Israel invaded

We had an election in 2019 where the Conservatives were elected with a majority, which lets their leader appoint cabinet ministers.

A very important point. And even Israeli's too.

IMO - Israel have won this round with Iran. What they should do is take that win and not retaliate.

In which case they shouldn't dress it up as retaliation for yesterdays attacks by Iran. They would be better stating that they will target Hamas and in the open at least de-escalate with Iran

What happens if The Donald becomes President.

He appears very pro Israel - he recognised their embassy in Jerusalem for example. The Israelis will feel very empowered if he comes into power.

I have no hatred of Israel. You seem to equate dislike of a regime with hatred of a country. This is a common trope: whatever is done by Israel must be defended, just because. That's nonsense, whether it be applied to Israel, Iran, the UK, the USA, or anywhere else.

The recent history of Israel is almost like watching the Brexit process - extremists with a very specific set of ideologies and vested interests fomenting unrest and fear in their own interests. Every time there has been a viable prospect of a sensible peace, it has been derailed by right-wingers including Netanyahu and his ilk. Just saying "because democracy" doesn't make those things right or proper or sensible or historically justifiable.

In times past, extreme Governments used to try to shut down dissent. But if you take the teachings of Goebbels and couple it with the power of modern media (social and otherwise), and back it up with deliberate support for enemies of the state to ensure violence breaks out when "useful" then you can turn a nation in favour of your extreme viewpoints without having to be overtly despotic.

Are you seriously suggesting that the current situation is better than if, say, the Baruk peace process had been continued? Or maybe the Oslo process? Are you seriously suggesting Hamas would have risen to power, and maintained it, without the (acknowledged and well-documented) support of those in Israeli politics who simultaneously decried them in public? Netanyahu himself has been open and quoted on the subject: the rise of Hamas was his intention, his policy, his deliberate act to fracture Palestinian cohesion and derail the chances of peace.

The blindness to these arguably treasonous acts is staggering. The unending defence of Israeli government policy, lapping up the false pretext of "Hamas are terrorists, elected by and representative of the Gazans, intent on destroying Israel, and with whom we can never negotiate (and please don't pay attention to the fact that we put them there in the first place)" is really quite frightening to me. It is precisely why we got Trump and Brexit; it is why the likes of Cambridge Analytica (allegedly deceased) and a number of notable Israeli outfits of similar ilk (very much still alive) have made a very good living out of stoking up reactionary fury amongst otherwise reasonable people.

None of this excuses the actions of Hamas in October. But those actions were the obvious and logical outcome from the path chosen by incumbent Israeli politicians.

Israel is quite capable of electing reasonable leaders, and of being a more mature and measured member of the global community. This Israeli government seems incapable of those things.

And that's before we move on to the current Iranian situation. Carrying out an airstrike on an embassy is an enormous red line. Had Iran bombed an Israeli embassy, Tehran would by now have been flattened! An Iranian response was obvious. It is widely documented that right-wing Israeli governments have been trying to draw the US into a conflict with Iran for a very long time.

I won't go on; it is not as if any of this is hidden, or secret. It is just bewildering to me that so many seem unable to grasp the basic rules of cause and effect.

He'll rape the US to enrich himself first. After that God only knows. But it's probably reasonable to say he will only make any situation worse.
Whatever he does it won't be for the best interests of humanity, beit the US or the wider world.
Then again, he's so many axes to grind at home with a bit of luck somebody else will actually be making the decisions on US policy abroad.

And that is why Israel is almost certain to trigger some kind of retaliation - they are largely protected by their air defence systems and if terrorists incidents in other countries happen, well that's all rather useful for them as they have been actively seeking to have the US directly bring their military might against Iran.

Whether the US can or possibly even is actually able to keep any israeli actions to a level where it doesn't trigger a series of increasing reprisals is rather open to question given for all Biden's increasing criticism of Israel, he, like most other senior US politicians is simply going to default to the 'unquestioned support for Israel' mode that has been in place since the late 60s.

Even the Times of Israel is turning anti-Semitic … ( am I doing this right ?)

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/israe...


Some were in IDF uniforms and holding guns. There were 20 or 30 of them who beat me as I shouted for help, hoping that soldiers would hear me. But they were the soldiers… I laid on the floor, as every one of them kicked me in the head and stomach,” Golan says.


Nothing to see here right - Israel is the the victim because they certainly respect innocent lives, and are not stealing more land and are the peacemakers by following international law …

You claim you do not hate Israel when your every post shows otherwise. A fact noted by many who reply to your posts. It's also noticed you always refer to Israel in your posts, not the Netanyahu government, at the same time as claiming Hamas are not the people of Gaza.

The Baruk proposal was the best chance for peace unfortunately it was rejected by Arafat. Who, it was said, was warned by Clinton would lead to the rise of the right in Isreal.

I also notice you seem to spend a lot of your time posting that those who disagree with you are always supporting Israel. Do you miss posts, such as mins above where I clearly set out my many criticisms of the Netanyahu government.

While Netanyahu's game of playing off the Palestine factions was dangerous. If you think the logical outcome of that was to launch an unprovoked attack on Israel you must follow some odd logic.

I understand cause and effect, and if the attack had come from the WB, while I would condemn it I could see why it happened.

But this is not the WB it's Gaza. The settlers have gone. There where no Israel forces on the ground. Other than restrictions on what crossed the border so as to stop arms it was a country. Lots of aid was sent. Lots of beach. Hamas could have made Gaza a prosperous state. As we know they did not make that choice. They decided to fire rockets, dig command centres under hospitals, then launch an attack murdering and raping.