Policing of pro Palestinian marches
Discussion
FiF said:
fido said:
FiF said:
Question is what do people want? Do you want going in hard? Kettling? Snatch squads? That will end up in a riot, a literal riot, and the cracked heads could include Tabitha and Jocasta from Rickmansworth, not just whichever hardline Hamas terrorist nutter from Barnet, or some right wing née football hooligan from Millwall.
Why should it matter whether it's Jocasta, Yusha or Josh? Preach hatred and you should be dealt with.So if there's a TSG style snatch and it then really kicks off we just know the narrative will be focussed on Tabitha and Jocasta out for the LoLs but ending up in a cell or even worse A and E.
Rock and a hard place.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3147508/C...
https://youtu.be/fF02YCYLEZk?t=45
fizz47 said:
Oliver Hardy said:
Stop selling arms to Israel so Hamas and the other groups in the region can eliminate Israel???
Or stop selling arms to a country that repeatedly violates international law, is an occupying force (per international law) and now is on the hook for where there is risk of ‘plausible genocide’ per the ICJ interim remarks.
The current Israeli govt has also made it clear that that they do not want any Palestinians to have their own land so are we that it’s ok to just get rid of the Palestinians?
What about the Kurds, why are there not weekly protests against Turkey, should UK stop arms sales to Turkey?
Why are there no protests against Russia?
PS if what is being reported is true, then the IDF is going why over the top, but if they did not have arms they would be slaughtered by Hamas/Iran.
Edited by Oliver Hardy on Monday 11th March 13:50
2xChevrons said:
Oliver Hardy said:
Why are there no protests against Russia?
"What do we want?" "For the West to do exactly what it's doing!"
"When do we want it?"
"As it has been for the past two years!"
Yes, there could be demonstrations for the purpose of just sticking it to Russia and/or showing solidarity with Ukraine and other border countries. Do enough people feel that strongly about it to do so, though?
It would be foolish to deny that Israel/Palestine is a particularly charged issue - politically, culturally, religiously etc. It's a nexus for all sorts of wider issues be that imperialism, nationalism, ethnic identity, human rights, genocide, the armaments industry, religion, religious fundamentalism, democracy and so on and on.
Was there any protests when Russia was dropping Chemical weapons on Syrians?
Why is no one protesting aboutr what China is doing to minorities or to Hong Kong?
Edited by Oliver Hardy on Monday 11th March 15:18
Ridgemont said:
bhstewie said:
It's fk up after fk up.
Their previous statement (the one they removed) was like some sort of sick joke.
To be fair (and I can’t believe I’m typing this) I watched the video and my first thought was ‘why on earth are you trying to cross across in front of those numptards. His argument was that that was on his way home: well welcome to the new new world of marchers rules.Their previous statement (the one they removed) was like some sort of sick joke.
Goaty Bill 2 said:
Greendubber said:
He may have had his bail conditions changed but he can still be arrested to prevent a breach of the peace (class 2 I believe in this situation) if his presence is going to cause issues.
https://freespeechunion.org/judge-blocks-police-ban-on-hamas-is-terrorist-banner-protester/ (avoiding Telegraph paywall)It is those very bail conditions that the judge has ruled against.
While it may be much easier to arrest a single non-violent individual to 'prevent a breach of the peace' it cannot possibly be morally correct nor the spirit of the law (says the man on the Clapham omnibus)
Edited by Goaty Bill 2 on Saturday 20th April 13:45
However to allow these gatherings every week for months that is just wrong
Panamax said:
Oliver Hardy said:
However to allow these gatherings every week for months that is just wrong.
Would you have said that about Martin Luther King? He began around 1955, was one of the leaders of the March on Washington in 1963 and was still protesting when he was assassinated in 1968. What's "wrong" is when governments persist in a course of action for which they have no mandate from the people and in the face of widespread public protest.
Or are you suggesting the Palestinians have nothing to complain about?
not sure what your on about here "when governments persist in a course of action for which they have no mandate from the people"?
Palestinians have justifiable grievances against the Israelis/Jews, but so do have the Israelis against the Palestinians/Muslims.
rscott said:
Solocle said:
rscott said:
The police had no issues with him being in that area, they just stopped him crossing through the middle of the march when alternative routes were available. He has a history of similar antagonistic activities. I note he was wearing a kippah to make it very obvious he was Jewish, something he doesn't do on many other occasions (eg posing for photos outside No 10, giving speeches outside in public, etc).
Alternative routes that presumably go around the march route and are substantially further, where a non-Jew would be allowed through? That's discrimination.As for being in the area, he was being verbally abused just being there.
Meanwhile at the 100 days bring them home protest there was guy walking around with a poster that was anti-Israel. Literally in the protest. Provocative, unlike being visibly Jewish should be to any right minded person.
Did he get beaten up or accosted? No. Because that's not civilised.
Had they permitted Faulter to go through, it would most likely have ended up with verbal confrontation, at the least,, especially if he was recognised (as he has a history of trying to generate footage of that). It was common sense policing, stopping someone from deliberately escalating the situation.
Isn't the problem more the fact that met put put a statement saying the guy was stopped because he was openly Jewish and not with the policeman who stopped him?
Countdown said:
Who_Goes_Blue said:
Countdown said:
Bugger me sideways with a small aubergine
There is nothing to stop you crossing the street.
There should be something to stop you crossing the street if your intention is to cause a breach of the peace by acting like a dhead.
Gideon is absolutely desperate to create a reaction so he can say "Antisemitism!!! It's because I'm JEWISH!!!!!!!!!"
But he wouldn't get a reaction because they are protesting against israel, not jews? Unless it is (also) about jews?There is nothing to stop you crossing the street.
There should be something to stop you crossing the street if your intention is to cause a breach of the peace by acting like a dhead.
Gideon is absolutely desperate to create a reaction so he can say "Antisemitism!!! It's because I'm JEWISH!!!!!!!!!"
Or are you suggesting the protester are likely to get violent with anyone walking against their flow?
Gideon wants to stop protests against Israel's actions by weaponising Antisemitism card.
isaldiri said:
Oliver Hardy said:
These are hate marches, We don't have protests against China when they carry out mass persecutions against the Uighurs, or Saudi Arabi who carries out target practice on the Yamens, or the Russians when they fired chemical weapons on Syrians...
Yep, Israel should definitely have the right (and our support) to do what the Chinese/Saudis and Russians have done as well..... Randy Winkman said:
Oliver Hardy said:
These are hate marches, We don't have protests against China when they carry out mass persecutions against the Uighurs, or Saudi Arabi who carries out target practice on the Yamens, or the Russians when they fired chemical weapons on Syrians...
Isn't the difference that we have lots of Muslim people in the UK and the war is a religious one? Also there are many other far left organisations latching on.
Edited by Oliver Hardy on Tuesday 23 April 15:41
Countdown said:
Oliver Hardy said:
Isn't the problem more the fact that met put put a statement saying the guy was stopped because he was openly Jewish and not with the policeman who stopped him?
He wasn't stopped because he was "openly jewish". if that were the case then thousands of jewish people in the UK would be getting stopped daily. He was stopped because Police guessed (rightly it appears) that he was intent on trying to create a breach of the peaceCountdown said:
Oliver Hardy said:
These are hate marches, We don't have protests against China when they carry out mass persecutions against the Uighurs, or Saudi Arabi who carries out target practice on the Yamens, or the Russians when they fired chemical weapons on Syrians...
Because nobody in the UK tries to defend what the Chinese, the Saudis, or the Russians are doing. When was the last protest march against the Chinese?
When was there a protest on the scale of the anti Israel protest against the russians if there ever was one?
Countdown said:
Oliver Hardy said:
So this weeks protest against the Chinese will take place and next weeks protest and the week later?
When was the last protest march against the Chinese?
They'll take place as soon as our elected Government starts going on about China's inalienable right to exist and selling them copious amounts of missiles and bombs.When was the last protest march against the Chinese?
Your saying the marches are anti UK government protest?
Countdown said:
Oliver Hardy said:
So what was he going to do?
I'm pretty sure he was hoping somebody would punch him in the mouth so he could shout "ANTI-SEMITE!!!"Edited by Oliver Hardy on Tuesday 23 April 16:13
wisbech said:
Oliver Hardy said:
So this weeks protest against the Chinese will take place and next weeks protest and the week later?
When was the last protest march against the Chinese?
When was there a protest on the scale of the anti Israel protest against the russians if there ever was one?
Not sure your point? Feel free to start a protest march against the Chinese if it is something you feel strongly about. When was the last protest march against the Chinese?
When was there a protest on the scale of the anti Israel protest against the russians if there ever was one?
rohrl said:
Oliver Hardy said:
wisbech said:
Oliver Hardy said:
So this weeks protest against the Chinese will take place and next weeks protest and the week later?
When was the last protest march against the Chinese?
When was there a protest on the scale of the anti Israel protest against the russians if there ever was one?
Not sure your point? Feel free to start a protest march against the Chinese if it is something you feel strongly about. When was the last protest march against the Chinese?
When was there a protest on the scale of the anti Israel protest against the russians if there ever was one?
Greendubber said:
Biker 1 said:
How many marches have been carried out since October? Must be getting on for 30-odd every Saturday in London. Apart from intimidating our Jewish population & costing £millions in policing, what exactly has been achieved?
Ceasefire: nope
2 states: nope
Can't the participants see the utter futility of it all?
Not much, probably quite a bit of negativity towards their cause but they can still shout at the top of their lungs if they so wish.Ceasefire: nope
2 states: nope
Can't the participants see the utter futility of it all?
Unfortunately society just has to stomach it.
Countdown said:
What’s the right word for someone who agrees with the building of settlements and opposing the right of Palestinians to their own country?
Call me cynical but there’s a group of people who deliberately conflate Israel’s right to exist with the above, the same group of people who conflate any criticism of the Israeli governments support and encouragement of the Settlers with “anti semitism”
What own country? A Palestinian state had been proposed several times included in 1948, but rejected. Under Clinton much of West Bank would have been handed over but that was rejected too.Call me cynical but there’s a group of people who deliberately conflate Israel’s right to exist with the above, the same group of people who conflate any criticism of the Israeli governments support and encouragement of the Settlers with “anti semitism”
There are many people without a country Kurds, Tamils, Tibetans,...
Countdown said:
CABC said:
chipping in here...
it would help if everyone tried to understand other points of view. I wouldn't seek to justify Israel's aggressions, but I suspect one view might be that after the Holocaust and "never again", the Israeli Jews found themselves from the start surrounded by people who hated them. It will take more than the West to underwrite the peace. All the Arab nations would have to commit to protecting a two state solution. On top of natural tensions that would still exist, they'll have to be mitigation from the meddling from Russia and China. Northern Ireland was a walk in the park.
Leaving aside the fact that israel could defeat all of the Arab nations combined it HAS peace treaties with almost all of them (Egypt, Jordan, the UAE). AIUI Saudi Arabia has agreed to a formal peace treaty if the issue of Palestinian statehood could be resolved.it would help if everyone tried to understand other points of view. I wouldn't seek to justify Israel's aggressions, but I suspect one view might be that after the Holocaust and "never again", the Israeli Jews found themselves from the start surrounded by people who hated them. It will take more than the West to underwrite the peace. All the Arab nations would have to commit to protecting a two state solution. On top of natural tensions that would still exist, they'll have to be mitigation from the meddling from Russia and China. Northern Ireland was a walk in the park.
The fact of the matter is that Israel wants to keep the occupied territories but without giving the Palestinians any rights. In order to permanently keep them it needs to effectively annex them with Settlements which usually means either restricting movement for the Palestinians (if they're lucky) or kicking them off their farms and land at the point of an M-16 and to make life so awful for them that they'll leave of their own accord.
Again repeating myself but West Bank was offered to the Palestinians and Gaza was run by them.
Countdown said:
Oliver Hardy said:
What own country? A Palestinian state had been proposed several times included in 1948, but rejected. Under Clinton much of West Bank would have been handed over but that was rejected too.
If you know anything about Israel's history you'll know that there were so many conditions imposed on any proposed Palestinian state so as to make any offer meaningless. Netanyahu has openly admitted that he's been doing everything possible to stop the creation of a Palestinian stateOliver Hardy said:
There are many people without a country Kurds, Tamils, Tibetans,...
Ah well, that makes it ok then.....Oliver Hardy said:
Yet it is Ok for Kuwait to have kicked out th Palestinians and Jordan to with draw citizenship that is OK
Absolutely fine. The Palestinians were never residents of Kuwait, they were on work permits. And in Jordan they were refugees. Comparing them to Palestinians living in the West Bank or Gaza is stupid.Oliver Hardy said:
Again repeating myself but West Bank was offered to the Palestinians and Gaza was run by them.
I don't want to be rude but you literally don't seem to know anything about the governance situations in either Gaza or the West BankAnd West Bank used to be part of Joran and region of Palestine was marked on the map it included all of Jorden, seems your the stupid one., and yes some of the Palestinians were on work permits in Kuwait other were not
Please enlighten me on the conditions imposed o9n a Palestinian state
What about the Jews who were displaced from Muslim lands?
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