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nlldavies

Original Poster:

258 posts

114 months

[news] 
Monday 13th April 2009 quote quote all
Can anyone advise me on a problem with a car's finish please?

My Dad purchased a brand new Vauxhall Vectra in 2003 in Red. Within months of owning it the paint seems to have gone white on various places on the surface. He took it back to the dealership a few times, but they fobbed him off.

My Dad saved hard for a new car and I feel bad that its gone this way for him. I've tried Mer polish on a small part of the bonnet and it has helped a bit, but the whiteness is stil evident. How can I tackle this .. I'm up for putting some elbow grease in myself or even funding a specialist if that would be best.

Cheers

Mattt

15,545 posts

101 months

[news] 
Monday 13th April 2009 quote quote all
Best to put some pictures up so people see what you're dealing with.

nlldavies

Original Poster:

258 posts

114 months

[news] 
Monday 13th April 2009 quote quote all
I've just emailed my dad to get a couple of pictures emailed to me.

Thanks

Iain328

6,811 posts

89 months

[news] 
Monday 13th April 2009 quote quote all
nlldavies said:
I've just emailed my dad to get a couple of pictures emailed to me.

Thanks
Also find out what kind of detergent he's using to wash the car

PJ S

9,888 posts

110 months

[news] 
Tuesday 14th April 2009 quote quote all
Vauxhall red paint is notorious for fading, but can be accelerated with the constant use of harsh cleaners like the caustic TFR's used by a fair proportion of the valeting sector.
Best to get it machine polished to remove the dead oxide layer, then a good long lasting sealant to keep the UV at bay, and it re-oxidising.
Bilt Hamber Auto-balm would be the product of choice for me, with reapplication every 2-3 months, if not longer.
May as well get their Auto-wash too, which is powerful but gentle.
5mls - a 10L bucket should be all that's needed, so 60 washes from the one bottle.
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kds keltec

1,352 posts

73 months

[news] 
Tuesday 14th April 2009 quote quote all
Have a look at some of these faded cars , you should be able to turn the car back into a shiny thing with a little time and effort !

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?h=0...


Fat Albert

1,135 posts

64 months

[news] 
Tuesday 14th April 2009 quote quote all
With Halfords 3 for 2 deal on cleaning products at the moment I got the Liquid Claybar, some polish and a roll of rag for less than £24, it was then just down to 5-6 hours of effort to revive the colour on the Porker.

A tip; just pick one panel at a time and get it right before you go near the polish! I did mine over 3 evenings.

nlldavies

Original Poster:

258 posts

114 months

[news] 
Tuesday 14th April 2009 quote quote all
Some good tips there.

Still waiting for my dad to send me pictures.

The paintwork does look like its oxidising on the surface but I fear after doing a quick test area with Mer that the whiteness may be deeper in the paint ... that or I didn't get enough pressure on the job.

I'll try and get the pictures from him this evening.

nlldavies

Original Poster:

258 posts

114 months

[news] 
Tuesday 14th April 2009 quote quote all
Just got a picture. Not sure if you'll see what you want in it though, but you can see the white if you look carefully as well as the small area that is a bit more polished still showing white.

Sorry if it is too big as I have no idea how to resize in MSPAINT, checked the rules on image size and couldn't find any.

Anyway here it is, obvously started raining when he took it.




As for questions on detergent, I'm afarid the answer to that is what ever they use in the local car wash mostly with the odd wash at home with "any brand" of car detergent.

N

Edited by nlldavies on Tuesday 14th April 18:04

Iain328

6,811 posts

89 months

[news] 
Wednesday 15th April 2009 quote quote all
nlldavies said:
Just got a picture. Not sure if you'll see what you want in it though, but you can see the white if you look carefully as well as the small area that is a bit more polished still showing white.

Sorry if it is too big as I have no idea how to resize in MSPAINT, checked the rules on image size and couldn't find any.

Anyway here it is, obvously started raining when he took it.




As for questions on detergent, I'm afarid the answer to that is what ever they use in the local car wash mostly with the odd wash at home with "any brand" of car detergent.

N
The car wash would be a candidate to be using something nasty.

Since its a fairly modern car it ought to have a clearcoat on it - which meeans its that's gone dull, not the red underneath.

The best stuff I've ever seen for bring back lifeless paintwork is probably Zymol HD cleanse - available on line from any number of places. If you use it you need to wax the paint properly afterwards though because the HD will clean everything off the paint.
Having said that its also not caustic or abrasive so it doesn't take any paint away, just whatever is on it, leaving clean paintwork that then needs to be protected with something. I think there are some oils in it that "feed" the paintwork as well which is what brings it back to life.

kds keltec

1,352 posts

73 months

[news] 
Wednesday 15th April 2009 quote quote all
Iain328 said:
nlldavies said:
Just got a picture. Not sure if you'll see what you want in it though, but you can see the white if you look carefully as well as the small area that is a bit more polished still showing white.

Sorry if it is too big as I have no idea how to resize in MSPAINT, checked the rules on image size and couldn't find any.

Anyway here it is, obvously started raining when he took it.




As for questions on detergent, I'm afarid the answer to that is what ever they use in the local car wash mostly with the odd wash at home with "any brand" of car detergent.

N
The car wash would be a candidate to be using something nasty.

Since its a fairly modern car it ought to have a clearcoat on it - which meeans its that's gone dull, not the red underneath.

The best stuff I've ever seen for bring back lifeless paintwork is probably Zymol HD cleanse - available on line from any number of places. If you use it you need to wax the paint properly afterwards though because the HD will clean everything off the paint.
Having said that its also not caustic or abrasive so it doesn't take any paint away, just whatever is on it, leaving clean paintwork that then needs to be protected with something. I think there are some oils in it that "feed" the paintwork as well which is what brings it back to life.
I would very surprised to find that the car in question has been clear coated , Vauxhalls were very late on clear coating reds, (Had a EVO 8 in red for detail that still colour only no top coat which is much newer then the car in the picture).

From the picture i would say that PJS is right , it needs cutting back to remove the oxidised layer of dead paint , then seal the paint to slow down the problem returning by using a product like Auto Balm wax/sealent .

There are all types of products with light cut , fillers , oils , etc that will make a slight improvement by hand , but this really needs cutting bck using the machine method for it to look its best ! wink

PJ S

9,888 posts

110 months

[news] 
Thursday 16th April 2009 quote quote all
Iain328 said:
The car wash would be a candidate to be using something nasty.

Since its a fairly modern car it ought to have a clearcoat on it - which meeans its that's gone dull, not the red underneath.

The best stuff I've ever seen for bring back lifeless paintwork is probably Zymol HD cleanse - available on line from any number of places. If you use it you need to wax the paint properly afterwards though because the HD will clean everything off the paint.
Having said that its also not caustic or abrasive so it doesn't take any paint away, just whatever is on it, leaving clean paintwork that then needs to be protected with something. I think there are some oils in it that "feed" the paintwork as well which is what brings it back to life.
Alas Iain, paint doesn't get fed anything, only the punter buying an overly BS'ing marketed product that claims to do so.
Paint, unlike our skin, even though it has pores, can't be nourished - it can only ever be protected with a sacrificial "shield" to thwart the environmental attacks.

nlldavies

Original Poster:

258 posts

114 months

[news] 
Thursday 16th April 2009 quote quote all
kds keltec said:
Iain328 said:
nlldavies said:
Just got a picture. Not sure if you'll see what you want in it though, but you can see the white if you look carefully as well as the small area that is a bit more polished still showing white.

Sorry if it is too big as I have no idea how to resize in MSPAINT, checked the rules on image size and couldn't find any.

Anyway here it is, obvously started raining when he took it.




As for questions on detergent, I'm afarid the answer to that is what ever they use in the local car wash mostly with the odd wash at home with "any brand" of car detergent.

N
The car wash would be a candidate to be using something nasty.

Since its a fairly modern car it ought to have a clearcoat on it - which meeans its that's gone dull, not the red underneath.

The best stuff I've ever seen for bring back lifeless paintwork is probably Zymol HD cleanse - available on line from any number of places. If you use it you need to wax the paint properly afterwards though because the HD will clean everything off the paint.
Having said that its also not caustic or abrasive so it doesn't take any paint away, just whatever is on it, leaving clean paintwork that then needs to be protected with something. I think there are some oils in it that "feed" the paintwork as well which is what brings it back to life.
I would very surprised to find that the car in question has been clear coated , Vauxhalls were very late on clear coating reds, (Had a EVO 8 in red for detail that still colour only no top coat which is much newer then the car in the picture).

From the picture i would say that PJS is right , it needs cutting back to remove the oxidised layer of dead paint , then seal the paint to slow down the problem returning by using a product like Auto Balm wax/sealent .

There are all types of products with light cut , fillers , oils , etc that will make a slight improvement by hand , but this really needs cutting bck using the machine method for it to look its best ! wink
By clear coat I assume this is laquere you are talking about? If it is I think I'm quite sure after looking at it that it hasn't got clear coat.

I'm sure that I have taken the top coat of oxidised paint off it on the test patch and the whiteness appears to be deeper in the paint. Maybe I didn't give it enough attention or Mer is not quite up to the job. I'll try on eof the products listd here and see how I get on.

Thanks to everyone for the advice so far.

N

halo34

1,243 posts

82 months

[news] 
Thursday 16th April 2009 quote quote all
You will have a hard time removing that by hand without it coming back quite quickly.

I used a polishing machine on a friends Volvo in exactly same state a few months ago.

I used Menzerna intensive polish followed by a final finish polish, then a sealant to prevent the problem coming back.

Get yourself over to Detailing World as few red cars in same state have been brought round, might give you some product ideas.

Ultimately its going to be very hard work by hand though.

PJ S

9,888 posts

110 months

[news] 
Friday 17th April 2009 quote quote all
nlldavies said:
By clear coat I assume this is laquere you are talking about? If it is I think I'm quite sure after looking at it that it hasn't got clear coat.

I'm sure that I have taken the top coat of oxidised paint off it on the test patch and the whiteness appears to be deeper in the paint. Maybe I didn't give it enough attention or Mer is not quite up to the job. I'll try on eof the products listd here and see how I get on.
Not all paints are clearcoated - some are just paint, commonly referred to as singlestage.
Mer is very mediocre, and you might not have removed enough of the dead paint - and if you did remove it all, then without a decent sealant or wax, the lack of UV protection has resulted in the return of the old tired look once again.

Get some Auto-balm at the VERY least - £15 for something that'll last a bloody eternity since you use so little each time, and each time is a good few months.
Plus you won't have to worry about getting it on black trim or chrome, as it works on those too, as well as wheels.

liner33

4,064 posts

85 months

[news] 
Monday 20th April 2009 quote quote all
I had an Escort that used to go like that , gave it a few coats of Mer and it came up really nice , lasted ages as well as said its not going to be easy by hand but its do-able

Nowadays i've moved on to more modern methods of course




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