Israel invaded
Discussion
blueg33 said:
isaldiri said:
blueg33 said:
Have Hamas made an error of judgement here? 9/11 was an error of judgement for Al Kaida, it basically got them wiped out. I get the feeling that Israel intends to do the same with Hamas.
Was it really an error of judgement for Al Qaida? Their ideology and fallout from what subsequently happened most certainly did not get wiped out. One could argue in some respects it was a success because it changed the way the western world lived and the 'forever war' still continues today even if the organisation was ultimately smashed. That would well be considered a major success on their end tbh. Israel might be able to wreck the organisation of Hamas but by that very actions they also are going to ensure the ideology they promote lives on as long as there are palestinians left.
Essentially the hate remains but terrorist groups have for the last 20 years been shown what results peace can bring (Northern ireland) and what conflict can bring (Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya)
vaud said:
CoolHands said:
No one’s starting a world war over Iran. And China and Russia are pretty s
t anyway, and who else is there
You can only fight on so many fronts at once. America goes after Iran; Russia extends into Poland, China goes for Taiwan, etc.t anyway, and who else is thereRidgemont said:
g3org3y said:
How enlightened. Watch as they parascend and saw your daughters head off. But remember Floyd! 
Right now circa 300,000 Israelis are being armed and making ready for war all the time seeing footage of bodies, beheadings, solders faces being stamped on, young Jewish children being hit with sticks, fathers being shot trying to protect children. Even if the same has happend to families in Gaza it won't matter now Hamas have literally opened the gates to hell.
glazbagun said:
Where is PH sitting on the veracity of child beheading claims? Initially I could only find it from one source i24 which backpedalled a little. This is the most direct claim I can find from a journalist on twitter:
https://twitter.com/margothaddad/status/1711756690...
I strongly advise you don't look at this but youtube has enough uncensored videos of videos from the inside of the kibbutz where there were 100 bodies found. Some of those bodies of children.https://twitter.com/margothaddad/status/1711756690...
simo1863 said:
dalzo said:
Need more verification before I’ll believe it, takes an unimaginable amount of evil to do what’s described and if it is false the soldier or soldiers making the claim should be disciplined, hamas are scum but Israel need to box clever with there international image
CNN have been on the ground and done a report from the kibbutz in question confirming as such. I'm pretty sure they aren't going to broadcast beheaded infants though, even if the IDF would let them.If you need to see that just search on line. I suspect you don't want to because it doesn't fit with your views. But it's real, it happend and it is so vile that I actually feel sorry for citizens of Gaza who are about to come face to face with 300,000 Israeli soldiers who have seen not only videos but much worse.
BikeBikeBIke said:
isaldiri said:
actually happens so if you say the justification is by force of arms - fair enough.
We're all going round in circles but once again. What if we had absolute legal certainty and everyone agrees with that the Jews should be driven into the sea and replaced with an Islamic Caliphate. What are we gonna do? Join in and help do it?
Logically proving the Jews should all be killed doesn't remotely help the situation. It's irrelevant to our actions.
But that hasn't happened and won't happen now or even start until in reality Israel has had a bit of revenge.
BikeBikeBIke said:
Gecko1978 said:
Does anyone know why Hamas after being elected never held another election
https://www.al-monitor.com/originals/2016/01/hamas-fatah-palestinian-elections-postponement.htmlCar bon said:
dalzo said:
Extremely naive to think Palestine/Israel don’t have back channels that they can negotiate/communicate over.
Who exactly is 'Palestine' ? Is that Hamas ? or some other body that represents the population as a whole, or even the majority ?
Nations never don't talk as it leads to all manner of bad things
honda_exige said:
BikeBikeBIke said:
Skeptisk said:
Do non Jews in Israel and in the West Bank enjoy equal rights and equal opportunities?
Jews and Arabs in Israel are legally equal in every way. 20pc of the Israeli population are Arab.Arabs in the West Bank are a special case. Maybe you could walk through there alone and talk to them about it?
fizz47 said:
For those repeating the line that Arab Israeli have equal rights ..
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/arabs-is...
One again they are discriminated against.
When you have the likes of the Israeli finance minister openly saying a Palestinian village in the West Bank must be "erased" by Israel.
But of course nothing to see here .. let’s move along
Did you read it. If so replace Jews with American Conservatives and Arabs with American Liberals. They are not being discriminated against the supreme Court is being seeded with their followers (Jewish nationalist). Exactly what presidents in the US do when a justice dies.https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/arabs-is...
One again they are discriminated against.
When you have the likes of the Israeli finance minister openly saying a Palestinian village in the West Bank must be "erased" by Israel.
But of course nothing to see here .. let’s move along
Now I don't think a system where you have to wait for a judge to die is great and them being political appointed is great either but its a system used around the globe not just an apartheid system in Israel
Hereward said:
With Israel having air superiority over Gaza and the ability to precisely deliver missiles and bombs, what is the purpose of sending in ground troops?
I can understand the need for special forces units and snatch squads but cannot think of the reasons for sending infantry who will be sitting ducks in an urban environment.
I suppose it all depends upon the ultimate aims of the Israeli government.
Just my opinion but this isn't about military superiority it's about dealing a heavy blow to Hamas.I can understand the need for special forces units and snatch squads but cannot think of the reasons for sending infantry who will be sitting ducks in an urban environment.
I suppose it all depends upon the ultimate aims of the Israeli government.
People of Gaza have suffered and that suffering has been used by Hamas to carry out atrocities. There is no justification of rape and cutting off a man's head with a shovel. So air power to soften them up, special forces to capture or kill hamas leaders and maybe rescue hostages, ground troops is purely to crush the will, spirit and pride of the enemy.
HAMAS perhaps believe other Arab nations will rose up. Syria has just seen its airports bombed, Lebanon has a major army on its border Egypt I understand still restricts passage via its boarder. No one is coming to support hamas for fear of the wave of pain that will follow.
Really the voice of people in Gaza v Hamas should be heard (maybe elections, before these events, but now humanitarian coriander to Egypt might be best).
I also suspect hamas leaders overseas might also face threat of assassination. I doubt Qatar wants a direct war with Israel either.
otolith said:
AstonZagato said:
g4ry13 said:
Royal Navy deploying ships to support Israel.
Just what you need for some close quarters urban warfare in a densely populated city.
I have a maxim that one can't get involved with a sh!t show and not expect to get covered in sh!t.Just what you need for some close quarters urban warfare in a densely populated city.
Seriously though, anything like that is not for fighting Hamas, it's to discourage other regional actors from getting involved.
This is horrific but ask yourself this if you already thoughtuyour neighbours were a threat (Palestinians), you didn't like them, and infact you felt you owned the land they lived on (you are quite an angry person). They murdered raped an mutilated people you did like and filmed it, would you think no must not stoop that low or would you already be grabbing your machine gun looking for blood.
Logic and rules and laws have almost ceased to apply once you have watched babies being killed an women being raped.
Timothy Bucktu said:
I know the Hamas militants are a blend of religion of peace whose primitive brains run on clockwork...but even the most primitive lifeforms have a sense of self preservation, right? So who was the one who pushed them into the ring...Iraq?
Back here...my sense is that we're one Jew getting attacked from mass trouble in the streets!
It "feels" a bit like that however it's not like that in reality. Plus in the UK we have a strong judiciary. So race crimes are punished harshly. So let's say some Tommy Ribbinson type attacks some Palestinian protest they are going to find out what a cat A jail looks like for a few years. Same of a Jewish kid is attacked.Back here...my sense is that we're one Jew getting attacked from mass trouble in the streets!
Feelings and Fear must not cloud reality
Carl_VivaEspana said:
dalzo said:
Jordanian border guards now firing tear gas at people gathering at the border.
You have to wonder why the Egyptians and the Jordanians are closing their borders. k about other people not their problem and don't want it to be. We in the West have tried to be better/ weak (pick your side) and let people in.Other nations don't care.
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