Angela Rayner to face investigation?

Angela Rayner to face investigation?

Author
Discussion

119

7,135 posts

38 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
chrispmartha said:
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
Hugo Stiglitz said:
chrispmartha said:
Why would she have to pay CGT if her explanation is correct?
It all depends - She didn't live there for the entire period, she rented it to her brother.
That’s not what she’s said happened. Have you got evidence to the contrary?
Where's the evidence she didn't?

Because she said so?
All I have done is posted her account of what happened, I didn't post anything as fact, but you did, hence asking where your evidence is?
Which of my posts did i state supposed facts?

Amateurish

7,787 posts

224 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
Hugo Stiglitz said:
chrispmartha said:
Why would she have to pay CGT if her explanation is correct?
It all depends - She didn't live there for the entire period, she rented it to her brother.
She says she lived there with her brother.

chrispmartha

15,630 posts

131 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
Hugo Stiglitz said:
chrispmartha said:
Why would she have to pay CGT if her explanation is correct?
It all depends - She didn't live there for the entire period, she rented it to her brother.
That’s not what she’s said happened. Have you got evidence to the contrary?
Where's the evidence she didn't?

Because she said so?
All I have done is posted her account of what happened, I didn't post anything as fact, but you did, hence asking where your evidence is?
Which of my posts did i state supposed facts?
You stated she didn’t live there, you stated she rented it to her brother.

Amateurish

7,787 posts

224 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
chrispmartha said:
You stated she didn’t live there, you stated she rented it to her brother.
That was a different poster

119

7,135 posts

38 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
chrispmartha said:
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
Hugo Stiglitz said:
chrispmartha said:
Why would she have to pay CGT if her explanation is correct?
It all depends - She didn't live there for the entire period, she rented it to her brother.
That’s not what she’s said happened. Have you got evidence to the contrary?
Where's the evidence she didn't?

Because she said so?
All I have done is posted her account of what happened, I didn't post anything as fact, but you did, hence asking where your evidence is?
Which of my posts did i state supposed facts?
You stated she didn’t live there, you stated she rented it to her brother.
No i didn't.

To either.


Amateurish

7,787 posts

224 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
Hugo Stiglitz said:
chrispmartha said:
Why would she have to pay CGT if her explanation is correct?
It all depends - She didn't live there for the entire period, she rented it to her brother.
That’s not what she’s said happened. Have you got evidence to the contrary?
Where's the evidence she didn't?

Because she said so?
The evidence that she lived there is:

1. It was a house she owned
2. She lived there before her marriage
3. She says she continued to live there after her marriage.

The evidence that she didn't live there is an article in the Daily Mail quoting a hatchet job by Lord Ashcroft quoting an unnamed neighbour.

chrispmartha

15,630 posts

131 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
Hugo Stiglitz said:
chrispmartha said:
Why would she have to pay CGT if her explanation is correct?
It all depends - She didn't live there for the entire period, she rented it to her brother.
That’s not what she’s said happened. Have you got evidence to the contrary?
Where's the evidence she didn't?

Because she said so?
All I have done is posted her account of what happened, I didn't post anything as fact, but you did, hence asking where your evidence is?
Which of my posts did i state supposed facts?
You stated she didn’t live there, you stated she rented it to her brother.
No i didn't.

To either.
Apologies git you mixed up with someone else in the quotes.

ZedLeg

12,278 posts

110 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
I can see where the confusion came from tbh, they quoted that block like they were involved.

djohnson

3,441 posts

225 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
Oakey said:
I guess it depends on whether you believe her and her husband lived separately during that period.
To be honest based on nothing more than gut instinct I don’t. However what I believe is irrelevant. Angie has clearly taken advice, she’s going to stick with ‘it was my primary residence all along’. Given the passage of time it’s going to be virtually impossible to prove to any reasonable standard that’s not true and hence that’ll be the end of it. The only issues I can see would be if ex-hubby appears with a different tale (and even that might not be particularly compelling from a former spouse) or it transpires she owned house number 2 as well and upon sale has treated that as her primary residence for CGT purposes for an overlapping period.

sugerbear

4,134 posts

160 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
Amateurish said:
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
Hugo Stiglitz said:
chrispmartha said:
Why would she have to pay CGT if her explanation is correct?
It all depends - She didn't live there for the entire period, she rented it to her brother.
That’s not what she’s said happened. Have you got evidence to the contrary?
Where's the evidence she didn't?

Because she said so?
The evidence that she lived there is:

1. It was a house she owned
2. She lived there before her marriage
3. She says she continued to live there after her marriage.

The evidence that she didn't live there is an article in the Daily Mail quoting a hatchet job by Lord Ashcroft quoting an unnamed neighbour.
It's a very good question about what constitues living at a property. If two people own two houses (each individually) and they live between the two would you expect them to

1. Pay council tax on property A and B with a 25% reduction for each because of the single person allowancea single person
OR
2. Pay full council tax on Property A and 75% on property B.
OR
3. Pay full council tax on both because they happen to use / sleep at both houses.

It's a quesion I would like to know as well because there doesn't seem to be any guidence on what consitutes living at a property, say you only pop in for an hour every day but still regard the property as your property (and consider it an opiton in case the marriage doesn't work), does that work? What constitues living at a property? Do you have to sleep over more than 50% of the time?


Gareth79

7,746 posts

248 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
djohnson said:
Oakey said:
I guess it depends on whether you believe her and her husband lived separately during that period.
To be honest based on nothing more than gut instinct I don’t. However what I believe is irrelevant. Angie has clearly taken advice, she’s going to stick with ‘it was my primary residence all along’. Given the passage of time it’s going to be virtually impossible to prove to any reasonable standard that’s not true and hence that’ll be the end of it. The only issues I can see would be if ex-hubby appears with a different tale (and even that might not be particularly compelling from a former spouse) or it transpires she owned house number 2 as well and upon sale has treated that as her primary residence for CGT purposes for an overlapping period.
We know for sure that she lived there for several years (2007-2009) and presumably long enough before to get the RTB discount, yet neighbours who lived there for 17 and 40 years claim to have never seen her.

There would be plenty of people who would know for sure and would be willing to give anonymous details to a paper - disgruntled former colleagues would have known her living situation for example.

Perhaps Ashcroft will reveal more information? I can't imagine he decided to randomly ask neighbours if they had seen her living there.

Oakey

27,619 posts

218 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
What's more likely?

A) Angela Rayner got married and then spent the next five years living in a separate house to her husband?

B) Angela Rayner moved in with her husband, kept her name on the electoral register for her own house, possibly rented it out to her brother and then sold up avoiding CGT in the process?


Mrr T

12,402 posts

267 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
sugerbear said:
Amateurish said:
119 said:
chrispmartha said:
Hugo Stiglitz said:
chrispmartha said:
Why would she have to pay CGT if her explanation is correct?
It all depends - She didn't live there for the entire period, she rented it to her brother.
That’s not what she’s said happened. Have you got evidence to the contrary?
Where's the evidence she didn't?

Because she said so?
The evidence that she lived there is:

1. It was a house she owned
2. She lived there before her marriage
3. She says she continued to live there after her marriage.

The evidence that she didn't live there is an article in the Daily Mail quoting a hatchet job by Lord Ashcroft quoting an unnamed neighbour.
It's a very good question about what constitues living at a property. If two people own two houses (each individually) and they live between the two would you expect them to

1. Pay council tax on property A and B with a 25% reduction for each because of the single person allowancea single person
OR
2. Pay full council tax on Property A and 75% on property B.
OR
3. Pay full council tax on both because they happen to use / sleep at both houses.

It's a quesion I would like to know as well because there doesn't seem to be any guidence on what consitutes living at a property, say you only pop in for an hour every day but still regard the property as your property (and consider it an opiton in case the marriage doesn't work), does that work? What constitues living at a property? Do you have to sleep over more than 50% of the time?
If your considering CGT. If you own more than one property and neither is rented. Your PPR is by election and has nothing to do with how long you are in a property.

bitchstewie

52,228 posts

212 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
Is she in prison yet?

119

7,135 posts

38 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
bhstewie said:
Is she in prison yet?
confused

lord summerisle

8,139 posts

227 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
rscott said:
Hugo Stiglitz said:
chrispmartha said:
She's explained it here

https://x.com/AngelaRayner/status/1762219581114884...


This just seems like a scraping the barrell smear campaign to me.
"All before I was a MP". Immaterial if the CGT and discount were paid, no problem.
To be eligible for the discount, you simply need to own the house for at least 5 years - nothing in the right to buy rules says you have to live there for all that time, so there's possibly only a CGT issue at most.
Which the conveyancing lawyer would have advised her on at the time of the sale.

chemistry

2,210 posts

111 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
Oakey said:
What's more likely?

A) Angela Rayner got married and then spent the next five years living in a separate house to her husband?

B) Angela Rayner moved in with her husband, kept her name on the electoral register for her own house, possibly rented it out to her brother and then sold up avoiding CGT in the process?
The answer is:

C) Grrrrr Tories

JagLover

42,716 posts

237 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
Oakey said:
What's more likely?

A) Angela Rayner got married and then spent the next five years living in a separate house to her husband?

B) Angela Rayner moved in with her husband, kept her name on the electoral register for her own house, possibly rented it out to her brother and then sold up avoiding CGT in the process?
Well wrongdoing isn't decided on what is more likely.

Interesting how some have decided it is a non-story despite the lack of evidence either way and what is the more likely scenario though.

Well worth further investigation by the media to try and determine the truth. Or is that an unacceptable "hatchet job" merely because the target of investigation is a Labour politician?.

z4RRSchris

11,360 posts

181 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
ashcroft might have bung a few quid to the ex husband to grass

gonna be much more to this, they release a few bits to get them to say something stupid, then release a bit more to discredit their explanation,

CGT please angie

Electro1980

8,458 posts

141 months

Tuesday 27th February
quotequote all
JagLover said:
Well wrongdoing isn't decided on what is more likely.

Interesting how some have decided it is a non-story despite the lack of evidence either way and what is the more likely scenario though.

Well worth further investigation by the media to try and determine the truth. Or is that an unacceptable "hatchet job" merely because the target of investigation is a Labour politician?.
Well it is a non story at the moment. Saying there is a “lack of evidence either way” is weasel words. You can’t prove a negative, and you are someone very happy to jump up and down on the “innocent until proven guilty” bandwagon when there is evidence but no legal verdict, yet here you are expecting made up scenarios happy to accept they might be true.

If the media find something then it should all come out and be dealt with. At the moment, however, we have people making up stuff and then demanding proof.

It’s pathetic really. What’s best? Demanding MPs prove they have paid their income tax correctly? Has anyone checked Starmars car is taxed and MOTed? After all, he would be breaking the law if he hasn’t. How can we trust someone to be PM if they don’t pay their car tax! It’s all the most pathetic levels of mud slinging.