The autism thread

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Sporky

6,496 posts

66 months

Friday 4th August 2023
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timeism0ney said:
I'm hoping that now since disclosure it's more of a shared responsibility for us all to get on and play ball at work, and not all down to me to do the impossible in tricky (for me) social settings.
That's a good way of putting (and seeing) it. I don't expect work to reorganise or revolve around me, but a few tweaks already have meant that I get more done more easily.

One that's made a big difference us that the rest of the team will pop me a Teams or Zoom message rather than just calling out of the blue, usually with a link to the thing they want to ask about. Having a minute or so to get documents open and have a quick scan at them means I can understand and answer the question much faster.

In news related to the post you quoted, we've now agreed a 4-day-week on 89% of salary, keeping my full holiday allowance. They aren't ready to consider a general 4DW, so my having the diagnosis meant they could view it as a reasonable adjustment, and thus not set a precident. The other outcome is a (very quiet) demotion, essentially removing any formal management responsibilities. I still do standard setting and design reviews, but not personnel stuff. Which is good.

drmotorsport

767 posts

245 months

Friday 4th August 2023
quotequote all
Derek Withers said:
If you think that he is rather like you then take a look at https://embrace-autism.com/raads-r/ and see what you score. Its only an online test but it might give you somewhere to start from.
Ok thanks, 119, can't say i'm surprised! I always have to be careful with these kind of tests as often find the questions quite leading and frequently have to re-read them in the 3rd person so to speak. Interesting line of questioning about textures, which i'd forgotten was an indicator.

drmotorsport

767 posts

245 months

Friday 4th August 2023
quotequote all
timeism0ney said:
Autism can't really develop, but our understanding of it & seeing it for what it is, can change. Masking can play a part too.
I have two teens who I believe both to be on the spectrum, one was more obviously autistic as a young child but was never too much trouble in school etc so never diagnosed in childhood (currently on the waiting list). They came across as an introvert in older teen years like yours. Also gone the trans path - you can DM me if you like for support (not that I'm an expert but happy to listen and totally understand the distressing feelings).
My other child was cuddly and sociable when young but then had a major mental health crisis (suicidal ideation, self harm etc) which uncovered diagnosis of autism and adhd. I think adhd element can be likeable and comes across as high-energy and cute in young children so this can obscure parents being able to see autistic traits. Since the diagnosis things are infinitely better in practical sense - although the struggle still remains, of course.


Edited by timeism0ney on Thursday 3rd August 22:28
Thanks will bear that in mind - mostly trying to rationalise failing as the male role model ATM and being calm and compassionate in front of him (when i'm absolutely seething inside with his huge FU to us parents that he's just dropped). I was curious if something flips in the brain when puberty hits. Obviously there's the stereotypical image of the grumpy teenager, always assumed the swan would appear on the other side once a little maturity has happened, maybe that doesn't happen for autistic folk.

I hope your kids are coping with some guidance.

Derek Withers

876 posts

188 months

Friday 4th August 2023
quotequote all
drmotorsport said:
Derek Withers said:
If you think that he is rather like you then take a look at https://embrace-autism.com/raads-r/ and see what you score. Its only an online test but it might give you somewhere to start from.
Ok thanks, 119, can't say i'm surprised! I always have to be careful with these kind of tests as often find the questions quite leading and frequently have to re-read them in the 3rd person so to speak. Interesting line of questioning about textures, which i'd forgotten was an indicator.
I know exactly what you mean about the questions. The re-read is to work out what the writer is trying to get at?


drmotorsport

767 posts

245 months

Saturday 5th August 2023
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Derek Withers said:
I know exactly what you mean about the questions. The re-read is to work out what the writer is trying to get at?
Yep, although a little knowledge is a dangerous thing and I can make an inferred assumption on the score weighting, but at the same time I know I should/want to be more neutral to avoid confirmation bias, so get into a loop of putting the obvious to me answer, but then agonising that maybe my answer is too obvious! Also booming hard if not downright impossible to answer the questions of what other people think of me/my behaviour!

Sporky

6,496 posts

66 months

Saturday 5th August 2023
quotequote all
I think RAADS-R can be a useful part of working out if you're autistic. Some of it is a bit ambiguous, and some of it is hard to answer "fairly" - I know what the questions mean, but I don't think they mean to ask it how they do, for example. Or there are things which are difficult, but not as impossible as the question suggests.

I'm pretty sure that picking the questions apart is/can be an autism trait in itself...

P2KKA

104 posts

62 months

Saturday 5th August 2023
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Derek Withers said:
If you think that he is rather like you then take a look at https://embrace-autism.com/raads-r/ and see what you score. Its only an online test but it might give you somewhere to start from.
201

Errm..

Sporky

6,496 posts

66 months

Saturday 5th August 2023
quotequote all
That's probably a yes.

timeism0ney

103 posts

95 months

Sunday 6th August 2023
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drmotorsport said:
Thanks will bear that in mind - mostly trying to rationalise failing as the male role model ATM and being calm and compassionate in front of him (when i'm absolutely seething inside with his huge FU to us parents that he's just dropped). I was curious if something flips in the brain when puberty hits. Obviously there's the stereotypical image of the grumpy teenager, always assumed the swan would appear on the other side once a little maturity has happened, maybe that doesn't happen for autistic folk.

I hope your kids are coping with some guidance.
When did you find out? It takes time to process. If only recently, then this is a good book:

My Child is Transgender: 10 Tips for Parents of Adult Trans Children by Matt Kailey
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00867Y6OU/

It's very short (more like an essay) and specifically helps to process the news at the initial stages. There is a lot this book doesn't cover but it does help to just absorb the information at a basic level and avoid (as much as possible) drowning in confusion and overwhelm. In particular, it helps a little to set the misplaced parental guilt aside. Your child didn't come out to punish you for something you did or didn't do, but the realisation that these things aren't connected will only come when you better understand what's going on in your child's head. Again, it takes time.

FFLAG is a charity supporting LGBTQ families, there are some good resources on the website and parents meet on zoom every second Wednesday of the month. I personally know two families with trans children and two trans ex-colleagues, knowing/talking to real people who really get it face to face cannot be underestimated. My employer's LGBTQ support network is also very strong. Support is really important - both for you and for your adult child - and it's not always the same kind of support that is needed because you are looking at this situation from very different angles.

Intersectionality between neurodiversity and gender identity is important, I think, and explains a lot. In simplistic terms I see it as neurodiverse people thinking differently about literally everything - so why would gender/sex be an exception? Couple this with hyperfocus and it becomes impossible to leave the gender/sex issue alone, and no traditional answers help in any way because that's just too neurotypical and boring really.

Lastly, as you probably, hopefully, know, without family support trans people struggle so much more than necessary. When I asked my teenager what's their worst fear with respect to sharing this information with their dad, the response was: "I hope he won't hate me".

My kids are doing well at the moment, they are very academic and very creative, so I know they will grow up and will do amazing things in life. I do struggle with all the advanced parenting I need to do sometimes, but there is a lot of personal growth for me in this also.

Edited by timeism0ney on Sunday 6th August 00:57

Derek Withers

876 posts

188 months

Sunday 6th August 2023
quotequote all
drmotorsport said:
Thanks will bear that in mind - mostly trying to rationalise failing as the male role model ATM and being calm and compassionate in front of him (when i'm absolutely seething inside with his huge FU to us parents that he's just dropped). I was curious if something flips in the brain when puberty hits. Obviously there's the stereotypical image of the grumpy teenager, always assumed the swan would appear on the other side once a little maturity has happened, maybe that doesn't happen for autistic folk.

I hope your kids are coping with some guidance.
I believe that it is the transition into teenage years / seconary school that make Autistic kids suddenly struggle. Primary school years are pretty simple compared to the complexity and nuance of teenage life.

timeism0ney

103 posts

95 months

Sunday 6th August 2023
quotequote all
I've done the RAADS-R test today, for the first time. Was stuck on a stationary train on the way to the Pride Parade so had nothing better to do. Score 170. (For context I am sure I have autism and ADHD and currently on the waiting list for an assessment).

I tend to agree that the questions are perhaps not very effective. It is clear they've all been written by NT people. I have attempted this test before and gave up half way through, partly because of my ADHD impatience / low boredom threshold and partly because - yes, if you have autism, you start to analyse the questions instead of answering them. Then you either arrive at the conclusion that the questions are stupid and not worth your time, or you procrastinate to such a degree that you can't finish the test. Or both!

Some questions also require a degree of self awareness that only someone with a diagnosis can achieve (and not before).

For example:
  • It is difficult for me to start and stop a conversation. I need to keep going until I'm finished. (true / not true / etc)
There are plenty of autistic people who do this and have no idea they're doing it!

Similarly:
  • I get along with other people by following a set of specific rules that help me look normal.
This is masking, and you will know it is masking if you are diagnosed and understand the concept. You'd typically have no clue you are masking (or often even what masking means) before the diagnosis.

Essentially having autism and ADHD really gets in the way of answering these questions in a useful way.

Edited by timeism0ney on Monday 7th August 08:14

Sporky

6,496 posts

66 months

Monday 7th August 2023
quotequote all
I seem to remember hearing/reading that one of the best indicators of autism is that as soon as you think (I wonder if I might be autistic?) you go off and read/watch everything you can find about autism.

I think RAADS-R is useful despite its weirdness, but not worth overthinking (aware as I am of the impossibility of not-overthinking it). When I had my results from the formal diagnosis, one of the first things the psychologist said was "when we compared our notes, we all knew you were autistic in the first 20-30 seconds. The rest of the interviews and questionnaires were to prove it."

I'm sure this was relevant when I started writing it. Not so certain now. Sorry.

drmotorsport

767 posts

245 months

Monday 7th August 2023
quotequote all
timeism0ney said:
hen did you find out? It takes time to process. If only recently, then this is a good book:

My Child is Transgender: 10 Tips for Parents of Adult Trans Children by Matt Kailey
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00867Y6OU/

It's very short (more like an essay) and specifically helps to process the news at the initial stages. There is a lot this book doesn't cover but it does help to just absorb the information at a basic level and avoid (as much as possible) drowning in confusion and overwhelm. In particular, it helps a little to set the misplaced parental guilt aside. Your child didn't come out to punish you for something you did or didn't do, but the realisation that these things aren't connected will only come when you better understand what's going on in your child's head. Again, it takes time.

FFLAG is a charity supporting LGBTQ families, there are some good resources on the website and parents meet on zoom every second Wednesday of the month. I personally know two families with trans children and two trans ex-colleagues, knowing/talking to real people who really get it face to face cannot be underestimated. My employer's LGBTQ support network is also very strong. Support is really important - both for you and for your adult child - and it's not always the same kind of support that is needed because you are looking at this situation from very different angles.

Intersectionality between neurodiversity and gender identity is important, I think, and explains a lot. In simplistic terms I see it as neurodiverse people thinking differently about literally everything - so why would gender/sex be an exception? Couple this with hyperfocus and it becomes impossible to leave the gender/sex issue alone, and no traditional answers help in any way because that's just too neurotypical and boring really.

Lastly, as you probably, hopefully, know, without family support trans people struggle so much more than necessary. When I asked my teenager what's their worst fear with respect to sharing this information with their dad, the response was: "I hope he won't hate me".

My kids are doing well at the moment, they are very academic and very creative, so I know they will grow up and will do amazing things in life. I do struggle with all the advanced parenting I need to do sometimes, but there is a lot of personal growth for me in this also.

Edited by timeism0ney on Sunday 6th August 00:57
Thanks so much for taking the time to reply. I'll DM you so as not to derail the thread.

timeism0ney

103 posts

95 months

Monday 7th August 2023
quotequote all
drmotorsport said:
Thanks so much for taking the time to reply. I'll DM you so as not to derail the thread.
Sure. You’re welcome and glad it helps a little.

sparkyhx

4,156 posts

206 months

Wednesday 16th August 2023
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jodypress said:
That's good going, my waiting list (GReenwich) is 4.5 years...pmsl. Not expecting it to make much difference if I get the confirmation.

Having gone through this last year with my son, we ended up going private to get the ADOS assessment. the way Autism is treated in this country it pathetic. For example in Brazil they take it seriously and give Autistic children therapy pretty quickly and it works. We've a fiends who was based in UK and went private route when she saw her 18month old had signs. Spent a fortune and no real benefits. Went back to Brazil and after regular therapy her child has made fantastic progress. This wouldn't have happened here.
Curious - what is the therapy you talk about...........is it PACT? Of course Brazil has the same issues as here with lack of resource post diagnosis (TBH pre diagnosis and diagnosis as well) PACT is just starting to become more available in UK. PACT itself was developed in Manchester about 10-15 years ago and is aimed more at younger <10 year olds - I look at it as almost accelerated Masking techniques teaching. Often techniques they learn themselves by adulthood so they can fly under the radar.

Its a bit sad the kids who have flown under the radar successfully enough before it all falls apart in secondary school are the ones who wont benefit from this.



sparkyhx

4,156 posts

206 months

Wednesday 16th August 2023
quotequote all
timeism0ney said:
Autism can't really develop, but our understanding of it & seeing it for what it is, can change. Masking can play a part too.
I have two teens who I believe both to be on the spectrum, one was more obviously autistic as a young child but was never too much trouble in school etc so never diagnosed in childhood (currently on the waiting list). They came across as an introvert in older teen years like yours. Also gone the trans path - you can DM me if you like for support (not that I'm an expert but happy to listen and totally understand the distressing feelings).
My other child was cuddly and sociable when young but then had a major mental health crisis (suicidal ideation, self harm etc) which uncovered diagnosis of autism and adhd. I think adhd element can be likeable and comes across as high-energy and cute in young children so this can obscure parents being able to see autistic traits. Since the diagnosis things are infinitely better in practical sense - although the struggle still remains, of course.


Edited by timeism0ney on Thursday 3rd August 22:28
Trans Bi and homosexuality have higher occurrence in the Autistic population. Interestingly my wife sees a lot of pansexuality amongst her clients, but there is no real academic evidence to back this up. I suspect historically pansexual people have fallen into the bisexual definition.

LosingGrip

7,845 posts

161 months

Tuesday 19th September 2023
quotequote all
After a bit of advice...

Partners son is seven and to me is clearly autistic. She has been trying to get him diagnosed for 18 months or so. The school he's at is a little village school. I'm sure it's great if you don't have any additional needs, but it's ste for him. He has a sensory tent that is meant to be when he gets overwhelmed, but they use it as a punishment. A teacher said she had to wressel him into it this week as he wouldn't do as he was told...oh and the tent which is meant to be used to calm him down and reset himself is in the middle of the hall with everyone walking past...

There is a decent school nearby that is set up for children with autism. He has an EHCP that mentions his autism. To me, they wouldn't give this if they weren't sure he had it? His SEN person in the council is useless and never replies to emails which doesn't help.

They have given him full funding for a one to one TA for two terms and then they'll look at moving him to another school. However, without the diagnosis it seems he'll be in the challenging behaviour kids classes. That is not the right place for him at all. Oh they also haven't got the TA yet.

What can be done to push them into getting the diagnoses?

I'm quite judgmental of badly behaved kids, and whilst he can be stubborn (gets that from his mum...), he isn't just badly behaved. You just need to know how he ticks and understand him.

Any advice would be most welcome by my partner.

timeism0ney

103 posts

95 months

Tuesday 19th September 2023
quotequote all
>> She has been trying to get him diagnosed for 18 months or so.

You need to chase it. What has happened in the last 18months, what stage are you stuck at and with who?

>> The school he's at is a little village school. I'm sure it's great if you don't have any additional needs, but it's s##te for him.

You need to put a formal complaint about it. Seriously. That's horrendous and completely unacceptable. Don't be 'nice', be firm and assertive, that's the only way. Find local support groups / charities for parents of autistic children who can help you to draft the complaint, if you are unsure how to broach it.

EHCP I've heard is a painful process, but it SHOULD work, so you should press, chase, etc. I know it's hard. Again, if no response, you should be complaining in a formal way.

>> he isn't just badly behaved. You just need to know how he ticks and understand him.

The school staff must be trained in how to approach autistic children. It isn't optional. So, as above, complain.

My teens are 16 and 18 and most of my friends who are parents with autistic children (me included) have at least one legal battle behind them by this time. Formal complaints to school is just a start.

Apart from that, find your 'tribe'. There are wonderful support groups for parents of autistic children everywhere, it's just a matter of finding one in your area.

Sending virtual hugs and best wishes smile

jodypress

1,931 posts

276 months

Wednesday 20th September 2023
quotequote all
LosingGrip said:
After a bit of advice...

Partners son is seven and to me is clearly autistic. She has been trying to get him diagnosed for 18 months or so. The school he's at is a little village school. I'm sure it's great if you don't have any additional needs, but it's ste for him. He has a sensory tent that is meant to be when he gets overwhelmed, but they use it as a punishment. A teacher said she had to wressel him into it this week as he wouldn't do as he was told...oh and the tent which is meant to be used to calm him down and reset himself is in the middle of the hall with everyone walking past...

There is a decent school nearby that is set up for children with autism. He has an EHCP that mentions his autism. To me, they wouldn't give this if they weren't sure he had it? His SEN person in the council is useless and never replies to emails which doesn't help.

They have given him full funding for a one to one TA for two terms and then they'll look at moving him to another school. However, without the diagnosis it seems he'll be in the challenging behaviour kids classes. That is not the right place for him at all. Oh they also haven't got the TA yet.

What can be done to push them into getting the diagnoses?

I'm quite judgmental of badly behaved kids, and whilst he can be stubborn (gets that from his mum...), he isn't just badly behaved. You just need to know how he ticks and understand him.

Any advice would be most welcome by my partner.
The bit in bold is the most important. What does it say on the EHCP, does it nominate a school? I'm pretty sure you'll be able to get him moved to the school you mentioned, is that mainstream or SEN? SENDIASS could be your friend here as they're setup as advocates for parents/carers: https://www.kids.org.uk/sendiass

Having a diagnosis is great but for education purposes (even though it also says "Health") the EHCP is key and can be tough to get. For example, My 6 yr old was diagnosed privately in July 2022 and as he's not failing in school we've been told by a few sources; SENCO, ASD Outreach and others that he wouldn't get an EHCP atm. (I'm pretty sure by KS2 he will need additional support due to his literal understanding of the world)

If I were you, I'd contact SENDIASS, explain everything and they might be able to send someone with you when you goto meet the school. I'd say it's imperative for you to meet with the SENCO and perhaps Headteacher to express your concerns. Be polite but firm. You've already got the EHCP and that's a legal contract between the council, school and yourself.
The EHCP sets out a child / young person's special educational needs, the support they need, and what they'd like to achieve.



LosingGrip

7,845 posts

161 months

Wednesday 20th September 2023
quotequote all
Thanks for the replies! There is some good news. My partner has had a chat with the headteacher today. It appears that since the emails from whoever in the council and her there has been some movement and things are moving forward with a likely move to the new school. It's an SEN school. I've heard good things about it and when I've had reasons to go there for work (police) I've been really impressed.

What is sad is how hard it is to get support. I completely get its down to funding etc. But with the right support now, he'll be able to trive in life.