Ducting air from the nose void into the engine bay
Discussion
Right - for a variety of reasons, I would really like to get some additional cool airflow into and through the engine bay.
Have been kicking around the pros and cons of ducting air from the nose void via an inverted NACA duct, or even a pair, let into the horizontal panel that sits in front of the radiator top. Essentially, the duct(s) would funnel air up and over the rad; hopefully without overly robbing flow through the rad (and charge cooler secondary also in there) or, more importantly, without creating turbulence that prevents air penetrating the two sets of cores.
Seems to me it has the benefit of taking air from a notionally high pressure source where a boundary layer might just exist, whilst being hidden under the bonnet - not really wanting visible scoops or ducts on open show. Possible downsides are any prejudicing of the cooling system (I'm figuring loads of air 'leaks' around the sides of the rad anyway and that leakage probably serves to pull flow through the cores), and the potential for weather and debris ingress into the engine bay (the duct would be above/behind and shielded by the bonnet lip profile).
Initially at least, my air filter is going to be housed in the engine bay wedge/cossie style, and extra air throughput will obviously help that out as well as bring some cooling benefit. Discuss
Have been kicking around the pros and cons of ducting air from the nose void via an inverted NACA duct, or even a pair, let into the horizontal panel that sits in front of the radiator top. Essentially, the duct(s) would funnel air up and over the rad; hopefully without overly robbing flow through the rad (and charge cooler secondary also in there) or, more importantly, without creating turbulence that prevents air penetrating the two sets of cores.
Seems to me it has the benefit of taking air from a notionally high pressure source where a boundary layer might just exist, whilst being hidden under the bonnet - not really wanting visible scoops or ducts on open show. Possible downsides are any prejudicing of the cooling system (I'm figuring loads of air 'leaks' around the sides of the rad anyway and that leakage probably serves to pull flow through the cores), and the potential for weather and debris ingress into the engine bay (the duct would be above/behind and shielded by the bonnet lip profile).
Initially at least, my air filter is going to be housed in the engine bay wedge/cossie style, and extra air throughput will obviously help that out as well as bring some cooling benefit. Discuss
Pupp said:
Initially at least, my air filter is going to be housed in the engine bay wedge/cossie style, and extra air throughput will obviously help that out as well as bring some cooling benefit. Discuss
Won't that mean the air going into the engine will be hotter, so less dense and reduce your performance? Perhaps not so much as issue if you do manage to drop the engine bay temperature significantly...Apart from having your air filter inside the engine bay (which I agree will turn it into a hot air intake and would do anything possible to avoid) I can't think of any other reasons to want to lower the engine bay temperature. It would be fairly hard to make much of a difference on these things and would require quite a large airflow, you're probably going to need to buy some bonnet pins to stop it shaking itself loose
What are you trying to achieve, if it's just for the air filter then an enclosed feed straight from the front might be a better idea than trying to reduce the entire under bonnet temperature..
What are you trying to achieve, if it's just for the air filter then an enclosed feed straight from the front might be a better idea than trying to reduce the entire under bonnet temperature..
dazee said:
Won't that mean the air going into the engine will be hotter, so less dense and reduce your performance? Perhaps not so much as issue if you do manage to drop the engine bay temperature significantly...
Yes, undoubtedly, but not by as much as you'd imagine when moving (apparently) and there a sodding big compressor heating the charge anyway, hence the charge cooler on the other side of the turbo. Cooler air is always better obviously but this is about short direct air routing into the engine and stability. A long tortuous inlet just restricts air intake from the off even if that air might be a few degrees cooler - as I say, just kicking it around currently s p a c e m a n said:
Apart from having your air filter inside the engine bay (which I agree will turn it into a hot air intake and would do anything possible to avoid) I can't think of any other reasons to want to lower the engine bay temperature. It would be fairly hard to make much of a difference on these things and would require quite a large airflow, you're probably going to need to buy some bonnet pins to stop it shaking itself loose
What are you trying to achieve, if it's just for the air filter then an enclosed feed straight from the front might be a better idea than trying to reduce the entire under bonnet temperature..
The primary reason is to allow air at the filter - the tightest corner with a single turbo hung on the Y is the air inlet to the compressor. It faces out to chassis rails and steering gear so a bend in under the o/s manifold from the front is needed. Rather than then bend right and through the inner wing and all the way round into the nose (long pipework), I'm trying to use the volume that sits under the bonnet curve above the rad top area (there's loads more space there that you'd think); consequently, the duct I'm proposing would exit right into that volume and right in front of the filter which actually lies partly above the rad line. Any airflow introduced should exit either under the car into whatever low pressure exists there when moving, or maybe upward and out the bonnet vents with heat load... or will it? What are you trying to achieve, if it's just for the air filter then an enclosed feed straight from the front might be a better idea than trying to reduce the entire under bonnet temperature..
It not at all about keeping IC temps down; mainly as it doesn't have one It's about ensuring there is sufficient air of a reasonable (if not optimum) temperature around for the intake to draw from when moving. If there's any cooling benefit to help alleviate soak than that's a bonus - pics on the 'garage last night' thread if that helps visualise
Getting air out of the engine bay is more of the problem than allowing any in TBH... greater overall flow would mean heating thru rad effect would be reduced anyway?
Did you follow Ants project with insulated airbox over manifolds with NACA duct on bonnet closing over it (+ feed pipe from original location) .. and the surprising results it showed on RR at Emerald?
Note: Try shrouding the wings/rad line so the wings don't remove air from the nose so that then the wings only intake is under the indicators and all the nose cone is freed up for rad+engine bay. I did that years ago with filters in the top of the wing & it certainly improved cabin air quality cleaner & cooler..
Did you follow Ants project with insulated airbox over manifolds with NACA duct on bonnet closing over it (+ feed pipe from original location) .. and the surprising results it showed on RR at Emerald?
Note: Try shrouding the wings/rad line so the wings don't remove air from the nose so that then the wings only intake is under the indicators and all the nose cone is freed up for rad+engine bay. I did that years ago with filters in the top of the wing & it certainly improved cabin air quality cleaner & cooler..
Thinking outside the box - Have a look at the T350/Tamora/Sagaris way of using the air under the engine for the intake? Many have tried (expensively) to use forward facing ducts/pipes, but very few have demonstrated an improvement on breathing from underneath?
A large 2 or 3 inch duct straight down parallel/next to the sump either directly connected or feeding to an airbox for your intake may be an alternate?
Just trying to help?
T
A large 2 or 3 inch duct straight down parallel/next to the sump either directly connected or feeding to an airbox for your intake may be an alternate?
Just trying to help?
T
Thanks Both - open to any ideas TBH so will certainly consider these points. Dave, I certainly remember Ant's clever airbox mod but cannot recall seeing the Emerald RR results you mention - will have a search. I assume from the context that it did not improve things as much as anticipated?
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