Emira V6 reviews out - Anyone cancelled or changed to i4 ???
Discussion
Hi there
So a mixed bag on reviews.
Those who have orders locked in and were set on a V6 manual, have the array of reviews made you consider cancelling your order or changing over to an AMG powered car?
I am somewhat tempted to see if I can change my order to an i4 AMG base car and I will keep flying the V6 flag and keep my Exige alongside it.
I have heard Chris Harris thinks the V6 is awesome and his review airs in this series on Top Gear and potentially this Sunday, if Harris says its the next best thing will be interesting, I think he tested the white 007 VP car, was that on Cup 2 tyres and sports suspension can anyone remember?
The studio has a green car, not sure if they drive this on the road or not though, this Sunday should reveal.
So a mixed bag on reviews.
Those who have orders locked in and were set on a V6 manual, have the array of reviews made you consider cancelling your order or changing over to an AMG powered car?
I am somewhat tempted to see if I can change my order to an i4 AMG base car and I will keep flying the V6 flag and keep my Exige alongside it.
I have heard Chris Harris thinks the V6 is awesome and his review airs in this series on Top Gear and potentially this Sunday, if Harris says its the next best thing will be interesting, I think he tested the white 007 VP car, was that on Cup 2 tyres and sports suspension can anyone remember?
The studio has a green car, not sure if they drive this on the road or not though, this Sunday should reveal.
Bit of a cock up overall from Lotus letting the Press test unfinished pre production cars especially on track with Goodyear F1s.
However as ever I'd take most of the reviews thus far with a pinch of salt especially Bovingdons which appeared a joke although Harry Metcalfs appeared resonably good and relatively impartial overall despite him having obvious skin in the game with an FE V6 on order.
Await the Harris review with interest hopefully on TG this Sunday.
Tend to think the Emira will be a good package and usable overall daily lukewarm car with obviously stunning looks and a decent interior but as a driver focused car it will as expected and previously posted fall well short of Porsche offerings particularly the 718 GT4 despite recent price increases and stopping production.
Difficult to decide what the V6 is all about and drawbacks of the engine and drivetrain overall without a proper test drive which should be possible soon I've deferred and changed my order to Spring 2023 currently favouring the £4k cheaper I4 FE which atm appears to be the more attractive alternative.
However as ever I'd take most of the reviews thus far with a pinch of salt especially Bovingdons which appeared a joke although Harry Metcalfs appeared resonably good and relatively impartial overall despite him having obvious skin in the game with an FE V6 on order.
Await the Harris review with interest hopefully on TG this Sunday.
Tend to think the Emira will be a good package and usable overall daily lukewarm car with obviously stunning looks and a decent interior but as a driver focused car it will as expected and previously posted fall well short of Porsche offerings particularly the 718 GT4 despite recent price increases and stopping production.
Difficult to decide what the V6 is all about and drawbacks of the engine and drivetrain overall without a proper test drive which should be possible soon I've deferred and changed my order to Spring 2023 currently favouring the £4k cheaper I4 FE which atm appears to be the more attractive alternative.
Yeah, I’m really surprised how the reviews turned out especially after pretty glowing praise from all around the VP car which was doing the rounds a few months back.
Yes the issues around set up and tyres probably have something to do with it but the criticisms of the gearbox and pedal placement seem to vary between journos and do hint towards a lack of quality control.
Why on earth Lotus decided to give the motoring press cars which were not 100% dynamically when it was clear that it would be in comparison tests straight away is beyond me. Unless of course these cars really are the finished article in which case it’s a real shame from what I’ve read.
I personally don’t want another turbo and only want a manual so it has to be the V6 lump for me although I do think that the AMG unit sounds like it could improve a lot of the issues.
I’m set to be driving it for the day the week after next though so will wait until then to make a final call.
Yes the issues around set up and tyres probably have something to do with it but the criticisms of the gearbox and pedal placement seem to vary between journos and do hint towards a lack of quality control.
Why on earth Lotus decided to give the motoring press cars which were not 100% dynamically when it was clear that it would be in comparison tests straight away is beyond me. Unless of course these cars really are the finished article in which case it’s a real shame from what I’ve read.
I personally don’t want another turbo and only want a manual so it has to be the V6 lump for me although I do think that the AMG unit sounds like it could improve a lot of the issues.
I’m set to be driving it for the day the week after next though so will wait until then to make a final call.
BertBert said:
Redline88 said:
I’m set to be driving it for the day the week after next though so will wait until then to make a final call.
That sounds fun. How have you managed that?If you’re interested in the LDA then they have various options from a short blast on the Hethel test track up to the full day programme. If it’s anywhere near as good as it was historically then it should be great.
CrgT16 said:
I would go for a V6 with manual and touring suspension. Saying that if I was ordering I would want to see what the i4 sounds like.
Is there a substantial weight savings compared to the V6?
What are the lead times for an order placed now?
Last info on UK lead times ordering now is c70 weeks. Be interesting seeing whether this reduces or increases following the reviews.Is there a substantial weight savings compared to the V6?
What are the lead times for an order placed now?
Other aspect to consider against the i4 apart from the weightier gearbox (but lighter engine) is the likely parasitic losses from the dct gearbox which will inevitably effectively reduce the 360 bhp further so possibly actual maybe c350bhp at the driven wheels whereas the V6 will presumably have the full headline spec bhp figure.
Gasolina said:
Why should the DCT have significantly more parasitic losses than a manual then?
It is totally not an issue, you'd never notice it.What you will notice is the shorter ratios and quicker shift, so with DCT 360HP will feel more like 400+ HP. Hence why the DCT is 4.2s VS 4.3s for the V6.
The 400HP DCT car in China is like 3.8-3.9s so it is fair to say the AMG DCT with 450HP will be around 3.5s tuned.
Gasolina said:
I'm sure it isn't an issue.
My point was that from the research I've read in terms of transmission characteristics, a modern DCT is said to be on par with a manual geartbox in term of parasitic losses and beats all-comers (manual, slush-box and CVT) on efficiencies in terms of economy and acceleration.
This is why they are taking over the world whether we like it or not.
All things being equal a DCT will have more losses simply because more gears are in mesh. As has been said this is offset by lower ratios, faster changes and (in this case) more low end torque.My point was that from the research I've read in terms of transmission characteristics, a modern DCT is said to be on par with a manual geartbox in term of parasitic losses and beats all-comers (manual, slush-box and CVT) on efficiencies in terms of economy and acceleration.
This is why they are taking over the world whether we like it or not.
Edited by Gasolina on Friday 10th June 13:02
Gasolina said:
a modern DCT ...... beats all-comers (manual, slush-box and CVT) on efficiencies in terms of economy and acceleration.
This is why they are taking over the world whether we like it or not.
Bang on target. And never forget the BIG problem with engineering any manual these days - the high risk of abuse by the driver. Stick a computer in the middle and that risk goes away. This is why they are taking over the world whether we like it or not.
The CAR magazine review is much more positive:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5sLT4mvZH8
They seem to suggest that, given how well they've seen a DCT and 4 pot combination work in the Alpine, it could prove to be a very good combo in the Emira. With the addition of supercar looks and better steering.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5sLT4mvZH8
They seem to suggest that, given how well they've seen a DCT and 4 pot combination work in the Alpine, it could prove to be a very good combo in the Emira. With the addition of supercar looks and better steering.
Gasolina said:
I get where your'e coming from on the face of it but I've read numerous research suggesting otherwise.
.
See chapter 7 in this link as an example
National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine - Cost, Effectiveness, and Deployment of Fuel Economy Technologies for Light-Duty Vehicles. Washington, DC: The National Academies Press
Science FTW
The discussion on transmissions is in Chapter 5 not 7 and says the DCT losses are similar to manual transmissions - ignoring the fact that DCTs have more gears in mesh at any one time. They are really making the point that they are far more efficient than slushboxes. Have a look at Porsche cars and you will find that PDK (DCT) models have (slightly) lower top speeds than their manual counterparts as a result of the (albeit small) extra parasitic losses. .
See chapter 7 in this link as an example
National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine - Cost, Effectiveness, and Deployment of Fuel Economy Technologies for Light-Duty Vehicles. Washington, DC: The National Academies Press
Science FTW
Edited by Gasolina on Friday 10th June 14:01
Now, of course the extra (higher) gearing that the extra ratios allow can certainly make the parasitic losses of the engine lower by needing fewer revs so the car AS A WHOLE, has at least at cruising speeds, less parasitic losses despite the gearbox having slightly more.
I was a bit deflated by the reviews but still on track for my V6 MT car. Orders in, Nov/Dec expected delivery. No interest in the DCT for me. For this car it’s MT or nothing.
I do wish EVO wasn’t the first review I watched. It was probably one of the most negative and I saw mostly negative points in the following videos even if they were more neutral or positive.
It was quite surprising to me given the mostly enthusiastic reviews of the PPV car a couple months ago. I never expected the car to be better all around than a Cayman GTS. I love Porsche but I wanted a better looking, better built Evora GT. Given the obvious looks, and the carryover drivetrain I thought they were pretty much there. I’ve been In the car in person.( static) I had no real complaints about fit and finish.
I’m still going ahead with my purchase because I don’t have a plan B. I do wish there were just more smiles and less niggles about sound, gearshift levers, too skinny or too fat steering wheels. I need to drive the car. I know I’m frequently not on the same page as many reviewers. I’m using real money and they aren’t so our priorities are different. ( except Harry in this case
)
I do wish EVO wasn’t the first review I watched. It was probably one of the most negative and I saw mostly negative points in the following videos even if they were more neutral or positive.
It was quite surprising to me given the mostly enthusiastic reviews of the PPV car a couple months ago. I never expected the car to be better all around than a Cayman GTS. I love Porsche but I wanted a better looking, better built Evora GT. Given the obvious looks, and the carryover drivetrain I thought they were pretty much there. I’ve been In the car in person.( static) I had no real complaints about fit and finish.
I’m still going ahead with my purchase because I don’t have a plan B. I do wish there were just more smiles and less niggles about sound, gearshift levers, too skinny or too fat steering wheels. I need to drive the car. I know I’m frequently not on the same page as many reviewers. I’m using real money and they aren’t so our priorities are different. ( except Harry in this case
)GreasyHands said:
I was a bit deflated by the reviews but still on track for my V6 MT car. Orders in, Nov/Dec expected delivery. No interest in the DCT for me. For this car it’s MT or nothing.
I do wish EVO wasn’t the first review I watched. It was probably one of the most negative and I saw mostly negative points in the following videos even if they were more neutral or positive.
It was quite surprising to me given the mostly enthusiastic reviews of the PPV car a couple months ago. I never expected the car to be better all around than a Cayman GTS. I love Porsche but I wanted a better looking, better built Evora GT. Given the obvious looks, and the carryover drivetrain I thought they were pretty much there. I’ve been In the car in person.( static) I had no real complaints about fit and finish.
I’m still going ahead with my purchase because I don’t have a plan B. I do wish there were just more smiles and less niggles about sound, gearshift levers, too skinny or too fat steering wheels. I need to drive the car. I know I’m frequently not on the same page as many reviewers. I’m using real money and they aren’t so our priorities are different. ( except Harry in this case )
Go back and take a look at the earlier pre prod reviews (apparently the latest reviews are pre production too - go figure!) and you’ll hear more caveats and actually a lot that wasn’t said. Apart from looks.I do wish EVO wasn’t the first review I watched. It was probably one of the most negative and I saw mostly negative points in the following videos even if they were more neutral or positive.
It was quite surprising to me given the mostly enthusiastic reviews of the PPV car a couple months ago. I never expected the car to be better all around than a Cayman GTS. I love Porsche but I wanted a better looking, better built Evora GT. Given the obvious looks, and the carryover drivetrain I thought they were pretty much there. I’ve been In the car in person.( static) I had no real complaints about fit and finish.
I’m still going ahead with my purchase because I don’t have a plan B. I do wish there were just more smiles and less niggles about sound, gearshift levers, too skinny or too fat steering wheels. I need to drive the car. I know I’m frequently not on the same page as many reviewers. I’m using real money and they aren’t so our priorities are different. ( except Harry in this case
)It’s still not going to be a bad car and it will be different from a Porsche. And it does look extremely pretty.
Im starting to think of it as an alternative to a second hand 2015-ish era Aston, not a modern performance car but strong on looks and feel good or a prettier Evora 400, then I think it makes more sense.
I really can’t believe Lotus would allow that car out without the Cup 2s, all of the criticism of understeer would (in my opinion) be totally invalid, I moved from a 350 Exige on whatever the OEM tyres were to a 410 on Cup 2s, the front end grip was night and day different.
Even if Lotus thought it might rain the journos would have made allowances for the conditions rather than criticising the car / chassis.
Even if Lotus thought it might rain the journos would have made allowances for the conditions rather than criticising the car / chassis.
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