Baltimore bridge collapse
Discussion
hidetheelephants said:
I'd have thought helm angle and telegraph would be necessary too.
Quite right:The VDR must record at least the following:
Date and time (S-VDR)
Ship’s position (S-VDR)
Speed and heading (S-VDR)
Bridge audio (S-VDR)
Communication audio (radio) (S-VDR)
Radar data (S-VDR)
ECDIS data (S-VDR)
Echo sounder
Main alarms
Rudder order and response
Hull opening (doors) status
Watertight and fire door status
Speed and acceleration
Hull stresses
Wind speed and direction
However older ships are allowed simplified VDR compliance, indicated by (S-VDR)
Starfighter said:
hidetheelephants said:
I'd have thought helm angle and telegraph would be necessary too.
Yes, not unknown for the navigator's orders to the helm are mis-heard or just be plain dumb. I overheard an order of "Starboard 20, steer 385". The helm's response was "Starboard 20, steer 025. Eye, sir.". Vipers said:
Starfighter said:
hidetheelephants said:
I'd have thought helm angle and telegraph would be necessary too.
Yes, not unknown for the navigator's orders to the helm are mis-heard or just be plain dumb. I overheard an order of "Starboard 20, steer 385". The helm's response was "Starboard 20, steer 025. Eye, sir.". 
I always assumed they used standard compass directions
pinchmeimdreamin said:
Vipers said:
Starfighter said:
hidetheelephants said:
I'd have thought helm angle and telegraph would be necessary too.
Yes, not unknown for the navigator's orders to the helm are mis-heard or just be plain dumb. I overheard an order of "Starboard 20, steer 385". The helm's response was "Starboard 20, steer 025. Eye, sir.". I always assumed they used standard compass directions
pinchmeimdreamin said:
Vipers said:
Starfighter said:
hidetheelephants said:
I'd have thought helm angle and telegraph would be necessary too.
Yes, not unknown for the navigator's orders to the helm are mis-heard or just be plain dumb. I overheard an order of "Starboard 20, steer 385". The helm's response was "Starboard 20, steer 025. Eye, sir.". I always assumed they used standard compass directions
Starfighter said:
hidetheelephants said:
I'd have thought helm angle and telegraph would be necessary too.
Yes, not unknown for the navigator's orders to the helm are mis-heard or just be plain dumb. I overheard an order of "Starboard 20, steer 385". The helm's response was "Starboard 20, steer 025. Eye, sir.". 
Yep, the plan is to remove the vertical trusses, leaving the debris from the road deck on the seabed and giving enough depth for car carriers to use the northern half of the channel, probably partially laden bulkers and container boats too but that doesn't seem to be a consideration for some reason. There's a lot of concern about a buried gas pipe which the Dali is sitting on top of, so they're not rushing any part of the clearance of the southern half of the channel.
No. The current plan seems to be to remove the bridge debris and lighten the ship by removing some containers, maybe a bit of dredging around the bow and ballasting the ship by the stern should enable it to be removed, but it's going to be at least a month before that's likely to happen at current progress, clearing the northern half of the channel is prioritised as that is going to be much quicker to yield results and allow ship movements in and out of Baltimore.
Stick Legs said:
The VDR, Voyage Data Recorder, will record ECDIS (electronic charts info) RADAR and voice as a minimum.
Because of the way ships are ‘driven’ by issuing orders rather than taking the controls yourself as in a car, there will be a recording of those orders.
The verbal closed loop communication is pretty disciplined on most ships.
Aircraft use a hybrid system whereby the handling pilot tells the co-pilot what they are doing & the non-handling pilot confirms the manoeuvre.
There have been instances where the handling pilot says one thing & does another.
This is picked up by aircraft recording systems but not on ship’s ones.
black box stopped recording right before the crashBecause of the way ships are ‘driven’ by issuing orders rather than taking the controls yourself as in a car, there will be a recording of those orders.
The verbal closed loop communication is pretty disciplined on most ships.
Aircraft use a hybrid system whereby the handling pilot tells the co-pilot what they are doing & the non-handling pilot confirms the manoeuvre.
There have been instances where the handling pilot says one thing & does another.
This is picked up by aircraft recording systems but not on ship’s ones.
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2024/apr/02/...
Oliver Hardy said:
Stick Legs said:
The VDR, Voyage Data Recorder, will record ECDIS (electronic charts info) RADAR and voice as a minimum.
Because of the way ships are ‘driven’ by issuing orders rather than taking the controls yourself as in a car, there will be a recording of those orders.
The verbal closed loop communication is pretty disciplined on most ships.
Aircraft use a hybrid system whereby the handling pilot tells the co-pilot what they are doing & the non-handling pilot confirms the manoeuvre.
There have been instances where the handling pilot says one thing & does another.
This is picked up by aircraft recording systems but not on ship’s ones.
black box stopped recording right before the crashBecause of the way ships are ‘driven’ by issuing orders rather than taking the controls yourself as in a car, there will be a recording of those orders.
The verbal closed loop communication is pretty disciplined on most ships.
Aircraft use a hybrid system whereby the handling pilot tells the co-pilot what they are doing & the non-handling pilot confirms the manoeuvre.
There have been instances where the handling pilot says one thing & does another.
This is picked up by aircraft recording systems but not on ship’s ones.
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2024/apr/02/...
They should be one of the last things to lose power.
I find it sad that the main media grab a hold of these breaking disasters but then move onto the next story and don't keep us updated on how the clean up is going. Oliver Hardy said:
Stick Legs said:
The VDR, Voyage Data Recorder, will record ECDIS (electronic charts info) RADAR and voice as a minimum.
Because of the way ships are ‘driven’ by issuing orders rather than taking the controls yourself as in a car, there will be a recording of those orders.
The verbal closed loop communication is pretty disciplined on most ships.
Aircraft use a hybrid system whereby the handling pilot tells the co-pilot what they are doing & the non-handling pilot confirms the manoeuvre.
There have been instances where the handling pilot says one thing & does another.
This is picked up by aircraft recording systems but not on ship’s ones.
black box stopped recording right before the crashBecause of the way ships are ‘driven’ by issuing orders rather than taking the controls yourself as in a car, there will be a recording of those orders.
The verbal closed loop communication is pretty disciplined on most ships.
Aircraft use a hybrid system whereby the handling pilot tells the co-pilot what they are doing & the non-handling pilot confirms the manoeuvre.
There have been instances where the handling pilot says one thing & does another.
This is picked up by aircraft recording systems but not on ship’s ones.
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2024/apr/02/...
as some equipment is on offshore DSV’s
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