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Johno

7,589 posts

166 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Rossi goes to Yamaha, ends his career there.

Cal will go to Ducati and it will end his GP career. As Rossi's team mate he stood a chance, as Haydens he doesn't stand a chance of seeing the kind of development investment needed to make the bike more suited to everyone, unless he can adapt or have a style that works on the bike.

Johno

7,589 posts

166 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
sprinter1050 said:
yes

And let it not be forgotten that for all the "greatness bestowed upon C Stoner Esq" he has still not achieved as many championships nor over anything like as long a career as the previous greats, Agostini, Lawson, Spencer, Bayliss, Doohan, Rossi, Fogarty, even Capirossi to name but 8.
Hope this doesn't spark the usual debate.
Age old debate about comparisons across time, but can we at least keep it to GP World Championship winners in the premier class, which takes out 3 of your list straight away. (Fogarty, Bayliss, Capirossi)

Then who won on more than 1 manufacturer machine, reduce list by another 2. (Spencer, Doohan)

Then at least compare in the modern era, reduces it to Rossi and Lawson. (Agostini)

I agree, let's not have the debate as I am playing devils advocate, but you could add dozens of tother multiple world champs, what about Dougie Lampkin hehe

Turn7

10,843 posts

105 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Johno said:
Rossi goes to Yamaha, ends his career there.

Cal will go to Ducati and it will end his GP career. As Rossi's team mate he stood a chance, as Haydens he doesn't stand a chance of seeing the kind of development investment needed to make the bike more suited to everyone, unless he can adapt or have a style that works on the bike.
Not so sure about Cal there, after all, evryone knows teh Duke is a POS, so if he has a poor season, its the bike right ?

Besides, the money cant be bad as a factory rider either....

twizellb

1,866 posts

96 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
If Cal ends up at Ducati, which now looks highly likely I can't see him doing anything but crash his brains out over the course of next season.
I sincerely hope I'm wrong but..............

Yazza54

13,056 posts

65 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
twizellb said:
If Cal ends up at Ducati, which now looks highly likely I can't see him doing anything but crash his brains out over the course of next season.
I sincerely hope I'm wrong but..............
Hmmm


Hoping Audi blow their brains out and spend fortunes on sorting it out.
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therealsnazbaz

310 posts

79 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Yazza54 said:
Hmmm


Hoping Audi blow their brains out and spend fortunes on sorting it out.
I really don't think money is the issue!

Yazza54

13,056 posts

65 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
therealsnazbaz said:
Yazza54 said:
Hmmm


Hoping Audi blow their brains out and spend fortunes on sorting it out.
I really don't think money is the issue!
Well someone at ducati must know how to manufacture a decent motorbike!!!

Turn7

10,843 posts

105 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Yazza54 said:
Well someone at ducati must know how to manufacture a decent motorbike!!!
You're assuming Ducati accept its the bike at fault....

mrdelmonti

1,391 posts

65 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Turn7 said:
Yazza54 said:
Well someone at ducati must know how to manufacture a decent motorbike!!!
You're assuming Ducati accept its the bike at fault....
That wouldn't be the Audi way, it's never the machinery at fault, always the driver/rider!

Apriliaer

835 posts

42 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Yazza54 said:
People are banging on about chassis, swingarms etc etc but he's still not had the main problem solved that he has asked for which is the engine config.

Also all this 'Hayden is performing on the desmo and Rossi isn't'

bks. Hayden is probably trying harder to make the thing work but he and the bike as a unit are no means performing.
So Rossi is an expert on engine configuration now too is he? With the progress they've made changing everything but the engine, at Rossi's request, they should definately throw a few more millions at that too, just to be sure! Remember Ducati had a front-running machine, before they got a new rider in...

And Rossi is doing a better job than Hayden too?

What you smoking?

Anyway, I digress from delusional fanboy baiting for a moment. Rossi will undoubtedly do better on a factory Yamaha and I hope the move happens. That bike is looking the best all-rounder and with Stoner gone and Spies looking out of his depth I hope Rossi gets a shot. I'm not a fan, but I like a good come back.

Any news on Redding's factory Ducati test today? Had a google but found nowt.

John D.

10,210 posts

93 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Rat_Fink_67 said:
Stoner that's behind his team mate in the points (a team mate that's often referred to as overrated)? Yeah he's talented, but his style obviously just suited the Ducati, of which other riders' hasn't. The guy's good, but i think in the passage of time his name will get lost.
Stoner the only rider whose style suited the Ducati. Ok. Ever considered that's because he is better than most that have tried?

I'm not a huge fan of Stoner (much more fond of Rossi for instance!), but he is a truly incredible racer. Shame he's packing it in.

I'd be happy to see Rossi on something he can mix it with front runners again. Its been long enough. He's blatantly still got it. Look how quick he has been in the wet where theres less grip and load through the bike.

FourWheelDrift

61,121 posts

168 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Valentino Rossi denies has has decided to leave Ducati - http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/101683

"Valentino Rossi denies he has decided to call time on his Ducati career, saying the lure of winning on three different manufacturers still appeals to him."


Suzuki next year then hehe

Biker's Nemesis

25,893 posts

92 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Apriliaer said:
So Rossi is an expert on engine configuration now too is he? With the progress they've made changing everything but the engine, at Rossi's request, they should definately throw a few more millions at that too, just to be sure! Remember Ducati had a front-running machine, before they got a new rider in...

And Rossi is doing a better job than Hayden too?

What you smoking?

Anyway, I digress from delusional fanboy baiting for a moment. Rossi will undoubtedly do better on a factory Yamaha and I hope the move happens. That bike is looking the best all-rounder and with Stoner gone and Spies looking out of his depth I hope Rossi gets a shot. I'm not a fan, but I like a good come back.

Any news on Redding's factory Ducati test today? Had a google but found nowt.
To be fair the engine causing the handling problems has been discussed for quite a while. Stoner has been the only rider able to get results on the 2007 onwards bike.

Look how many good riders have been beat by the Ducati, they can't all be wrong.

Apriliaer

835 posts

42 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Biker's Nemesis said:
To be fair the engine causing the handling problems has been discussed for quite a while. Stoner has been the only rider able to get results on the 2007 onwards bike.

Look how many good riders have been beat by the Ducati, they can't all be wrong.
Possibly is the 'problem', I'm sure if they had identified that before re-designing the entire bike over the course of 1 1/2 seasons then Ducati would have been more accommodating!

Let's face it, it's the only thing they havn't changed - So that is what Rossi would blame. After that, what, put square wheels on it!?

If Rossi had the ability to be as far ahead of Nicky as that Aussie blighter was, there would be no problem.

TBH - I want to see him go so we can all forget about Ducati.

Biker's Nemesis

25,893 posts

92 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Apriliaer said:
Possibly is the 'problem', I'm sure if they had identified that before re-designing the entire bike over the course of 1 1/2 seasons then Ducati would have been more accommodating!

Let's face it, it's the only thing they havn't changed - So that is what Rossi would blame. After that, what, put square wheels on it!?

If Rossi had the ability to be as far ahead of Nicky as that Aussie blighter was, there would be no problem.

TBH - I want to see him go so we can all forget about Ducati.
I'm sure there was a link on here late last year or early this year when there was talk about the engine being the cause of the "understeer". You are right about the square wheels next if this doesn't work.

There has to be a damn good reason why everyone except Stoner hasn't won or been on any of the other top 2 steps on a regular basis for Ducati in the past 5 years.

How many podiums for Ducati excluding Stoner since 2007?

Rat_Fink_67

1,512 posts

90 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Biker's Nemesis said:
To be fair the engine causing the handling problems has been discussed for quite a while. Stoner has been the only rider able to get results on the 2007 onwards bike.

Look how many good riders have been beat by the Ducati, they can't all be wrong.
No you've got it all wrong, Rossi, Melandri, Capirossi, Hayden, Guintoli and everyone else who's ridden the Ducati since '07 are all talentless and st. The bike is amazing as proven by Stoner's string of one championships 5 years ago followed by a multitude of front end fold ups and a mid-season hiatus for good measure. The Ducati virtually destroyed Marco Melandri's brain and career (The former 250 world champion..ya know, 250s, the title Casey didn't win and was runner up to Pedrosa), that doesn't happen just because Stoner is "so much better". He found a riding style that worked, but had less and less wins as each year passed. Who's to say that had he not gone to Honda he wouldn't be the one fighting for 5th and 6th places?! I really don't get this god like aura surrounding him.

Apriliaer

835 posts

42 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
I thought Stoner only won because he was a bad rider, that relied on traction control? Oh, that was what Rossi was saying at the time....

Wasn't Stoner the most successful rider of the 800cc era, only one season on a Honda, predominantly riding a bike that it is impossible to ride due to it's flawed engine layout that cannot be cured by setup of a complete redesign.

If EVERYONE knows what is wrong with the Duke, why don't they fix it?

Apriliaer

835 posts

42 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Rat_Fink_67 said:
No you've got it all wrong, Rossi, Melandri, Capirossi, Hayden, Guintoli and everyone else who's ridden the Ducati since '07 are all talentless and st. The bike is amazing as proven by Stoner's string of one championships 5 years ago followed by a multitude of front end fold ups and a mid-season hiatus for good measure. The Ducati virtually destroyed Marco Melandri's brain and career (The former 250 world champion..ya know, 250s, the title Casey didn't win and was runner up to Pedrosa), that doesn't happen just because Stoner is "so much better". He found a riding style that worked, but had less and less wins as each year passed. Who's to say that had he not gone to Honda he wouldn't be the one fighting for 5th and 6th places?! I really don't get this god like aura surrounding him.
That's funny. Rossi never fought for 5-6 place - So you admit Stoner is good then? smile

"I really don't get this god like aura surrounding him" HTH

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4snkUUolJ0

Edited by Apriliaer on Wednesday 1st August 19:48

redtwin

7,224 posts

66 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Apriliaer said:
If EVERYONE knows what is wrong with the Duke, why don't they fix it?
Because the people who are in charge of fixing it don't want to admit there is anything wrong.

rhinochopig

16,990 posts

82 months

[news] 
Wednesday 1st August 2012 quote quote all
Apriliaer said:
Yazza54 said:
People are banging on about chassis, swingarms etc etc but he's still not had the main problem solved that he has asked for which is the engine config.

Also all this 'Hayden is performing on the desmo and Rossi isn't'

bks. Hayden is probably trying harder to make the thing work but he and the bike as a unit are no means performing.
So Rossi is an expert on engine configuration now too is he? With the progress they've made changing everything but the engine, at Rossi's request, they should definately throw a few more millions at that too, just to be sure! Remember Ducati had a front-running machine, before they got a new rider in...

And Rossi is doing a better job than Hayden too?

What you smoking?

Anyway, I digress from delusional fanboy baiting for a moment. Rossi will undoubtedly do better on a factory Yamaha and I hope the move happens. That bike is looking the best all-rounder and with Stoner gone and Spies looking out of his depth I hope Rossi gets a shot. I'm not a fan, but I like a good come back.

Any news on Redding's factory Ducati test today? Had a google but found nowt.
No but Burgess is. Lest we forget he is one of the key factors in VR's success over the years; and Doohans. If he is saying the engine layout is sub-optimal for a GP bike then I'd be inclined to believe what he saying.

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