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ED209
Original Poster
2,989 posts
114 months
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Now i am a financial numpty so can anyone tell me what the below proposals will mean to my pension?? The proposals are contained at the end of the letter. http://www.polfed.org/LetterToIanRennieAccruedPens...I will have 15 years service in June and will reach 30years service 2 weeks before my 50th Birthday.
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Elroy Blue
5,725 posts
62 months
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Probably the wrong place to ask. By page two of the thread, you'll be labled a Public sector parasite, who is getting something for nothing and should stay chasing 18 year olds around until your 94.
I'd speak to your local fed rep.
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ED209
Original Poster
2,989 posts
114 months
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Elroy Blue said: Probably the wrong place to ask. By page two of the thread, you'll be labled a Public sector parasite, who is getting something for nothing and should stay chasing 18 year olds around until your 94.
I'd speak to your local fed rep. Probably, i will pay through the nose for it though! I am just about sick of it now, I can just about stomach the thought of another 15 years but the thought of this being extended to another 25 years by our wonderful tory government makes me want to cry. Oh and with regards to speaking to my fed rep, they are the perfect example of the public sector parasite you mention. I wont be speaking to that useless bunch of wasters.
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Elroy Blue
5,725 posts
62 months
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I know what you mean about the Fed. But find the number for the your central office and go direct to them. Basically if you have more than ten years service left as of 01st April 2012, your pension is screwed and you're working till at least 60. No ifs or buts.
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ED209
Original Poster
2,989 posts
114 months
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Elroy Blue said: I know what you mean about the Fed. But find the number for the your central office and go direct to them. Basically if you have more than ten years service left as of 01st April 2012, your pension is screwed and you're working till at least 60. No ifs or buts. so how do you know that then? Thats not how i understand it from reading the home office blurb, they talk about 2015 being the date of change? Anyway my forces central fed office wont speak to me, im in a rather large dispute with them over the £4200 legal fees i have to pay when they refused to pay up in relation to a recent discipline matter despite that being the whole point of you paying your fed subs.
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10 Pence Short
27,907 posts
87 months
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God forbid you have to work until 60 to get a cast iron pension. How terribly awful.
I realise that might sound glib, but the pay and conditions (including pension) for the Police are pretty good compared to the majority of those of the private sector, particularly when you consider the relatively low academic requirements to join. Yes, the job has its difficulties and risks, but the conditions offered go towards making up that risk.
There is always the alternative of moving to the private sector if you don't like the conditions offered by the Government.
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oblio
3,034 posts
97 months
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10 Pence Short said: God forbid you have to work until 60 to get a cast iron pension. How terribly awful. 60 year old coppers...hmmm...  Not sure if that will help to keep chummy off the streets...plenty of accumulated knowledge but in a footrace running after a scrote? I feel it's a similar argument to teachers potentially having to teach up until age 66/67. Whilst there are undoubtedly good teachers who will stand the test of time I wouldn't want my nippers taught by most of the ones who will be left at that age.
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Elroy Blue
5,725 posts
62 months
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10 Pence Short said: God forbid you have to work until 60 to get a cast iron pension. How terribly awful.
I realise that might sound glib, but the pay and conditions (including pension) for the Police are pretty good compared to the majority of those of the private sector, particularly when you consider the relatively low academic requirements to join. Yes, the job has its difficulties and risks, but the conditions offered go towards making up that risk.
There is always the alternative of moving to the private sector if you don't like the conditions offered by the Government. ^^^^^ How very predictable.
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PAULJ5555
925 posts
46 months
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10 Pence Short said: God forbid you have to work until 60 to get a cast iron pension. How terribly awful.
I realise that might sound glib, but the pay and conditions (including pension) for the Police are pretty good compared to the majority of those of the private sector, particularly when you consider the relatively low academic requirements to join. Yes, the job has its difficulties and risks, but the conditions offered go towards making up that risk.
There is always the alternative of moving to the private sector if you don't like the conditions offered by the Government. Its not about liking these conditions as thats not the deal that he signed up for, its fine for new starters as you know the deal your getting but as with all puplic sector pension reforms they are changing the goal posts after you have signed on the dotted line.
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TPS
1,572 posts
83 months
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PAULJ5555 said: 10 Pence Short said: God forbid you have to work until 60 to get a cast iron pension. How terribly awful.
I realise that might sound glib, but the pay and conditions (including pension) for the Police are pretty good compared to the majority of those of the private sector, particularly when you consider the relatively low academic requirements to join. Yes, the job has its difficulties and risks, but the conditions offered go towards making up that risk.
There is always the alternative of moving to the private sector if you don't like the conditions offered by the Government. Its not about liking these conditions as thats not the deal that he signed up for, its fine for new starters as you know the deal your getting but as with all puplic sector pension reforms they are changing the goal posts after you have signed on the dotted line. As above^^^^ Sorry 10 pence short,you do not get the reason people are moaning. When people signed up to these jobs they agreed to work untill they were a certain age and pay a certain amount of pension. Now they are being told to pay more into the pension,take pay cuts and work longer. The pensions were a form of compensation for working all types of hours,weekends etc. How about someone comes along and changes your working conditions and pay and says you are going to work longer than you thought? Then we will see how you like it.
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Sparta VAG
418 posts
17 months
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We were all discussing this at work at great length yesterday. None of us are financial experts but for a top-whack cop retiring on £37k, maximum pension they can expect is something like £13k a year under the new arrangements (compared to either £24k now or £18k + lump sum). Two conclusions:
1) The job's f**ked.
2) Not worth staying in the job long term and paying in 14.5% of your pay every month under the new arrangements. I and others are now actively looking for new careers/retraining.
Rumours from the Fed (and they are only rumours mind) are that the next comprehensive spending review in 2014 will seek to reduce the number of cops down from 120,000 to 80,000 with the new compulsory redundancy scheme that's proposed.
ETA: You public sector parasite etc.
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DP1
134 posts
91 months
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TPS said: As above^^^^
Sorry 10 pence short,you do not get the reason people are moaning.
When people signed up to these jobs they agreed to work untill they were a certain age and pay a certain amount of pension.
Now they are being told to pay more into the pension,take pay cuts and work longer.
The pensions were a form of compensation for working all types of hours,weekends etc.
How about someone comes along and changes your working conditions and pay and says you are going to work longer than you thought?
Then we will see how you like it. Which is exactly the position that most civil servants etc find themselves in and are given a tough time on here should they dare to mention it. Policing is a different job I realise but the princilple of a changed deal still holds true. And no, I am not a civil servant, i work in the private sector.
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Iain XR4i
921 posts
22 months
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TPS said: Sorry 10 pence short,you do not get the reason people are moaning.
When people signed up to these jobs they agreed to work untill they were a certain age and pay a certain amount of pension.
Now they are being told to pay more into the pension,take pay cuts and work longer.
The pensions were a form of compensation for working all types of hours,weekends etc.
How about someone comes along and changes your working conditions and pay and says you are going to work longer than you thought?
Then we will see how you like it. I saw my private sector final salary pension taken away and replaced by a money-purchase scheme with lower employer contributions. That meant I had to pay more myself, and have no guarantee of the future value. Pay was frozen from 2008-2012. My choice was to accept the changes or find a new employer. Why are public sector workers different?
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helmutlaang
387 posts
29 months
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TPS said: How about someone comes along and changes your working conditions and pay and says you are going to work longer than you thought?
Then we will see how you like it. They did.It's called the goverment and instead of finishing at 65 I now finish at 68. Sorry OP,working a little longer is affecting virtually everyone now.
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PAULJ5555
925 posts
46 months
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Iain XR4i said: I saw my private sector final salary pension taken away and replaced by a money-purchase scheme with lower employer contributions. That meant I had to pay more myself, and have no guarantee of the future value. Pay was frozen from 2008-2012. My choice was to accept the changes or find a new employer. Why are public sector workers different? Because its a goverment backed pension scheme it was sold as being secure (the private sector in not secure), like having 30K in premium bonds (goverment backed) and now they say we'll only give you 15K bonds back.
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TPS
1,572 posts
83 months
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helmutlaang said: TPS said: How about someone comes along and changes your working conditions and pay and says you are going to work longer than you thought?
Then we will see how you like it. They did.It's called the goverment and instead of finishing at 65 I now finish at 68. Sorry OP,working a little longer is affecting virtually everyone now. I do not disagree that a lot of people either private or public sector are in the same situation. What i am saying though is that the pension/leaving age was a form of compensation for working days,nights,weekends christmas day etc. It will soon not be worth doing these jobs as you may as well have a better family life and have weekends off etc.
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Elroy Blue
5,725 posts
62 months
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ED209 said: so how do you know that then? Thats not how i understand it from reading the home office blurb, they talk about 2015 being the date of change?
Anyway my forces central fed office wont speak to me, im in a rather large dispute with them over the £4200 legal fees i have to pay when they refused to pay up in relation to a recent discipline matter despite that being the whole point of you paying your fed subs. The 2015 date realtes to the date good ol' Dave has decided that the current Police pension scheme (both new and old) will end. Finish. Full stop. In 2015, a new scheme will be set up, into which you pay more for significantly longer and get far less out of it. Of cours, after 40 years of shifts, having all your rest days cancelled, having annual leave cancelled, being assaulted etc etc, you won't live very long after you retire, so I guess it doesn't really matter. The sad fact is that a lot of Police Officers are totally unaware of what's coming. They Winsor report 1 and 2, the Hutton report, Neyroud report (Cameron certainly got busy as soon as he took office) are long and difficult to read, but they all affect your future. Notice there's no reports into MP's pay, pensions, expenses and conditions.
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ExChrispy Porker
10,587 posts
98 months
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I couldn't have managed 40 years. In fact I didn't even manage 30. If you are out and about doing the job, the injuries will get you, sooner or later.
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kwk
390 posts
48 months
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ExChrispy Porker said: I couldn't have managed 40 years. In fact I didn't even manage 30. If you are out and about doing the job, the injuries will get you, sooner or later. Couldn't agree more. I did my 30, none of those in an office role, but now, after only 4 years retirement but still working in another job, I know that I would not be fit enough to continue in a Police environment.
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Devil2575
4,661 posts
58 months
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TPS said: How about someone comes along and changes your working conditions and pay and says you are going to work longer than you thought?
Then we will see how you like it. Admittedly my pension is still very good, but this is exactly what has happened to me. I signed up to work for a private company and recently we have had our pension contribution increased, our retirement age increased and gone from 60ths to 70ths.
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