Should Stamp Duty Be Abolished ?
Discussion
oyster said:
To all those posters talking about stamp duty restricting the movement of labour?
Really how many people have been hit by this? Most people who move for work do not consider buying property at each of the places they work, they usually rent.
I've worked in various parts of the UK as well as the US, Middle East and Asia and just rented my place out each time.
Not sure that it has stopped many from moving for work for the reasons you state.Really how many people have been hit by this? Most people who move for work do not consider buying property at each of the places they work, they usually rent.
I've worked in various parts of the UK as well as the US, Middle East and Asia and just rented my place out each time.
I know a lot who it has stopped moving though for the reasons highlighted by another just above with their £40k equity.
The economic argument of removing SDLT boosting the economy do not make sense at all.
If people are less likely to move then they will spend more on extensions and conversions. People will still replace carpets and furniture. Mortgage brokers and banks are still in demand for re-mortgages.
The only people really impacted by less transactions is estate agents.
If people are less likely to move then they will spend more on extensions and conversions. People will still replace carpets and furniture. Mortgage brokers and banks are still in demand for re-mortgages.
The only people really impacted by less transactions is estate agents.
)Ozzie Osmond said:
It's just a question of how you market the property. All you have to say is "we'll pay your stamp duty".
Examples:
Or the seller sells the house for 128,706 and the buyer pays 129,993 .... everyone's a winner.Examples:
- House sold for £125,000. Buyer pays £125k and seller receives £125k
- House sold for £130,000. Stamp Duty at 1% = £1,300. Buyer pays £130k with seller agreeing to "pay the stamp duty". Seller receives £128,700
oyster said:
Errr no. Stamp Duty existed in the summer of 2007 when house prices were rising by 5% a month in some areas.
Higher deposit requirements and is the main thing slowing property transactions. And rightly so too. The last thing we need is a property-led mini boom to boost the economy.
So what do we need ?Higher deposit requirements and is the main thing slowing property transactions. And rightly so too. The last thing we need is a property-led mini boom to boost the economy.
vodkalolly said:
Buying and selling houses is not the economy. Mining, refining and manufacturing are the economy, everything else is just parasitic. Getting rid of potholes, speed humps and parking charges, building new roads and railways would help kick start the economy. But f
king little halfwit estate agents called Gavin running round trying to sell houses for more than they are worth is what got us into this st in the first place and doing it again is not going to help.
The most valuable thing most people own is their home. If that starts increasing in value, they are more confident and start spending money. The key to a growing economy is velocity of money, not the government issuing debt or printing money to spend on infrastructure that no one can afford to use. And where do pot holes and parking charges come into this ?king little halfwit estate agents called Gavin running round trying to sell houses for more than they are worth is what got us into this st in the first place and doing it again is not going to help.oyster said:
The economic argument of removing SDLT boosting the economy do not make sense at all.
If people are less likely to move then they will spend more on extensions and conversions. People will still replace carpets and furniture. Mortgage brokers and banks are still in demand for re-mortgages.
The only people really impacted by less transactions is estate agents.
Rubbish. Extensions require planning permission, which can be an arduous process. An extension could also take your property into a higher tax bracket, capping its value at less than the value add from the improvements. And if moving into a new home, the vast majority will redecorate the whole house. If you don't move, the chances are your house is decorated to your taste.If people are less likely to move then they will spend more on extensions and conversions. People will still replace carpets and furniture. Mortgage brokers and banks are still in demand for re-mortgages.
The only people really impacted by less transactions is estate agents.
Jules360 said:
oyster said:
Errr no. Stamp Duty existed in the summer of 2007 when house prices were rising by 5% a month in some areas.
Higher deposit requirements and is the main thing slowing property transactions. And rightly so too. The last thing we need is a property-led mini boom to boost the economy.
So what do we need ?Higher deposit requirements and is the main thing slowing property transactions. And rightly so too. The last thing we need is a property-led mini boom to boost the economy.
Diderot said:
Jules360 said:
oyster said:
Errr no. Stamp Duty existed in the summer of 2007 when house prices were rising by 5% a month in some areas.
Higher deposit requirements and is the main thing slowing property transactions. And rightly so too. The last thing we need is a property-led mini boom to boost the economy.
So what do we need ?Higher deposit requirements and is the main thing slowing property transactions. And rightly so too. The last thing we need is a property-led mini boom to boost the economy.
Jules360 said:
oyster said:
Errr no. Stamp Duty existed in the summer of 2007 when house prices were rising by 5% a month in some areas.
Higher deposit requirements and is the main thing slowing property transactions. And rightly so too. The last thing we need is a property-led mini boom to boost the economy.
So what do we need ?Higher deposit requirements and is the main thing slowing property transactions. And rightly so too. The last thing we need is a property-led mini boom to boost the economy.
sugerbear said:
This is like saying "I can increase my income by buying and selling stuff to my wife". Your income hasn't increased, just the circulation of money has increased internally." Buying a new car is nice, but if the car company is owned by a foreign company then it is just increasing amount we need to import.
We need new business that exports, not to re-cycle the money we already have.
Businesses that export don't begin by exporting. They expand to meet the demands of the customer, locally, nationally then internationally!We need new business that exports, not to re-cycle the money we already have.
Movement of money is key to these new businesses success .
The housing market plays a massive part in our economy! The SDLT is pissing people off because of the scales it is currently set at! People moving house sideways( maybe to supply the expanding businesses with labour) are being penalised for no reason other than government greed!
Sort out the scales and it may become a little more paletable!
037 said:
Businesses that export don't begin by exporting. They expand to meet the demands of the customer, locally, nationally then internationally!
Movement of money is key to these new businesses success .
The housing market plays a massive part in our economy! The SDLT is pissing people off because of the scales it is currently set at! People moving house sideways( maybe to supply the expanding businesses with labour) are being penalised for no reason other than government greed!
Sort out the scales and it may become a little more paletable!
Precisely. Why should I have to pay a massive slug of tax (out of income on whcih I have already paid tax) to move to an equivalent house elsewhere?Movement of money is key to these new businesses success .
The housing market plays a massive part in our economy! The SDLT is pissing people off because of the scales it is currently set at! People moving house sideways( maybe to supply the expanding businesses with labour) are being penalised for no reason other than government greed!
Sort out the scales and it may become a little more paletable!
Why is it not like income tax?
Keep the tier levels, but when you go over the band the extra is charged at the new rate. That way they still get the tax, but it doesn't stifle the housing market. We are in the same position, not worth moving...going to cost £30k to move with stamp, legal, estate agency fees etc....so we are going to build an extension instead.
Keep the tier levels, but when you go over the band the extra is charged at the new rate. That way they still get the tax, but it doesn't stifle the housing market. We are in the same position, not worth moving...going to cost £30k to move with stamp, legal, estate agency fees etc....so we are going to build an extension instead.
Zod said:
037 said:
Businesses that export don't begin by exporting. They expand to meet the demands of the customer, locally, nationally then internationally!
Movement of money is key to these new businesses success .
The housing market plays a massive part in our economy! The SDLT is pissing people off because of the scales it is currently set at! People moving house sideways( maybe to supply the expanding businesses with labour) are being penalised for no reason other than government greed!
Sort out the scales and it may become a little more paletable!
Precisely. Why should I have to pay a massive slug of tax (out of income on whcih I have already paid tax) to move to an equivalent house elsewhere?Movement of money is key to these new businesses success .
The housing market plays a massive part in our economy! The SDLT is pissing people off because of the scales it is currently set at! People moving house sideways( maybe to supply the expanding businesses with labour) are being penalised for no reason other than government greed!
Sort out the scales and it may become a little more paletable!
037 said:
sugerbear said:
This is like saying "I can increase my income by buying and selling stuff to my wife". Your income hasn't increased, just the circulation of money has increased internally." Buying a new car is nice, but if the car company is owned by a foreign company then it is just increasing amount we need to import.
We need new business that exports, not to re-cycle the money we already have.
Businesses that export don't begin by exporting. They expand to meet the demands of the customer, locally, nationally then internationally!We need new business that exports, not to re-cycle the money we already have.
Movement of money is key to these new businesses success .
The housing market plays a massive part in our economy! The SDLT is pissing people off because of the scales it is currently set at! People moving house sideways( maybe to supply the expanding businesses with labour) are being penalised for no reason other than government greed!
Sort out the scales and it may become a little more paletable!
But in terms of moving house, very little. In terms of building new and enchancing the existing a lot more.
All a SDLT tax cut would do is help the former which will do very little for the economy. Better to reduce the burden on new builds (below £150k where there appears to be a massive shortage of houses), open up lots of green fields sites to build on and cut tax on home improvements.
And while we are at it raise interest rates to 5% and stop any more QE. House prices need to come down, then the market will pick up again.
Stamp duty's just odd.
We put an offer in on a house about 2 months ago at one of the stamp duty thresholds. Someone put an offer £20k over and so would have had to pay an extra £5k in SDLT for the privilege (no prizes for the doing the maths on which threshold).
Early this week the property was back on the market, buyer pulled out the day before exchanging. So we put our offer in again at the threshold. An offer was made at £10k above the threshold - costing them £5k.
I can't make my mind up if people are insane or whether bunging £5k to the government for the privilege of a slightly higher offer is a useful, if somewhat banana republic, tool to get a house you really want. I'm dubious, but await the chance to put in the same offer a third time.
We put an offer in on a house about 2 months ago at one of the stamp duty thresholds. Someone put an offer £20k over and so would have had to pay an extra £5k in SDLT for the privilege (no prizes for the doing the maths on which threshold).
Early this week the property was back on the market, buyer pulled out the day before exchanging. So we put our offer in again at the threshold. An offer was made at £10k above the threshold - costing them £5k.
I can't make my mind up if people are insane or whether bunging £5k to the government for the privilege of a slightly higher offer is a useful, if somewhat banana republic, tool to get a house you really want. I'm dubious, but await the chance to put in the same offer a third time.
sugerbear said:
"he housing market plays a massive part in our economy"
But in terms of moving house, very little. In terms of building new and enchancing the existing a lot more.
All a SDLT tax cut would do is help the former which will do very little for the economy. Better to reduce the burden on new builds (below £150k where there appears to be a massive shortage of houses), open up lots of green fields sites to build on and cut tax on home improvements.
And while we are at it raise interest rates to 5% and stop any more QE. House prices need to come down, then the market will pick up again.
This is a lot of nonsense. If interest rates were raised to 5%, there would be mass bankruptcies and repossessions. The housing market would collapse.But in terms of moving house, very little. In terms of building new and enchancing the existing a lot more.
All a SDLT tax cut would do is help the former which will do very little for the economy. Better to reduce the burden on new builds (below £150k where there appears to be a massive shortage of houses), open up lots of green fields sites to build on and cut tax on home improvements.
And while we are at it raise interest rates to 5% and stop any more QE. House prices need to come down, then the market will pick up again.
Cutting SDLT significantly would increase the numbers moving house. People moving house spend a lot of money on furniture, decoration, fittings and services. The boost to the economy would be huge.
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