CV19 - Cure Worse Than The Disease? (Vol 19)

To clarify, I should have said 'prior to Covid arriving in large numbers in Australia'.


https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations




https://ourworldindata.org/explorers/coronavirus-d...



I note the lack of granularity on which injectable products were administered.

The DHAC website gives the following information regarding a timeline for Pfizer products:

https://www.health.gov.au/our-work/covid-19-vaccin...

And the following for Moderna:

No-one knows what causes autism. Any direct attribution therefore has to be treated with caution but completely ruling out a link with vaccinations would seem unwise to me as well.

Right. So your argument is that the mRNA vaccines were rolled out in Oz prior to covid arriving in very large numbers of cases by way of omicron which only really happened end of 2021/early 2022 - I can certainly agree with that.

Can you point to a 'rise in reported ill health' that has increased in line with that vaccination rollout throughout early 2021?

Another valuable, nay indispensable contribution there from [T]Rollin. Whatever would we do without your wit, wisdom and insight?

No doubt earned a few 'attaboy' pats on the back from like minded raconteurs. Be sure to cash them in before they expire.

This analysis might be useful:
https://www.abs.gov.au/articles/measuring-australi...

It states that excess deaths in 2021 were 1.6% above expected. Covid-19 vaccines were rolled out from February 2021, well before the major Omicron wave of early 2022. So it doesn't appear that the Covid-19 vaccines created major harms.

Of course, a crazy person will say "Ah, but the killer vaccines didn't start wiping out millions until 2022 you see."
Or, "Oh, the Australian Bureau of Statistics, you can't trust them, they falsify the data!"

I am quite certain that autism has been with us far longer than vaccines have.

In fact some scientists believe that autism has played an important part in human evolution.

https://theconversation.com/how-our-autistic-ances...

Autism is genetic and hereditary. Autistic genes have been selected repeatedly through generations. Because autistic people tend to be agents of change.

It seems entirely unlikely that this genetic condition that can be seen in people throughout history is a side effect of modern vaccines.

It’s a mistake to assume that autism is characterised by people with severe disability and communication difficulties. The same condition gave us Einstein and Elon Musk.

I repeat. No-one knows what causes autism. Some scientists think it is largely genetic related. Some don't. In my experience, with two autistic members of the family, autistic people are no more likely to be agents of change or able to display special talents than they are to be withdrawn non productive members of society. Obviously, famous people who are also diagnosed as autistic tend to be receive a lot of publicity. The same thing happens with dyslexia.

I rule nothing out in terms of causes.

Repeating it isn’t going to make me agree

There is very strong evidence that autism is hereditary. Whilst a specific genetic cause has yet to be proven there is really no other explanation for the way it presents in families through multiple generations:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heritability_of_auti...

The fact that the diagnostic criteria require symptoms to “limit and impair everyday functioning” reinforces the idea that autism is a disability, but for most people this is not the case. For many neurodivergence has positive aspects.

I think it is entirely reasonable to rule out vaccination as a ‘cause’ of autism, because the condition very clearly existed before vaccines were developed.

Michelangelo, Darwin, Newton and Mozart are all thought to have been likely to be autistic. Their ‘different’ brain function existed long before vaccines.

Maybe you can run through the pharmacokinetics/licensed indications/ current uses of midazolam and then try and argue there is a link.

Maybe you could run through the dispensing data down to VMPP level and explain it and back up your theory of state sponsored euthanasia (spoiler alert it wont)

Or more likely it will be gobbledegook and various links to YouTube and other weird websites and lots of whataboutery.

Maybe you would prefer patients are not prescribed just in case drugs as part of end of life care and they are agitated, drooling and in pain instead?

Likewise, suggestions and belief aren't evidence. It would be surprising if there was no genetic link, given what we see with many inherited conditions but we have no proof and a genetic link is not a root cause.

I understand the desire to portray autism in a good light but claims that people ranging from Einstein to Michelangelo were autistic are just laughable. I can see it with Elon Musk and for balance I'd throw in that irritating nerk Chris Packham. People are rather less keen to talk about the many more people who are life limited in a wide variety of ways. They aren't blessed with an ability to play chess just by looking at a board or instantly tell you what the day of the week it was on 15 May 1183.

The landscape has changed in recent years. Whilst it seems likely that what we call autism has been around for many years, its current prevalence demands explanation not the attempted celebration we often see. Anyone over the age of 50 will be able to testify to the absence in their schools and communities of the widespread autistic traits so commonplace today. Children did not commonly have meltdowns, bash their heads against walls or be non-verbal and unable to make eye contact. We know that these behaviours cannot be suppressed so the idea that they were always present and we just didn't recognise them is a construction not a fact, a modern construction of people who weren't there.

I'd obviously be more relaxed about the condition if autism meant brilliance with difference but it most definitely does not in the majority of cases I see, For that reason alone I would like to see the causes identified, which has nothing to do with blaming vaccines and everything to do with ruling nothing out, including vaccines.