not auto ignite under pressure like diesel.
AFAIK they simply add a bit of gas & take out a bit of diesel to give the same effect, alas the cost is the same as a full conversion, so MAJOR INTERGALLACTIC miles are required to recoup the cost.
My experience is that I have a 530i e39, which I had converted, it does 240 miles to a tank (in the wheel well) averages 27 MPG whilst carrying round my heavy right foot, this equates to over 50 MPG in money terms, has paid me back in under 12 months at 10,000/year average, works faultlessly, is imperceptible in use & well worth every penny.
EarlOfHazard said:
In london there's a go kart track and the karts are lpg. They're good fun!!
Aren't some or all of Palmersport's cars at Bedford run on LPG? If not now they certainly used to be. I wonder if they ever saw any long-term engine maintenance issues running gas? Especially when you consider the continuous merciless thrashings their cars seemed to get. 
. Some of us must remember how weird it was to have a diesel car or even a small van. Diesel was going to save the world as apparently it was less polluting and it was much cheaper than petrol.
Now everyone drives them, the fuel costs more than petrol and they are not less polluting. Go figure about what would happen to LPG if it became popular.
Now everyone drives them, the fuel costs more than petrol and they are not less polluting. Go figure about what would happen to LPG if it became popular.
When Vauxhall offered them around 1% off their sales were LPG so really wasnt worth it. We sold 1 Zafira to a private individual and ran an Astra LPG as a demo. Made a bit of sense when there were government grants on the go it could be justifiable for more people but without it for the majority of people the figures just never stacked up for most.
2DDav said:
When Vauxhall offered them around 1% off their sales were LPG so really wasnt worth it.
Made a bit of sense when there were government grants on the go it could be justifiable for more people but without it for the majority of people the figures just never stacked up for most.
I just don't understand this ^^^Made a bit of sense when there were government grants on the go it could be justifiable for more people but without it for the majority of people the figures just never stacked up for most.
A new car purchase doesn't make financial sense but LPG pays for itself in around a year for normal cars with normal usage (25-30mpg 12-15k)
It also seems strange that most of the Vauxhalls that were converted were the smaller engined ones where they tend to do less miles and the payback takes longer.
We converted my wife's Mazda6 and it paid for itself in approx a year.
ArmaghMan said:
littleredrooster said:
I can promise you that you would NOT want to have a big shunt on the motorway with an LPG car...
Absolutely....with that giant Petrol tank .Because as everyone knows petrol is much much easier to ignite than LPG.
I had an impreza that I had converted, the tank was held in by rubber straps which did their job and broke away in the accident. The tank was undamaged apart from some scratches.
There are solenoids at the engine end of the fuel pipes and on the tank so if anything does go wrong all that you will loose is the gas in the pipes. The fire brigade went nuts when they saw the tank but soon calmed down. As it happened I was on fumes that day anyway.
I would drive around in another LPG car without an issue.
Another fan of LPG here, luckily I bought my VXR8 already fitted with a BRC sequential system and didn't pay any additional premium for it (it also had some tuning bits and pieces too). I wasn't specifically looking for one with LPG, but I'm so glad I bagged this one.
It runs beautifully, I do notice a very slight reduction in performance but I get 40mpg on a cost basis, not bad for a 6.0L V8!!
I get to drive a great car with an awesome soundtrack every day of the week.
240 mile range and I only loose the spare wheel well. I still have a full size petrol tank and the VXR8 will happily return 27mpg on a steady cruise on that.
I've had no issues getting LPG, even back in 2000 when I had a V8 Discovery I think only once I had to search for gas because the motorway services were out, it was a bit more critical back then as I had twin 39L tanks were the fuel tank was and a small 8 gallon petrol tank for back up.
Stef
It runs beautifully, I do notice a very slight reduction in performance but I get 40mpg on a cost basis, not bad for a 6.0L V8!!
I get to drive a great car with an awesome soundtrack every day of the week.
240 mile range and I only loose the spare wheel well. I still have a full size petrol tank and the VXR8 will happily return 27mpg on a steady cruise on that.
I've had no issues getting LPG, even back in 2000 when I had a V8 Discovery I think only once I had to search for gas because the motorway services were out, it was a bit more critical back then as I had twin 39L tanks were the fuel tank was and a small 8 gallon petrol tank for back up.
Stef
Fell into LPG ownership 6 months ago when looking to save on the monthly fuel bill (previous Fiat Coupe 20VT). Budget dictated that i'd be looking at leggy diesels with potential turbo/injector/pump problems so began to look for already converted LPG cars. Ebay search returned a E46 325 M Sport with a BRC conversion less than 50 miles away. Relatively poorly advertised so picked it up at a good price.
Ironically i've since halved my weekly mileage but gotta say i felt pretty smug filling the tank this month at 63.9 a litre (69.9p less 6p Texaco loyalty card). Negatives - being really picky the initial throttle response isn't quite as sharp on LPG vs petrol. And as others have mentioned not all stations have LPG, but it's not a great inconvienience for the savings.
Ironically i've since halved my weekly mileage but gotta say i felt pretty smug filling the tank this month at 63.9 a litre (69.9p less 6p Texaco loyalty card). Negatives - being really picky the initial throttle response isn't quite as sharp on LPG vs petrol. And as others have mentioned not all stations have LPG, but it's not a great inconvienience for the savings.
darren f said:
EarlOfHazard said:
In london there's a go kart track and the karts are lpg. They're good fun!!
Aren't some or all of Palmersport's cars at Bedford run on LPG? If not now they certainly used to be. I wonder if they ever saw any long-term engine maintenance issues running gas? Especially when you consider the continuous merciless thrashings their cars seemed to get. . Pretty much the only things that don't run on LPG are the karts, which are the least professional part of the day.
C
When I worked at a Jeep dealer we came across a few conversions. Every one of them flicked the EM light on as soon as they switched on to gas.
One owner was adamant that his misfire was down to the plug leads even thought I proved it by clearing the fault codes and driving the car on petrol. As soon as I switched it onto gas the light came on and a cylinder dropped out.
The gas conversion was fitted by "two Polish guys who really know what they're doing".
So obviously it was the 8 month old plug leads that were faulty then...
One owner was adamant that his misfire was down to the plug leads even thought I proved it by clearing the fault codes and driving the car on petrol. As soon as I switched it onto gas the light came on and a cylinder dropped out.
The gas conversion was fitted by "two Polish guys who really know what they're doing".
So obviously it was the 8 month old plug leads that were faulty then...
ArmaghMan said:
littleredrooster said:
I can promise you that you would NOT want to have a big shunt on the motorway with an LPG car...
Absolutely....with that giant Petrol tank .Because as everyone knows petrol is much much easier to ignite than LPG.
Cheers
moreflaps said:
propane ignition temperature =470. petrol =280. Hmm now which one will ignite more easily?
Cheers
If the impact is severe enough to rupture a tank the last thing you'd need to worry about would be the ignition points of petrol vs gas.Cheers
Edited by anonymous-user on Monday 17th June 11:18
Mound Dawg said:
When I worked at a Jeep dealer we came across a few conversions. Every one of them flicked the EM light on as soon as they switched on to gas.
Not all cars like gas... Big Jeeps had piston liner problems (found out after asking a Jeep Dealer principle why rather than dropping the price of his Hemis's by 10000UKP, just get LPG and charge the list price... He went into detail about LPG)3.5 V6 GDI Shoguns/Pajero's don't like it as it burns the end of the GDI Injectors off (increased heat)
My 3.9 V8 Disco was great on its antique LPG system after a few tweaks.
A friend has had 5 LPG cars.. 2 x RR HSE, A 3.7 Cherokee (BCM light issues!), and a Nissan Primera GT that went to his uncle.. a low mile conversion that is now on 250000 miles. He loves the stuff
Eyes wide open and you can get cheap motoring!
ratty6464 said:
would a V8 M3 run ok with an lpg conversion?
If so how much roughly would it cost? And would it give any long term engine issues with injectors / engine management etc?
Palmersport run a fleet of them. They work OK.If so how much roughly would it cost? And would it give any long term engine issues with injectors / engine management etc?
Edited to add gratuitous shot of them:
C
Edited by CraigyMc on Monday 17th June 08:37
ratty6464 said:
would a V8 M3 run ok with an lpg conversion?
If so how much roughly would it cost? And would it give any long term engine issues with injectors / engine management etc?
A decent sequential system is around £2,000 fitted.If so how much roughly would it cost? And would it give any long term engine issues with injectors / engine management etc?
Long term issues very much depends on the engine, some suffer from valve seat recession due to the gas burning dry and not providing that slight cushion between the valves seats and valves, you can use something like Flashlube to provide a slight mist of lubricant to inject with the gas.
Other that that LPG burns cleaner so generally for example your oils stays relatively clear between changes.
Stef
V8RX7 said:
Some have mentioned that Scoobies run hot and as LPG runs hotter it isn't advisable - I suspect that if you want to do a rally stage flick it onto petrol but LPG would be fine 99% of the time.
I know of three Imprezas running on gas with no issues so far.A rally school near me also uses exclusively LPG cars.
I had a 330ci on it and recently a V8 Grand Cherokee. I could never tell whether it was on petrol or gas, the switchover was seamless and it pulled like a bloody freight train on both.
The only thing to watch out for is they are more sensitive to ignition issues. So plugs and leads need to be in optimum condition. As said though, a decent kit (mine were Prins) fitted by someone that knows what they're doing is paramount.
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