EVs... no one wants them!
Discussion
Harry H said:
Must admit I'm tempted to duck a toe in at the moment as a second hand car for errands, dog duties etc. Either a Jag iPace or the Merc one. Can't remember it's name as it's white goods. I mean, who can remember the model designation of their washing machine or tumble dryer.
Such a lot of transport for the money. Relatively speaking as cheap as chips.
As it will mainly be used by the Mrs most of the time for going to the gym and Sainsbury's we'd only need to plug it in once every couple of weeks. I'll keep the V8 twin turbo for proper trips as I'm not ready for journey planning and the lottery of a free/working charger just yet.
I didn't think to reply to it at the time, but yesterday Auto810graphy mentioned that the one EV they struggle to sell is the i-Pace. I wonder if that's because of the insurance - a mate got one and ended up taking a black box policy as the quotes were so high. I checked with my details and most EVs are £6-800 ish - i-Pace started at £1800.Such a lot of transport for the money. Relatively speaking as cheap as chips.
As it will mainly be used by the Mrs most of the time for going to the gym and Sainsbury's we'd only need to plug it in once every couple of weeks. I'll keep the V8 twin turbo for proper trips as I'm not ready for journey planning and the lottery of a free/working charger just yet.
I'm very tempted to get an EV as a family "pool car" just to try one out - but I'm looking at things like 2-3 yr old Hyundai Kona!
survivalist said:
TheRainMaker said:
survivalist said:
On longer journeys we usually have a roof box and some bikes on the back p. - EV rsnge drops like a stone.
That is a bit of an exaggeration; mine is a bit worse, but not massively.Fully loaded with a roof box and travelling at motorway speeds in the summer is around 200 miles, in the winter around 170 miles.
Once a year, we travel from Surrey up to Scotland, it adds around 20 mins to the journey by taking the EV (433 miles).
If we stop overnight halfway (young kids), it doesn't add any time as we stop at a hotel with chargers.
- testing seems to suggest 15-20% range impact. Add that to the 20% impact of cruising at 90mph compared to 60 and it's a reasonably big impact. Whole point for us was not to stop in a hotel and cover 700 miles in a day. And none of the places we've stayed in France or Spain have had destination charging. For me, as things stand today, it adds too much time and hassle.
One thing to think about, the roof rack I have has an 80mph top speed limit, they are probably playing safe with that, but you never know
Edited by TheRainMaker on Monday 13th May 17:03
Sheepshanks said:
I didn't think to reply to it at the time, but yesterday Auto810graphy mentioned that the one EV they struggle to sell is the i-Pace. I wonder if that's because of the insurance - a mate got one and ended up taking a black box policy as the quotes were so high. I checked with my details and most EVs are £6-800 ish - i-Pace started at £1800.
I'm very tempted to get an EV as a family "pool car" just to try one out - but I'm looking at things like 2-3 yr old Hyundai Kona!
Oooh, hadn't got that far, no wonder the Jag is so cheap. The Mrs is far too brand conscious so a Hyundai isn't gonna fly either. All our other household appliances are Miele etcI'm very tempted to get an EV as a family "pool car" just to try one out - but I'm looking at things like 2-3 yr old Hyundai Kona!
braddo said:
Unreal said:
This kind of sums up how different people are. Let the car decide? Utterly mystifying to me. Not knowing where we're going other than a few milestone destinations is one of the major attractions.
Why is it mystifying that people don't do the same thing as you? The way of travelling as you describe represents a small minority of the trips that UK people make in mainland Europe. You are mainly describing:1. people who are bimbling about in campervans and caravans
2. people bimbling about on long driving holidays - probably retired.
The majority of people are driving to a single destination (e.g. skiing, summer holiday etc). An EV that recommends places to stop for charging is hardly a big impediment to those people's holidays.
Harry H said:
Can't remember it's name as it's white goods. I mean, who can remember the model designation of their washing machine or tumble dryer.
I find this sort of subtle anti-EV snobbery quite bizarre. I don't remember anyone speaking the same way about diesels, which (in most cases) are equally 'white goods'.
Sheepshanks said:
I didn't think to reply to it at the time, but yesterday Auto810graphy mentioned that the one EV they struggle to sell is the i-Pace. I wonder if that's because of the insurance - a mate got one and ended up taking a black box policy as the quotes were so high. I checked with my details and most EVs are £6-800 ish - i-Pace started at £1800.
£1800 to insure?! 
I quite like the look of an iPace as a second-hand buy but annual insurance at that sort of level would be a deal breaker for me - need to run some details through a comparison website or two to see what sort of numbers they throw out!
ETA: Just run my details through Money Supermarket and a 2021 iPace HSE came out at around £675 with a £425 compulsory excess; for comparison a 2022 Polestar 2 (Dual motor model) was £450 with a £225 compulsory excess. Adding a £250 voluntary excess brought the premiums down to £590 and £400 respectively. So the iPace was more expensive to insure than the other EV I picked but not as bad as I was fearing!
Edited by JNW1 on Monday 13th May 18:18
JackJarvis said:
Harry H said:
Can't remember it's name as it's white goods. I mean, who can remember the model designation of their washing machine or tumble dryer.
I find this sort of subtle anti-EV snobbery quite bizarre. I don't remember anyone speaking the same way about diesels, which (in most cases) are equally 'white goods'.
Unreal said:
JackJarvis said:
Harry H said:
Can't remember it's name as it's white goods. I mean, who can remember the model designation of their washing machine or tumble dryer.
I find this sort of subtle anti-EV snobbery quite bizarre. I don't remember anyone speaking the same way about diesels, which (in most cases) are equally 'white goods'.
The miles it does and where doesn't really count much for emissions when considered in a wider context, yet there will be some who are irritated by its very existence and continued use. The child inside me finds that slightly amusing.
That's exactly what HE expect - have you seen the signs saying Jxx nnMins (where nn is a not a real time number and they left out 1 vital piece of the jigsaw)
That's just hilariously so far off the mark with so many who have zero knowledge of UK geography, which motorway goes roughly where, road numbering system and general basics outside their own little insular neighbourhood that one sometimes wonder what they use to keep their ears apart.
The PH demographic is very different from many of the ignorant amongst us.
FiF said:
DonkeyApple said:
For U.K. it's just drive as by one's early 20s you know where the motorways are and where they go, you've even worked out the road numbering system which helps with clues that you're in Scotland when you planned to go to Cornwall.
Firstly apologies for the selective quote.That's just hilariously so far off the mark with so many who have zero knowledge of UK geography, which motorway goes roughly where, road numbering system and general basics outside their own little insular neighbourhood that one sometimes wonder what they use to keep their ears apart.
The PH demographic is very different from many of the ignorant amongst us.
Edited by dmsims on Monday 13th May 18:12
JackJarvis said:
Harry H said:
Can't remember it's name as it's white goods. I mean, who can remember the model designation of their washing machine or tumble dryer.
I find this sort of subtle anti-EV snobbery quite bizarre. I don't remember anyone speaking the same way about diesels, which (in most cases) are equally 'white goods'.
What kind of weirdo (us lot…) knows what engine their car has, or the driven wheels? An EV just is a more efficient appliance.
Unless you have a ‘special’ engine, they’re generally dull as ditchwater either petrol or diesel.
JackJarvis said:
Harry H said:
Can't remember it's name as it's white goods. I mean, who can remember the model designation of their washing machine or tumble dryer.
I find this sort of subtle anti-EV snobbery quite bizarre. I don't remember anyone speaking the same way about diesels, which (in most cases) are equally 'white goods'.
. Just google 'mapped 335D Pistonheads'. EVs are just the next iteration or generally bland, generic wagon that happens to attract the tax aficionado. And they'll always have the Micky taken. After EVs it'll be something else.
When you've got a motorbike, all cars are White Goods a lot of the time.
When you're sat in a traffic queue, it doesn't make ever so much difference whether you're in a Merc Coupe or a Merc Sprinter or a Smart.
A lot of people are happy with their cars being White Goods.
If it does exactly what you want, ever time with no trauma, it's only of interest when it goes wrong, just like the washing machine.
When you're sat in a traffic queue, it doesn't make ever so much difference whether you're in a Merc Coupe or a Merc Sprinter or a Smart.
A lot of people are happy with their cars being White Goods.
If it does exactly what you want, ever time with no trauma, it's only of interest when it goes wrong, just like the washing machine.
liner33 said:
. Chieveley services .......... I went in there on Friday at 6pm and there was a massive queue for them,
^ ^ Why did you even try Chieveley at 6pm on a Friday, especially if it was Bank Holiday weekend.I'd avoid it at that time for anything at all, never mind charging.
Everyone knows that (in the south of England) Friday night going south or west is a no-no.
TheRainMaker said:
survivalist said:
TheRainMaker said:
survivalist said:
On longer journeys we usually have a roof box and some bikes on the back p. - EV rsnge drops like a stone.
That is a bit of an exaggeration; mine is a bit worse, but not massively.Fully loaded with a roof box and travelling at motorway speeds in the summer is around 200 miles, in the winter around 170 miles.
Once a year, we travel from Surrey up to Scotland, it adds around 20 mins to the journey by taking the EV (433 miles).
If we stop overnight halfway (young kids), it doesn't add any time as we stop at a hotel with chargers.
- testing seems to suggest 15-20% range impact. Add that to the 20% impact of cruising at 90mph compared to 60 and it's a reasonably big impact. Whole point for us was not to stop in a hotel and cover 700 miles in a day. And none of the places we've stayed in France or Spain have had destination charging. For me, as things stand today, it adds too much time and hassle.
One thing to think about, the roof rack I have has an 80mph top speed limit, they are probably playing safe with that, but you never know
Edited by TheRainMaker on Monday 13th May 17:03
Have never considered speed limits on roof bars / boxes. Did a couple of laps (well BTG) of the Nordschleife with a roof box once - the box really made its presence felt there. That was a company car though, so no real concerns about longevity.
confused_buyer said:
Big Nanas said:
I suppose the other issue with the earlier LEAFs is the Chademo charge connectors. Seems to be far fewer of those in the public charging domain, which definitely will make planing longer distances a problem.
(I may be wrong on this, but whenever I've stopped, there seems to be fewer of those connectors - Gridserve used to do them, but their newer installs don't seem to have any).
All LEAFs have Chademo up to and including the last one made this year (I may be wrong on this, but whenever I've stopped, there seems to be fewer of those connectors - Gridserve used to do them, but their newer installs don't seem to have any).
If not, then it's possible that Chademo will disappear, and any Leaf will become a local-journey only car within 5 years, as the Chademo charge points wear out and don't get replaced. I can't see a reliable national network still being there.
Is there any possibility of a converter lead being produced? Not sure if I'd trust one from AliExpress if it's taking 300 amps into my car ...
JNW1 said:
Sheepshanks said:
I didn't think to reply to it at the time, but yesterday Auto810graphy mentioned that the one EV they struggle to sell is the i-Pace. I wonder if that's because of the insurance - a mate got one and ended up taking a black box policy as the quotes were so high. I checked with my details and most EVs are £6-800 ish - i-Pace started at £1800.
£1800 to insure?! I quite like the look of an iPace as a second-hand buy but annual insurance at that sort of level would be a deal breaker for me - need to run some details through a comparison website or two to see what sort of numbers they throw out!
ETA: Just run my details through Money Supermarket and a 2021 iPace HSE came out at around £675 with a £425 compulsory excess; for comparison a 2022 Polestar 2 (Dual motor model) was £450 with a £225 compulsory excess. Adding a £250 voluntary excess brought the premiums down to £590 and £400 respectively. So the iPace was more expensive to insure than the other EV I picked but not as bad as I was fearing!
Unreal said:
I was talking in the specific context of a European tour, not driving to a single destination and back like a flight to and from a resort.
Well that's strange, because the context of the comments was not about a 'European tour'. It was simply about travelling long distance in an EV. And you couldn't contemplate that someone knows their journey when they're travelling in Europe, as if a car telling you where charge points are ruins a holiday.
OutInTheShed said:
When you've got a motorbike, all cars are White Goods a lot of the time.
When you're sat in a traffic queue, it doesn't make ever so much difference whether you're in a Merc Coupe or a Merc Sprinter or a Smart.
A lot of people are happy with their cars being White Goods.
If it does exactly what you want, ever time with no trauma, it's only of interest when it goes wrong, just like the washing machine.
I think that 99% of all cars are and have always been white goods. Occasionally we own something that stands out and gets cherished but generally they're just utility transport boxes with different stickers on them that get bought, passed around multiple users, abused, used and slung in the bin. It just seems that in recent years that most people have really just treated them as that more than before. Which will probably be regretted when there are few ICE versions left as people just didn't look after them. When you're sat in a traffic queue, it doesn't make ever so much difference whether you're in a Merc Coupe or a Merc Sprinter or a Smart.
A lot of people are happy with their cars being White Goods.
If it does exactly what you want, ever time with no trauma, it's only of interest when it goes wrong, just like the washing machine.
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