Boat charter cancelled - refund not forthcoming
Discussion
My OH and I are members of a diving club, and we arranged a boat charter for a group of ten in Wales. The firm we booked with have been operating for a while, mostly doing training, but they have expanded their operations and now have two boats. They advertise online and you can book individual spaces on the boat. We booked the whole boat for two days.
About three weeks before the booking, they contacted us to suggest we rearrange it for another weekend, as the visibility was going to be bad. I do not know anybody who can predict this three weeks in advance, so there was clearly another reason. We told them we still wanted to keep that date. As we got closer to the date of the booking, the forecast was showing strong winds, so we had to accept their offer to rearrange.
When the date of the rearranged booking was approaching, they contacted us again with the same story about visibility. Again, we said we wanted to go ahead. They then said the wind would be too strong. The forecast this time was showing next to no wind at all, so we insisted on keeping the booking.
The dive operator has a very impressive internet and social media profile, but we have been hearing bad things about them. We had a feeling they might not fulfil our booking, so we met everybody at our club the Thursday before and shared our concerns.
We had been given instruction to arrive at their premises at 8:30 am on Saturday for a 9:30 ropes-off. We were there at 8:20 and there was nobody there. 8:30 came and still nobody. We started trying to call them as we got to 9:00 and got no answer.
At 9:05, a van arrived with two women in it. One was the business owner, and the other she introduced as the skipper. We were told to drive to the marina to unload kit onto trolleys, and bring the cars back to park.
What happened next was nothing short of a pantomime. First of all, they could not find their own boat. She had to make a phone call to find out where it was. We began loading kit onto it and noticed there were no lines to tie stuff to seats, and she did not know where she wanted us to store our second cylinder.
The boat is quite small, and has a tiny wheelhouse. They both got in the wheelhouse and shut the door behind them, which seemed odd. They emerged about 15 minutes later and told us the engine won't start. They demonstrated turning the ignition to the on position, waiting for the buzzer to stop, and pressing the start button. The engine did not crank. They kept doing this repeatedly and did not lift the engine cover once..
We began unloading our kit, and when we came back for the second trolley load, she told us they had found a loose cable under the seat and got the engine running. She told us they did not want to take divers out until it had been tested. Before leaving, she agreed to a refund and asked us to email her with bank details.
On the 6th September, she sent the following email:
"Please find attached for refund of dive spaces 2nd & 3rd September. Please expect this to enter you account within the next 5 working days."
The attached document is a remittance for the refund of 8 spaces over two days. The total amount is £900. We have paid £1,125.
Two people did not come along on the day of the booking as they had colds, so it is clear she has not included them. We disagree with this as we booked the whole boat. How we fill those spaces is irrelevant, and she would not have been able to deliver the service had they been present.
We have emailed her to challenge this and advise her we have still not been paid the amount in the remittance. She now says she has told the accountant to refund us, and we will be paid the amount stated by the 29th September.
We have sent a formal letter before action giving her 14 days to refund us. That deadline is the 2nd October.
The letter was sent by Royal Mail Signed For and as an attachment to an email, in which we have made it clear our preference is to settle the matter amicably. She has responded stating her reasons for only a partial refund:
The owner's mother is shown on the website as a co-director and skipper. The woman she introduced as skipper is also listed as such on the website, as is a youngish lad. The owner says she is a Yachtmaster and Advanced Powerboat Instructor.
I sent a message to a WhatsApp group for dive clubs and was put in contact with somebody who booked with them two months prior to us. They pulled the same stunt as us, but he is a HGV mechanic, and offered his assistance. He told me there was no power at the solenoid on the starter motor, so he hot-wired it and got it going. He said the young lad who was skippering did not have a clue what he was doing. He dropped divers in with the prop spinning, which as well as the obvious danger, means they are separated on the surface if there is a delay between them dropping in. On the way back into the marina, he hit the outboard motor of a boat in a neighbouring berth. He also said the life raft was in the wheelhouse and out of date.
I heard somebody operating a boat in Scotland was booked with them. We know him very well, and he has an excellent operation. He is a member of a club where he is based and they booked with this outfit. I gave him a call to warn him what to expect, and he said he had been having doubts too. They cancelled on them, saying it was too windy, which he says was not the case. I am also aware she married the girl who she said was our skipper the same day as his booking.
I suspect the people they say are skippers do not have commercial endorsements, and/or the boat is not coded as required under the MCA's Small Commercial Vessel scheme. Both the bloke with a boat in the same marina and the guy from the other club commented that there is no way the skippers they saw in action could hold a commercial endorsement.
I am not expecting our refund (or the partial refund they have offered), so it is looking like County Court is likely.
The rest of the group are clearly annoyed, and one person in particular is extremely upset. Some have said they want compensating for their travel and accommodation, and other expenses. The terms and conditions on their website state:
" If Rob-Dog Divers is required to cancel a booking for any reason it will use reasonable endeavours to provide a suitable alternative booking date for the customer. Lying-b
d Divers liability in this instance shall be limited to the cost of the booking and in the event a suitable alternative booking date cannot be agreed it shall refund the cost of the booking to the customer."
The bit in bold is fairly standard, and I would have thought perfectly enforceable in most circumstances, however, our argument is that they were fully aware they could not fulfil our booking well in advance, so are liable for our other losses.
It is difficult for me to prove that they do not have the minimum skipper qualifications and commercial coding, as there is no public record.
I am currently pondering our next steps. I was considering a response whereby I put my suspicions to them and ask them to prove they have the requisite skipper qualifications and coding. I am sure they will refuse.
If this went to county court, could we make an application for the court to rule they must provide this information?
If they did, and we could prove they could not have legally put to sea, is it likely we would be awarded damages for our other expenses?
If they are taking money for bookings they know they cannot fulfil, is this not a criminal matter too?
Any other advice would be appreciated.
About three weeks before the booking, they contacted us to suggest we rearrange it for another weekend, as the visibility was going to be bad. I do not know anybody who can predict this three weeks in advance, so there was clearly another reason. We told them we still wanted to keep that date. As we got closer to the date of the booking, the forecast was showing strong winds, so we had to accept their offer to rearrange.
When the date of the rearranged booking was approaching, they contacted us again with the same story about visibility. Again, we said we wanted to go ahead. They then said the wind would be too strong. The forecast this time was showing next to no wind at all, so we insisted on keeping the booking.
The dive operator has a very impressive internet and social media profile, but we have been hearing bad things about them. We had a feeling they might not fulfil our booking, so we met everybody at our club the Thursday before and shared our concerns.
We had been given instruction to arrive at their premises at 8:30 am on Saturday for a 9:30 ropes-off. We were there at 8:20 and there was nobody there. 8:30 came and still nobody. We started trying to call them as we got to 9:00 and got no answer.
At 9:05, a van arrived with two women in it. One was the business owner, and the other she introduced as the skipper. We were told to drive to the marina to unload kit onto trolleys, and bring the cars back to park.
What happened next was nothing short of a pantomime. First of all, they could not find their own boat. She had to make a phone call to find out where it was. We began loading kit onto it and noticed there were no lines to tie stuff to seats, and she did not know where she wanted us to store our second cylinder.
The boat is quite small, and has a tiny wheelhouse. They both got in the wheelhouse and shut the door behind them, which seemed odd. They emerged about 15 minutes later and told us the engine won't start. They demonstrated turning the ignition to the on position, waiting for the buzzer to stop, and pressing the start button. The engine did not crank. They kept doing this repeatedly and did not lift the engine cover once..
We began unloading our kit, and when we came back for the second trolley load, she told us they had found a loose cable under the seat and got the engine running. She told us they did not want to take divers out until it had been tested. Before leaving, she agreed to a refund and asked us to email her with bank details.
On the 6th September, she sent the following email:
"Please find attached for refund of dive spaces 2nd & 3rd September. Please expect this to enter you account within the next 5 working days."
The attached document is a remittance for the refund of 8 spaces over two days. The total amount is £900. We have paid £1,125.
Two people did not come along on the day of the booking as they had colds, so it is clear she has not included them. We disagree with this as we booked the whole boat. How we fill those spaces is irrelevant, and she would not have been able to deliver the service had they been present.
We have emailed her to challenge this and advise her we have still not been paid the amount in the remittance. She now says she has told the accountant to refund us, and we will be paid the amount stated by the 29th September.
We have sent a formal letter before action giving her 14 days to refund us. That deadline is the 2nd October.
The letter was sent by Royal Mail Signed For and as an attachment to an email, in which we have made it clear our preference is to settle the matter amicably. She has responded stating her reasons for only a partial refund:
Lying tt said:
t said: Having looked at what was sent - the amount would have been calculated on the number that was logged going out on the boat for the dive plan on that day. This was listed as 7 and therefore was the reason why 7 spaces had been refunded for both days.
The option was given for the second day to be refunded to you as a good will gesture for the inconvenience of the first day, despite the vessel being fully operational having undergone checks throughout the cancelled day. In general this would usually have been given as credit.
We can either refund you as per the notice for the 7 spaces on each day, or we can refund the 7 spaces for the first day and credit the group for the 2nd day in full to rebook. The option is your choice, please let me know so I can amend this and amend the refund from being sent to you.
I'm not sure why it is now seven; there were eight present. The option was given for the second day to be refunded to you as a good will gesture for the inconvenience of the first day, despite the vessel being fully operational having undergone checks throughout the cancelled day. In general this would usually have been given as credit.
We can either refund you as per the notice for the 7 spaces on each day, or we can refund the 7 spaces for the first day and credit the group for the 2nd day in full to rebook. The option is your choice, please let me know so I can amend this and amend the refund from being sent to you.
Our Response said:
Thank you for your response.
I do not agree with your statements nor believe them to be a legitimate basis on which to withhold our refund.
I confirmed in writing on the 30-AUG-2023 we were retaining the whole boat for 10 divers, as per the two payments made to Lying bd Divers for the weekend. How the group chose to utilise those spaces was entirely up to us and had no impact on your delivery of the booked service nor would have resulted in any loss of revenue to you were we not to utilise them in full. I therefore reiterate our position that it is unreasonable for you to withhold payment for any part of the booking.
In addition, you stated on the 02-SEP-2023 that, not knowing the cause of the fault which prevented you from operating the boat on the 02-SEP-2023 and the suspected vandalism, you thought it was unlikely within the limited time available that the boat would be functioning and safe to take to sea on the 03-SEP-2023. On that basis you would refund us both days. A credit was not offered at the time and we accepted the refund.
We do not wish to accept a credit now and simply wish to be refunded our costs for a booking which you were unable to fulfil.
I do not agree with your statements nor believe them to be a legitimate basis on which to withhold our refund.
I confirmed in writing on the 30-AUG-2023 we were retaining the whole boat for 10 divers, as per the two payments made to Lying b
d Divers for the weekend. How the group chose to utilise those spaces was entirely up to us and had no impact on your delivery of the booked service nor would have resulted in any loss of revenue to you were we not to utilise them in full. I therefore reiterate our position that it is unreasonable for you to withhold payment for any part of the booking.In addition, you stated on the 02-SEP-2023 that, not knowing the cause of the fault which prevented you from operating the boat on the 02-SEP-2023 and the suspected vandalism, you thought it was unlikely within the limited time available that the boat would be functioning and safe to take to sea on the 03-SEP-2023. On that basis you would refund us both days. A credit was not offered at the time and we accepted the refund.
We do not wish to accept a credit now and simply wish to be refunded our costs for a booking which you were unable to fulfil.
Lying tt said:
t said: Being the skipper on the day, my suggestion was that we did not take the vessel out despite me getting it operation on the first day. I stated that we would take the vessel out and undergo checks to ensure that it was fit for the following day - which is was. I gave you the option to either await for us to confirm this in the evening or cancel - which you chose to cancel.
The cancellation would be for those involved in the booking, who were actually there on site. We will not continue to negotiate the matter, as I have clearly outlined our position.
The amount stated on the remittance will be refunded to you, and cover the spaces refunded for those who were there for both days. You can expect this to be within your account as mentioned by the 29th from our accountants.
Over the course of this month, I have been hearing a few stories about them. I know somebody who berths a small sailing boat in the same marina, and he is also a diving instructor. I rang him and asked if he knew anything about a certain dive outfit operating out of the same marina. He then proceeded to give me a load of horror stories, and told me they were berthed on the same pontoon as him. The week before our booking, the owner's mother was at the helm and hit at least three other boats, putting a big gouge in one of them. He told me they have been given the nickname the 'Pinball Wizards', as they just bounce off everything in the marina. The cancellation would be for those involved in the booking, who were actually there on site. We will not continue to negotiate the matter, as I have clearly outlined our position.
The amount stated on the remittance will be refunded to you, and cover the spaces refunded for those who were there for both days. You can expect this to be within your account as mentioned by the 29th from our accountants.
The owner's mother is shown on the website as a co-director and skipper. The woman she introduced as skipper is also listed as such on the website, as is a youngish lad. The owner says she is a Yachtmaster and Advanced Powerboat Instructor.
I sent a message to a WhatsApp group for dive clubs and was put in contact with somebody who booked with them two months prior to us. They pulled the same stunt as us, but he is a HGV mechanic, and offered his assistance. He told me there was no power at the solenoid on the starter motor, so he hot-wired it and got it going. He said the young lad who was skippering did not have a clue what he was doing. He dropped divers in with the prop spinning, which as well as the obvious danger, means they are separated on the surface if there is a delay between them dropping in. On the way back into the marina, he hit the outboard motor of a boat in a neighbouring berth. He also said the life raft was in the wheelhouse and out of date.
I heard somebody operating a boat in Scotland was booked with them. We know him very well, and he has an excellent operation. He is a member of a club where he is based and they booked with this outfit. I gave him a call to warn him what to expect, and he said he had been having doubts too. They cancelled on them, saying it was too windy, which he says was not the case. I am also aware she married the girl who she said was our skipper the same day as his booking.
I suspect the people they say are skippers do not have commercial endorsements, and/or the boat is not coded as required under the MCA's Small Commercial Vessel scheme. Both the bloke with a boat in the same marina and the guy from the other club commented that there is no way the skippers they saw in action could hold a commercial endorsement.
I am not expecting our refund (or the partial refund they have offered), so it is looking like County Court is likely.
The rest of the group are clearly annoyed, and one person in particular is extremely upset. Some have said they want compensating for their travel and accommodation, and other expenses. The terms and conditions on their website state:
" If Rob-Dog Divers is required to cancel a booking for any reason it will use reasonable endeavours to provide a suitable alternative booking date for the customer. Lying-b
d Divers liability in this instance shall be limited to the cost of the booking and in the event a suitable alternative booking date cannot be agreed it shall refund the cost of the booking to the customer."The bit in bold is fairly standard, and I would have thought perfectly enforceable in most circumstances, however, our argument is that they were fully aware they could not fulfil our booking well in advance, so are liable for our other losses.
It is difficult for me to prove that they do not have the minimum skipper qualifications and commercial coding, as there is no public record.
I am currently pondering our next steps. I was considering a response whereby I put my suspicions to them and ask them to prove they have the requisite skipper qualifications and coding. I am sure they will refuse.
If this went to county court, could we make an application for the court to rule they must provide this information?
If they did, and we could prove they could not have legally put to sea, is it likely we would be awarded damages for our other expenses?
If they are taking money for bookings they know they cannot fulfil, is this not a criminal matter too?
Any other advice would be appreciated.
Edit: Accidently named the lying bds.
ds.Edited by Ganglandboss on Monday 25th September 14:58
Thanks for the replies.
A few have advised cutting our losses at £900, and that is what I would probably do. My difficulty is it is not just our money, but eight other people. We collected their money and handed it over to these crooks, so we need to show we are fighting to get it returned.
Most have accepted it, but one of the newer club members seems to be avoiding us.
We sent them a letter before action and she responded, saying she has told her accountant to issue a refund. We have challenged the amount, but has told us she will not negotiate, and the money would be paid by the 29th September. This has not happened. The deadline date on our letter before action is this coming Tuesday, so it is looking like we will be taking her to court.
I have emailed my concerns about their qualifications and SCV coding to the MCA.
I have also reported her to Gwynedd Trading Standards. To do this, you have to go through Citizens Advice; they were pretty helpful.
I have also got some insider information from PADI. There is a lot of positive media about how she was the youngest person to become a PADI Course Director (this is their most senior instructor rating). It seems she has had a big falling out with them over service delivery, and I note all their branding has been removed from her website, premises and van. She is showing as a PADI dive centre on the PADI website, and I notice she is still offering PADI instructor training. I emailed PADI about this and they have confirmed there is an ongoing investigation into quality management at both her business and her wife's business.
I have also spoken to one of the group I said had booked with them on her wedding day. She is refusing to refund them and instead offering credit against another booking. It seems that amongst that group was the chairman of BSAC, so I am hoping he might be able to provide some support.
I had a look at the information from Companies House a while back. They do not have much in the way of tangible assets, or cash in hand or at bank.
I have just checked again, and it seems she has a second directorship. The one we are dealing with has her and her mother as the only directors. The second is with her wife, and was only incorporated two days ago. I am wondering if she is gearing up to transfer the assets to this new firm and wind the other one up.
A few have advised cutting our losses at £900, and that is what I would probably do. My difficulty is it is not just our money, but eight other people. We collected their money and handed it over to these crooks, so we need to show we are fighting to get it returned.
Most have accepted it, but one of the newer club members seems to be avoiding us.
We sent them a letter before action and she responded, saying she has told her accountant to issue a refund. We have challenged the amount, but has told us she will not negotiate, and the money would be paid by the 29th September. This has not happened. The deadline date on our letter before action is this coming Tuesday, so it is looking like we will be taking her to court.
I have emailed my concerns about their qualifications and SCV coding to the MCA.
I have also reported her to Gwynedd Trading Standards. To do this, you have to go through Citizens Advice; they were pretty helpful.
I have also got some insider information from PADI. There is a lot of positive media about how she was the youngest person to become a PADI Course Director (this is their most senior instructor rating). It seems she has had a big falling out with them over service delivery, and I note all their branding has been removed from her website, premises and van. She is showing as a PADI dive centre on the PADI website, and I notice she is still offering PADI instructor training. I emailed PADI about this and they have confirmed there is an ongoing investigation into quality management at both her business and her wife's business.
I have also spoken to one of the group I said had booked with them on her wedding day. She is refusing to refund them and instead offering credit against another booking. It seems that amongst that group was the chairman of BSAC, so I am hoping he might be able to provide some support.
I had a look at the information from Companies House a while back. They do not have much in the way of tangible assets, or cash in hand or at bank.
I have just checked again, and it seems she has a second directorship. The one we are dealing with has her and her mother as the only directors. The second is with her wife, and was only incorporated two days ago. I am wondering if she is gearing up to transfer the assets to this new firm and wind the other one up.
Simpo Two said:
CraigyMc said:
If you paid by credit card provider, take it up with them.
I think we can assume not, because he's been asked that three times to no avail.OP is entirely at the mercy of the company and beating around in irrelevant bushes. Trading Standards won't get him his money back so it's court and then - if they owe over £1K (I think that's the minimum amount) - escalate to High Court to get paid.
Edited by Simpo Two on Sunday 1st October 21:01
I am not expecting Trading Standards, or anybody, to get our money back. I am fully aware court is our only option now. I am confident we will get a judgement in our favour, but I suspect the company will go under before we get anything.
My priorities are being able to show the rest of the group we have done everything we can to get a refund, and try to stop her doing the same to others.
Matt_E_Mulsion said:
Hugo Stiglitz said:
Take the money, leave reviews and move on.
I'll correct that:Take the money, leave reviews, sink the boat and move on.
TGCOTF-dewey said:
There must be a couple of Tech divers in the club.
Leverage their all black kit and D-Rings, do a night dive, and block every intake port on the hull.
I've got loads of black kit and D-rings, and a rebreather. Leverage their all black kit and D-Rings, do a night dive, and block every intake port on the hull.
Hobo said:
Just to add... looking at the company itself (creditsafe/companies house, etc) as it's not hard to know who they are (DD Ltd per chance), they appear to up to only last week be advertising for new staff on social media, so maybe things are not terminal and it is simply a cashflow issue.
There is nothing else adverse about them reported from what I can find, so hopefully the newly formed company (which consists of one of the directors and a new director) is nothing but coincedence.
Another thought would be to contact their accountant and see what they say, that being Woods & Cooper 0151 4228049. They won't tell you much, but will certainly be ringing there client when you mention legal action which may provoke a reaction.
I will try not to break the PH naming and shaming rules, and tell you whether or not you are correct, but I can tell you that the T's & C's in your second post are identical to theirs. And they have been advertising the same positions on social media.There is nothing else adverse about them reported from what I can find, so hopefully the newly formed company (which consists of one of the directors and a new director) is nothing but coincedence.
Another thought would be to contact their accountant and see what they say, that being Woods & Cooper 0151 4228049. They won't tell you much, but will certainly be ringing there client when you mention legal action which may provoke a reaction.
"3. If [company name] is required to cancel a booking for any reason it will use reasonable endeavours to provide a suitable alternative booking date for the customer. [company name] liability in this instance shall be limited to the cost of the booking and in the event a suitable alternative booking date cannot be agreed it shall refund the cost of the booking to the customer."
BSAC's Chairman (who they have also ripped off recently) says this falls foul of the Consumer Rights Act. He is a business auditor by profession. In any case, we cannot agree an alternative booking date.
I like the idea of contacting their accountants.
Hobo said:
Ganglandboss said:
I like the idea of contacting their accountants.
The companies registered address is the accountants, so any legal paperwork would be issued to them which they wouldn't like, hence me saying give them a call and see what happens.She said she would look into it and call back.
email 18th September said:
Subject: Re: Refund for Pwllheli whole boat booking - Sat 2nd of Sept and Sun 3rd of Sept
Hi Clemmie, the refund has been sent to be processed by the accountant at the end of the month - this is the reason that you were sent a remittance notice a few days after you were here.
Regards,
Clare
Hi Clemmie, the refund has been sent to be processed by the accountant at the end of the month - this is the reason that you were sent a remittance notice a few days after you were here.
Regards,
Clare
email 21st September said:
Subject: Re: Refund for Pwllheli whole boat booking - Sat 2nd of Sept and Sun 3rd of Sept
Good morning Clemmie,
Being the skipper on the day, my suggestion was that we did not take the vessel out despite me getting it operation on the first day. I stated that we would take the vessel out and undergo checks to ensure that it was fit for the following day - which is was. I gave you the option to either await for us to confirm this in the evening or cancel - which you chose to cancel.
The cancellation would be for those involved in the booking, who were actually there on site. We will not continue to negotiate the matter, as I have clearly outlined our position.
The amount stated on the remittance will be refunded to you, and cover the spaces refunded for those who were there for both days. You can expect this to be within your account as mentioned by the 29th from our accountants.
Regards,
Clare
Good morning Clemmie,
Being the skipper on the day, my suggestion was that we did not take the vessel out despite me getting it operation on the first day. I stated that we would take the vessel out and undergo checks to ensure that it was fit for the following day - which is was. I gave you the option to either await for us to confirm this in the evening or cancel - which you chose to cancel.
The cancellation would be for those involved in the booking, who were actually there on site. We will not continue to negotiate the matter, as I have clearly outlined our position.
The amount stated on the remittance will be refunded to you, and cover the spaces refunded for those who were there for both days. You can expect this to be within your account as mentioned by the 29th from our accountants.
Regards,
Clare
Today is the deadline day of our letter before action.
I had a message last night from the guy from the other group that had a booking cancelled, after I told him what I found out about the new company. He told me he had been advised to contact Companies House and advise them they owe money and can't strike off. I gave CH a call today and they were very helpful. They cannot do anything at this stage, but it seems we have a two month window to raise an objection if they try to have the current company stuck off, so I have subscribed to updates on this and the new company.
We are just looking through the court application process. As it stands, we are seeking return of the booking cost, accommodation, interest, court fees, and mileage for travel to and from the marina via the bunkhouse.
With the booking cost and accommodation, they are single transactions from my OH's bank account, but mileage was paid individually by a number of claimants.
There are options on the online form for 'myself or my organisation', 'more than person or organisation', and the final one is for a solicitor acting on the behalf of a client.
I assume I am right in saying we cannot choose the first option because of the multiple mileage claims, but could if we only claimed the booking costs and accommodation, as these were paid by a single person?
The website says we have to submit a paper form if it is an application for more than one person. This in itself is not a problem, but would that mean everybody listed would have to attend court?
a group application is also difficult because one of the group does not want any involvement. It seems she is moving house, and has had problems with a thug of a property developer who has bought the house next door to her current address, so she does not want further stress. We could not therefore list her on the application, although I suppose we might be able to just omit her and not be able to claim her mileage?
Would it be an option to apply as an organisation (i.e. the club), so we could include members' costs, but not have to list them individually as joint claimants?
Thanks!
I had a message last night from the guy from the other group that had a booking cancelled, after I told him what I found out about the new company. He told me he had been advised to contact Companies House and advise them they owe money and can't strike off. I gave CH a call today and they were very helpful. They cannot do anything at this stage, but it seems we have a two month window to raise an objection if they try to have the current company stuck off, so I have subscribed to updates on this and the new company.
We are just looking through the court application process. As it stands, we are seeking return of the booking cost, accommodation, interest, court fees, and mileage for travel to and from the marina via the bunkhouse.
With the booking cost and accommodation, they are single transactions from my OH's bank account, but mileage was paid individually by a number of claimants.
There are options on the online form for 'myself or my organisation', 'more than person or organisation', and the final one is for a solicitor acting on the behalf of a client.
I assume I am right in saying we cannot choose the first option because of the multiple mileage claims, but could if we only claimed the booking costs and accommodation, as these were paid by a single person?
The website says we have to submit a paper form if it is an application for more than one person. This in itself is not a problem, but would that mean everybody listed would have to attend court?
a group application is also difficult because one of the group does not want any involvement. It seems she is moving house, and has had problems with a thug of a property developer who has bought the house next door to her current address, so she does not want further stress. We could not therefore list her on the application, although I suppose we might be able to just omit her and not be able to claim her mileage?
Would it be an option to apply as an organisation (i.e. the club), so we could include members' costs, but not have to list them individually as joint claimants?
Thanks!
Hobo said:
Who made the booking and paid the monies. One person, multiple people or a club ?
If you for example collected the monies from all the people and then booked it yourself then you would just claim as an individual. If you all paid individually you would each have to start the process individually, and finally it you are a formal entity (ie club) then you claim as an organisation.
Re court, I don't think there will be a need for attending to be honest so wouldn't be concerned with that. Its mostly done over the phone these days, include mediation before any court hearing. It's a painful process which is dragged out for an eternity.
Thanks for the reply, Hobo. My OH made the booking and paid the monies via bank transfer from a personal account. She then collected payment from the others. The problem is people travelled separately, so the travel expenses are individual costs.If you for example collected the monies from all the people and then booked it yourself then you would just claim as an individual. If you all paid individually you would each have to start the process individually, and finally it you are a formal entity (ie club) then you claim as an organisation.
Re court, I don't think there will be a need for attending to be honest so wouldn't be concerned with that. Its mostly done over the phone these days, include mediation before any court hearing. It's a painful process which is dragged out for an eternity.
We are a formal entity though; we are a branch of the British Sub Aqua Club.
Bit of an update on this. Somebody from the group who had their booking cancelled after ours contacted me by WhatsApp late on Saturday night. He said he had received a panicked voicemail from her, promising a refund would be made. He sent this screenshot from her Facebook profile that was made that evening.
MY OH heard from his wife last night; apparently they have now received a refund. Still nothing for us though.
I have just chased up my email to the MCA and got a very quick response from a Technical Manager saying I could give him a call. He sounded incredibly pleased to hear from me but could not talk for long as he is about to travel. He did have time to tell me they have been on their radar since my email.
There is a recent review on Google from somebody who booked their kid on a five day course with a children's activity group.
MY OH heard from his wife last night; apparently they have now received a refund. Still nothing for us though.
I have just chased up my email to the MCA and got a very quick response from a Technical Manager saying I could give him a call. He sounded incredibly pleased to hear from me but could not talk for long as he is about to travel. He did have time to tell me they have been on their radar since my email.
There is a recent review on Google from somebody who booked their kid on a five day course with a children's activity group.
Google Review said:
On the 3rd day they went for a boat ride. Unfortunately the boat broke down necessitating assistance from the RNLI and the coastguard. We only knew about this as our son phoned us from the boat using his own phone, there was no communication at all from XXXXXX Divers, and they arrived back on shore 2 hours late.
It seems that as a result of this incident, their boat has subsequently been hauled out of the water, and they have been told in no uncertain terms it is not to go back in until it has been surveyed and other requirements have been met.Hobo said:
The company had a CCJ put against its credit file this morning which doesn’t look great, so hopefully the OP got it sorted.
Unfortunately we have not got it sorted yet. There have been a couple of minor complications around other members of the group, and my OH and I have had a lot of other stuff on our plate, so we have not been able to get the court application in. We will have it in time for a little Christmas present to her though!I have had a little bit of fun with her though. I have left a few reviews for her various businesses and she has responded, telling me leaving negative reviews will not get us refunded any quicker, and accusing me of defamation.
She registered another company recently, so she is clearly planning a phoenix scam. The new company even has Phoenix in the name!
The bloke who told me he got refunded said he sent an email, stating quite clearly what he knows they are up to, and she paid up promptly. We did the same and it has made her dig her heels in even more.
She made a big announcement recently that she is launching the new business that was registered with Companies House. She announced it as a merger of her business, her wife's dive school in Warrington, and another business that does a sort of dive adventure experience from the quarry she leases in Llanberis. What is interesting is she says any credit from the other businesses is valid with the new one.
I have had quite a few people contact me via social media with several horror stories. One of them says he used to work for her, and she owes him unpaid wages. He told me he had a falling out with her because she wanted him to teach people in the quarry without safety cover. Any commercial diving activity in the UK is covered by the Diving at Work Regulations 1997. As a club with volunteer instructors, we do not have to comply, but as soon as somebody is being paid, the regulations say you have to have shore cover and a safety diver.
Teaching diving in the UK makes very little money. The bloke who taught me said "The best way to make a million quid from diving is to start with two!". You can get away with charging around £400 for a PADI Open Water course. This will run over four days usually, and you will need an instructor for four days, a safety diver for three, and shore cover for three (my course was morning classroom and afternoon pool over two days, and two days in a quarry in Lancaster. When you factor in your overheads and paying those people, there is not a lot in it. The way dive schools make it pay a bit better is by running a club and getting members to volunteer as safety divers, and the shore cover could be a family member of one of the students. Generally, recreational diver training tends to be run by shops as it brings customers in. The training side will usually bring little profit or even a loss.
Another requirement of the regulations is divers have to have a medical, performed by a hyperbaric physician from the HSE's register. You used to be able to get away with saying the safety diver is a volunteer, but now the HSE have made it clear that the safety diver has to have a medical.
I have been told by more than one person that she has been teaching using a lone instructor, and locking the gates behind her so nobody sees (and also meaning if there was an incident, the chances of being seen are nil, and rescue services are hindered). I am aware that there has been a HSE investigation, and the outcome is the company has been served with an improvement notice, that is on the public register.
I posted a link to the entry on the HSE register on one of her Google review pages and she replied:
Crooked diving instructor said:
"Hi Dave, To respond to your recent review having kept deleting the previous after our reply - you have never actually dived with us to make any informed decision of our operations. It is no secret that one of the Divemasters in the water had a GP medical which was not a person accredited by the HSE and on realising this obtained the correct version the day after this was notified. The reason that the person needed a HSE approved medical as opposed to a standard GP was as all of the staff team are paid for their work - unlike many other places around the UK that get around these regulations by having clubs and having volunteers. With regards to the fact that numerous claims were made about the centres by your self and an ex member of staff, and this being the outcome of the HSE coming to inspect, I would suggest that our operations are quite safe, something which we actually do tend to pride ourselves on:
- Brand new top line equipment each year - including Santi drysuits & Mares & Fourth Element other gear.
- All diver school equipment including the following additional items; Torch, SMB, Whistle, Dive computer and line cutter as standard.
- A staff team of 3 persons for each open water dive project and small group sizes of 2:1 instructor.
- 4 defibrillators held at the dive centres to ensure that there is one on site at all times.
- Oxygen and trauma kit for each site (and additional ones for off site)
- Nautilus personal GPS given to all divers on guided sea dives.
- Coded dive vessels
-Medical trauma trained technicians & swift water rescue personal on site
... to name just a few of the things that we do.
If you do have any other suggestions of how to make our operations safer, please do let us know as we are always looking to improve in respect of safety, as should all other dive centre. With that in mind, we do not take the HSE attending the site due to your complaint as a negative, we would much rather take note and ensure that things are in place to ensure the best safety of our customers. The same for the other places who have bene contacted by yourself and the other person:
Maritime authority - with no case to answer, but some great tips of future development of the vessels.
Trading standards - With no case to answer.
ICO - With no case to answer.
All of which has been a great test of our policies & procedures and have had great feedback from all of those above.
Thanks again - Clare"
I like how she says I have never dived with her; that's why I want my f- Brand new top line equipment each year - including Santi drysuits & Mares & Fourth Element other gear.
- All diver school equipment including the following additional items; Torch, SMB, Whistle, Dive computer and line cutter as standard.
- A staff team of 3 persons for each open water dive project and small group sizes of 2:1 instructor.
- 4 defibrillators held at the dive centres to ensure that there is one on site at all times.
- Oxygen and trauma kit for each site (and additional ones for off site)
- Nautilus personal GPS given to all divers on guided sea dives.
- Coded dive vessels
-Medical trauma trained technicians & swift water rescue personal on site
... to name just a few of the things that we do.
If you do have any other suggestions of how to make our operations safer, please do let us know as we are always looking to improve in respect of safety, as should all other dive centre. With that in mind, we do not take the HSE attending the site due to your complaint as a negative, we would much rather take note and ensure that things are in place to ensure the best safety of our customers. The same for the other places who have bene contacted by yourself and the other person:
Maritime authority - with no case to answer, but some great tips of future development of the vessels.
Trading standards - With no case to answer.
ICO - With no case to answer.
All of which has been a great test of our policies & procedures and have had great feedback from all of those above.
Thanks again - Clare"
king money back! 
What I strongly suspect has happened is the HSE have attended and asked for the dates of courses, and then asked who the safety diver was, and who provided shore cover. She will have given them the name of a mate, who the HSE will have then requested a medical certificate for. The allegation of diving without safety cover would be difficult to prove, but the lack of medical certificate is easy to prove with a paper check.
I did not mention any of the other agencies in my review, so she has voluntarily published the fact there have been other investigations.
I note she says she says the HSE attended her site due to my complaint; this is not true. I have had no contact with the HSE regarding her business.
I did speak to the Maritime and Coastguard Agency. I had a couple of very long telephone conversations with one of their Technical Managers. He told me they began monitoring them after my email, and said the Coastguard had reported a number of incidents involving their boats. He told me it is difficult to get a surveyor to Pwllheli, so I asked if I could pass his contact detail to potential witnesses. I then contacted the marina and got a very grateful email back from the Commercial Manager.
Marina said:
Many thanks for your email, and highlighting issues you’ve had with the company. I have been in recent dialogue with the company due to some incidents that were highlighted to us, and offered our support to enhance the experience to the customers, whilst also enforcing that any activity taking place out of the marina needed to conform with best practice, high assurance of safety an so forth.
I know as a result of this, a number of berth holders have made their complaints official. I was told a while back that her mum threatened to punch somebody's teeth down his throat after she crashed the boat. I have been told this was caught on video.Since the MCA told them the boat could not be launched until it has been inspected, it has not been used, and has been listed for sale. They have taken the hard boat of their website, but are still advertising RHIB trips. The marina also told me they cancelled their berthing for both vessels and have closed their premises near the marina. Their website does not say where the RHIB is; the illiterate t
t says it is 'birthed in a central location'. It is possible it is not in the water, as it can easily be recovered with a trailer. I suspect the only reason the MCA have taken no further action is because the boat in question is out of the water and not going back.I do not know the current status with Trading Standards. I spoke to CAB (you have to before they will investigate); they gave me some advice about court action, and said they would refer the matter to Trading Standards. Trading Standards have not contacted me. I might give them a chase.
I do not know what the ICO's interest with her is. I was told by her former instructor that she forged his signature on some medical paperwork and diver certifications; perhaps it is something to do with that.
I know she has parted company with PADI following complaints about quality management around training. She is now with SSI. Her former employee said she had been suspended by them, but still teaching and getting others to sign the paperwork. This looks unlikely though, as she has just been signed off as an Instructor Trainer by them. This amazes me that they have allowed this so soon after being given an improvement notice by the HSE.
I noticed recently that a charge has been registered against the company by a business finance company. I suspect that money will get used to bankroll the new company, and let the old one become insolvent.
Her business is crumbling, and it is only a matter of time before it all comes crashing down. Previously she only appears to have ripped off people who lack the means to fight her for their money, but if she has now started with a bank, they won't f
k about.The UK diving community is quite tight knit, and her reputation is in tatters; I have no doubt her business is in its death throes. After that, she will never work in the industry. If we do not get our money back, it will be worth it, especially if she gets sent down for fraud.
Edited by Ganglandboss on Thursday 14th December 14:56
pavarotti1980 said:
normalbloke said:
You seem very bitter, sounds like she’s living rent free in your head.Her response seemed quite measured considering.
I would have used principled and safety conscious instead of bitter. But I like pavarotti1980's viewpoint; I am being principled and safety conscious.
During my enquiries amongst the diving community, I have discovered that not only is she a lying, thieving t
t, but she is also happy to wilfully endanger lives (including those of children). I lost a mate to a diving accident just over two years ago, which may have been caused by inappropriate risks taken by the organiser. It is not something I am happy to let go unreported.We have submitted our claim to the County Courts, and she has now responded. She rejects our claim in full, and is defending it on the grounds that she issued us with a credit note, as per her terms and conditions.
This is demonstrably untrue, as her emails show she offered a refund. I am also informed her T&Cs fall foul of the Unfair Contract Terms Act. There is also the small matter that she cannot deliver the service we paid for as she no longer has the boat.
Meanwhile, some of the other st that is coming down on her is hard to believe...
She has now been expelled from PADI, and is listed as such on their website.
The CCJ she got in December is still unsatisfied.
The HSE case against her is crazy. I heard rumours that she is routinely flouting the Diving at Work Regulations, and she was served with an improvement notice last year, when the HSE found out her safety diver did not have a HSE medical. She has publicly admitted this on social media, but claims it was an error made by the safety diver, who she claims believed a GP's note was sufficient. She also claims the HSE investigation is over.
What has really happened is she had a family sign up for some training (mum, dad and son). She had three different instructors teaching them. Each instructor was teaching alone - no safety diver, no shore cover, and the gates tot the quarry locked behind them.
The instructor on day 3 raised concerns to her about teaching alone. He is not a UK national and did not know at first that this is actually illegal in the UK. She dismissed his concerns and he has subsequently gone to the HSE.
I do not know exactly how they conducted their investigation, but I expect one of the first things they do is demand to see all the dive logs. They will no doubt then ask for the medical certificates of the instructors and safety divers named on that log. This is an easy one for the HSE to prove, so they can issue an improvement notice fairly swiftly.
If the safety divers were not there, so she is relying on people being willing to lie for her. One of those people is her mother, who says she was providing shore cover. At the same time one of the dives was taking place, the England women's football team were playing, and she has put a photo on Facebook showing she was watching it in her living room.
The HSE have then contacted the family, and the parents are now quite angry. Dad has contacted the agency she is now teaching under and made a complaint. He then finds out she has signed the paperwork to say she taught them, which is untrue. He also finds out the instructor on the second day was not qualified. He has also discovered that somebody has forged his and his wife's signatures on the paperwork.
I am also aware the finance company she borrowed from have started recovery proceedings.
I doubt we will ever see a penny, but it is very clear she has a world of st coming down on her.
This is demonstrably untrue, as her emails show she offered a refund. I am also informed her T&Cs fall foul of the Unfair Contract Terms Act. There is also the small matter that she cannot deliver the service we paid for as she no longer has the boat.
Meanwhile, some of the other s
t that is coming down on her is hard to believe...She has now been expelled from PADI, and is listed as such on their website.
The CCJ she got in December is still unsatisfied.
The HSE case against her is crazy. I heard rumours that she is routinely flouting the Diving at Work Regulations, and she was served with an improvement notice last year, when the HSE found out her safety diver did not have a HSE medical. She has publicly admitted this on social media, but claims it was an error made by the safety diver, who she claims believed a GP's note was sufficient. She also claims the HSE investigation is over.
What has really happened is she had a family sign up for some training (mum, dad and son). She had three different instructors teaching them. Each instructor was teaching alone - no safety diver, no shore cover, and the gates tot the quarry locked behind them.
The instructor on day 3 raised concerns to her about teaching alone. He is not a UK national and did not know at first that this is actually illegal in the UK. She dismissed his concerns and he has subsequently gone to the HSE.
I do not know exactly how they conducted their investigation, but I expect one of the first things they do is demand to see all the dive logs. They will no doubt then ask for the medical certificates of the instructors and safety divers named on that log. This is an easy one for the HSE to prove, so they can issue an improvement notice fairly swiftly.
If the safety divers were not there, so she is relying on people being willing to lie for her. One of those people is her mother, who says she was providing shore cover. At the same time one of the dives was taking place, the England women's football team were playing, and she has put a photo on Facebook showing she was watching it in her living room.
The HSE have then contacted the family, and the parents are now quite angry. Dad has contacted the agency she is now teaching under and made a complaint. He then finds out she has signed the paperwork to say she taught them, which is untrue. He also finds out the instructor on the second day was not qualified. He has also discovered that somebody has forged his and his wife's signatures on the paperwork.
I am also aware the finance company she borrowed from have started recovery proceedings.
I doubt we will ever see a penny, but it is very clear she has a world of s
t coming down on her.Somebody else who is taking them to court has posted on a diving forum that they have just changed their accounting period. It ended 31st July last year and has been changed to 31st December, meaning their accounts, which were due to be published soon, are now not due until 30th September.
He added the following:
"Looking at various accountants websites, this can be a red flag that a company is in financial difficulty and possibly struggling with paying it's debts / creditors; or has accounting history it wants to keep hidden for as long as possible. It is (according to the accountants pages I can find) often a pre-cursor to a company closing or declaring bankruptcy and going into administration without facing up to it's financial responsibilities."
Any more thoughts?
He added the following:
"Looking at various accountants websites, this can be a red flag that a company is in financial difficulty and possibly struggling with paying it's debts / creditors; or has accounting history it wants to keep hidden for as long as possible. It is (according to the accountants pages I can find) often a pre-cursor to a company closing or declaring bankruptcy and going into administration without facing up to it's financial responsibilities."
Any more thoughts?
There has been another development.
I was contacted a few days ago by the dad from the family involved in the HSE case, who also have a County Court claim against them. He asked me for my email address and forwarded some correspondence between him and his local County Court.
Just to recap, Company 1, who we booked with has mother and daughter as directors. Company 2 is the new name of the first business and has the daughter and her wife as directors (mother was briefly a director too). I have not posted this yet, but the wife has registered Company 3, with just her as a director.
The email he sent to the court informed them that he had an outstanding County Court case against Company 1, and that he was aware of another (ours), and an unsatisfied CCJ. The court hearing was listed for 15 minutes in the name of the daughter, as a a civil application. He thought it may be an attempt to have Company 1 wound up, so he asked what the proper way of making a representation to the court was. I sent a similar email and was told it had been forwarded to the District Judge.
The bloke who contacted me told me he only lives 20 minutes away, so he was going to the hearing. I got a call from him later.
The hearing related to a debt the daughter has in her own name. It seems the boat is owned by her personally, and she leased it to the business. She has borrowed £35,000, and defaulted on the repayments. The finance company are going to apply to make her bankrupt, but cannot do so at the moment as she has 'breathing space'. Yesterday's hearing was an application to extend the breathing space, however, she did not show up.
The solicitor representing the finance company has asked for the case to be adjourned and relisted at the earliest opportunity after her breathing space period has ended, and they are then going to apply for her to be made bankrupt.
I also have it on good authority that her mother is in a similar situation, so it looks like both the directors will be disqualified. This leaves Company 1 with no directors, Company 2 with just one, and Company 3 unaffected.
This means that if we get a judgement, the bailiffs won't be able to slap a notice on the boat, so this makes our chances of getting anything back even more remote.
Question: what are the processes when all of a limited company's directors are disqualified following bankruptcy?
With regards to the latest company, it has the suffix 'fest' in its one word name, so i guessed it was clearly it is some sort of event. They announced the launch and published the website the same day she was in court. They are supposed to be organising a 'scuba diving and conservation festival' over a weekend in September 2025. They say there will be manufacturers present, talks, a professionals area, camping with barbecue and live music, and product demonstrations in their quarry.
They are advertising stands from £350 +VAT, then £5,000 to be the headline sponsor, 2 main sponsors at £2,000 each, 5 sub-sponsors at £1,000 each, and 8 awards sponsors at £250 each.
I will show my arse in the middle of Lidl if this event goes ahead. Their reputation is bad enough that nobody in the industry with any sense will have any involvement in it. I have put the word out to a few people I know who are involved with organisations like Seasearch and the Marine Conservation Society, to make them aware of who is behind this venture.
The other issue is I am sure they will lose the lease on the quarry pretty soon. The council who own it have a case against them relating to their health and safety breaches, and there is another group offering to take it over. I would expect the lease to be in the name of Company 1, which means it will be terminated if the company is struck off.
I then suspect those unfortunate enough to be hoodwinked will have a fight to get their money back.
I was contacted a few days ago by the dad from the family involved in the HSE case, who also have a County Court claim against them. He asked me for my email address and forwarded some correspondence between him and his local County Court.
Just to recap, Company 1, who we booked with has mother and daughter as directors. Company 2 is the new name of the first business and has the daughter and her wife as directors (mother was briefly a director too). I have not posted this yet, but the wife has registered Company 3, with just her as a director.
The email he sent to the court informed them that he had an outstanding County Court case against Company 1, and that he was aware of another (ours), and an unsatisfied CCJ. The court hearing was listed for 15 minutes in the name of the daughter, as a a civil application. He thought it may be an attempt to have Company 1 wound up, so he asked what the proper way of making a representation to the court was. I sent a similar email and was told it had been forwarded to the District Judge.
The bloke who contacted me told me he only lives 20 minutes away, so he was going to the hearing. I got a call from him later.
The hearing related to a debt the daughter has in her own name. It seems the boat is owned by her personally, and she leased it to the business. She has borrowed £35,000, and defaulted on the repayments. The finance company are going to apply to make her bankrupt, but cannot do so at the moment as she has 'breathing space'. Yesterday's hearing was an application to extend the breathing space, however, she did not show up.
The solicitor representing the finance company has asked for the case to be adjourned and relisted at the earliest opportunity after her breathing space period has ended, and they are then going to apply for her to be made bankrupt.
I also have it on good authority that her mother is in a similar situation, so it looks like both the directors will be disqualified. This leaves Company 1 with no directors, Company 2 with just one, and Company 3 unaffected.
This means that if we get a judgement, the bailiffs won't be able to slap a notice on the boat, so this makes our chances of getting anything back even more remote.
Question: what are the processes when all of a limited company's directors are disqualified following bankruptcy?
With regards to the latest company, it has the suffix 'fest' in its one word name, so i guessed it was clearly it is some sort of event. They announced the launch and published the website the same day she was in court. They are supposed to be organising a 'scuba diving and conservation festival' over a weekend in September 2025. They say there will be manufacturers present, talks, a professionals area, camping with barbecue and live music, and product demonstrations in their quarry.
They are advertising stands from £350 +VAT, then £5,000 to be the headline sponsor, 2 main sponsors at £2,000 each, 5 sub-sponsors at £1,000 each, and 8 awards sponsors at £250 each.
I will show my arse in the middle of Lidl if this event goes ahead. Their reputation is bad enough that nobody in the industry with any sense will have any involvement in it. I have put the word out to a few people I know who are involved with organisations like Seasearch and the Marine Conservation Society, to make them aware of who is behind this venture.
The other issue is I am sure they will lose the lease on the quarry pretty soon. The council who own it have a case against them relating to their health and safety breaches, and there is another group offering to take it over. I would expect the lease to be in the name of Company 1, which means it will be terminated if the company is struck off.
I then suspect those unfortunate enough to be hoodwinked will have a fight to get their money back.
With regards to the £900 offered, as a few people have said, it was never going to be paid. We did wait to see if it was paid before complaining.
As to why the other group got refunded but we did not, I do not know the answer to that, but it was not because they were more patient - quite the opposite in fact. As I said earlier, the other group was a BSAC club from the Clyde area, and one member of the group is a dive boat operator, and another is the current BSAC chair. I know them through the former.
When he told me he had got a refund, his exact words were, "We basically just threatened her...". As this seemed to work, we also tried a similar approach, but did not get the same result.
As for why, I do not know, but I suspect it could be the fact the group includes a highly regarded skipper and the current Chair of BSAC, they might be well connected, and have better resources available to pursue them. Another possibility is the fact that her mum's Facebook privacy settings aren't particularly secure, and she posted a picture of her daughter and the skipper getting married on the day of their booking.
Yesterday's development is the mother (who is the other director) was due in county court, with the hearing listed as a creditor's petition. She did not show up.
The solicitor representing the finance company told the court that when they try to serve papers, she hides behind the door and turns the lights off. If they push them through the letterbox, she pushes them back out again. He said he is going to try and serve them at her workplace and has requested a hearing as soon after the 17th May as possible.
The bloke I have been speaking to said he has complained to SSI again. He has done so previously to the UK office and was not impressed by their apparent failure to act. He has gone to the German office, which he believes is the headquarters for the EMEA region. They have responded this morning saying based on the evidence he has presented, they are putting together an investigation panel with immediate effect.
As to why the other group got refunded but we did not, I do not know the answer to that, but it was not because they were more patient - quite the opposite in fact. As I said earlier, the other group was a BSAC club from the Clyde area, and one member of the group is a dive boat operator, and another is the current BSAC chair. I know them through the former.
When he told me he had got a refund, his exact words were, "We basically just threatened her...". As this seemed to work, we also tried a similar approach, but did not get the same result.
As for why, I do not know, but I suspect it could be the fact the group includes a highly regarded skipper and the current Chair of BSAC, they might be well connected, and have better resources available to pursue them. Another possibility is the fact that her mum's Facebook privacy settings aren't particularly secure, and she posted a picture of her daughter and the skipper getting married on the day of their booking.
Yesterday's development is the mother (who is the other director) was due in county court, with the hearing listed as a creditor's petition. She did not show up.
The solicitor representing the finance company told the court that when they try to serve papers, she hides behind the door and turns the lights off. If they push them through the letterbox, she pushes them back out again. He said he is going to try and serve them at her workplace and has requested a hearing as soon after the 17th May as possible.
The bloke I have been speaking to said he has complained to SSI again. He has done so previously to the UK office and was not impressed by their apparent failure to act. He has gone to the German office, which he believes is the headquarters for the EMEA region. They have responded this morning saying based on the evidence he has presented, they are putting together an investigation panel with immediate effect.
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