crankshaft pulley wobble
Discussion
Rubbish picture (was very early and dark in the garage):
I've seen some with the serp belt piece between the 2 v belt pulley section, similar to teh one below. They all look about the same legth so maybe I'll be OK getting one similar as a back up if I need one.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Range-Rover-V8-Discovery...
Mine doesnt have the big lump at the back end with the groove in it or the smaller doughnut pice nearest the engine.
This was the one I was looking to buy as the spare:
FFG
I've seen some with the serp belt piece between the 2 v belt pulley section, similar to teh one below. They all look about the same legth so maybe I'll be OK getting one similar as a back up if I need one.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Range-Rover-V8-Discovery...
Mine doesnt have the big lump at the back end with the groove in it or the smaller doughnut pice nearest the engine.
This was the one I was looking to buy as the spare:
FFG
Edited by FlipFlopGriff on Tuesday 15th April 10:03
Edited by FlipFlopGriff on Tuesday 15th April 10:04
Have you got the damper and pulley off yet ?
I wouldnt go buying anything until you have them off and you have inspected them to see exactly what the problem is.
Chances are it will be the rubber in the damper that has failed. Buying second hand you may well buy something as bad as what you already have.
You are right, the pulley nearest the engine is not used on our cars so as long as there are no external balancing weights welded into it as on the 500`s it isnt really needed. Mine didnt have anything welded to it and i no longer have it fitted.
I`m pretty sure the 430 crank is a Rover item and not TVR specific.
I wouldnt go buying anything until you have them off and you have inspected them to see exactly what the problem is.
Chances are it will be the rubber in the damper that has failed. Buying second hand you may well buy something as bad as what you already have.
You are right, the pulley nearest the engine is not used on our cars so as long as there are no external balancing weights welded into it as on the 500`s it isnt really needed. Mine didnt have anything welded to it and i no longer have it fitted.
I`m pretty sure the 430 crank is a Rover item and not TVR specific.
carsy said:
Have you got the damper and pulley off yet ?
I wouldnt go buying anything until you have them off and you have inspected them to see exactly what the problem is.
Chances are it will be the rubber in the damper that has failed. Buying second hand you may well buy something as bad as what you already have.
You are right, the pulley nearest the engine is not used on our cars so as long as there are no external balancing weights welded into it as on the 500`s it isnt really needed. Mine didnt have anything welded to it and i no longer have it fitted.
I`m pretty sure the 430 crank is a Rover item and not TVR specific.
Thanks. Car still in my garage but booked to go into David Gerald next Thursday - it Easter this weekend so they are busy and closed for a few days. My pulley doesnt look great and the suggested one looks brand new in comparision - only £20 delivered. I wouldnt go buying anything until you have them off and you have inspected them to see exactly what the problem is.
Chances are it will be the rubber in the damper that has failed. Buying second hand you may well buy something as bad as what you already have.
You are right, the pulley nearest the engine is not used on our cars so as long as there are no external balancing weights welded into it as on the 500`s it isnt really needed. Mine didnt have anything welded to it and i no longer have it fitted.
I`m pretty sure the 430 crank is a Rover item and not TVR specific.
I felt the bolt this morning but cant really tell if it isnt 100% tight so will get a socket on it tonight to see. Hopefully it'll be simple and cheap.
FFG
From what I've seen the 430 balancing had quite a bit more detailed work done than others...
Drillings for balancing on the damper itself, which are not evident on the 3.9's. Interestingly instead of the standard bit of threaded bar (bolt) tack welded to the splash guard it has a proper piece of flat metal weight tacked on....
The base should be the same as 90-94 3.9/4.2 LR engines but you would need to get the balancing transferred across. Don't worry about the pulley assemblies they all just bolt on in a sandwich. As long as the 'hub' with the damper is the same you'll be ok, as long as you get the balance replicated from your original, and that hub is the same from any of the 3.9's & 4.2's AFIK.
ETA: Oops forgot to answer the initial question
The pulleys dont bolt to the part that would be affected if the rubber band damper fails, so its more likely just the bolts that sandwich the pulleys to the damper hub have come loose. They are all 5/16"UNF & the arrangement is 3 tapped holes & 3 bored holes (6 in total) You can just run bolts into the tapped holes to fix stuff on the front but typically I dont think they were used on the 430. Generally there will be 3 UNF blots going straight through to the splash guard at the rear where there a 3 nuts tacked on (sometimes they were just loose so you have to wedge a spanner in ~ & you also need a very thin wall socket to get a the bolts on the front ~ I only have a 1/4" drive socket that fits them IIRC.
I'd just nip them up from underneath & see if that fixes your problem. half hour job?
Drillings for balancing on the damper itself, which are not evident on the 3.9's. Interestingly instead of the standard bit of threaded bar (bolt) tack welded to the splash guard it has a proper piece of flat metal weight tacked on....
The base should be the same as 90-94 3.9/4.2 LR engines but you would need to get the balancing transferred across. Don't worry about the pulley assemblies they all just bolt on in a sandwich. As long as the 'hub' with the damper is the same you'll be ok, as long as you get the balance replicated from your original, and that hub is the same from any of the 3.9's & 4.2's AFIK.
ETA: Oops forgot to answer the initial question
The pulleys dont bolt to the part that would be affected if the rubber band damper fails, so its more likely just the bolts that sandwich the pulleys to the damper hub have come loose. They are all 5/16"UNF & the arrangement is 3 tapped holes & 3 bored holes (6 in total) You can just run bolts into the tapped holes to fix stuff on the front but typically I dont think they were used on the 430. Generally there will be 3 UNF blots going straight through to the splash guard at the rear where there a 3 nuts tacked on (sometimes they were just loose so you have to wedge a spanner in ~ & you also need a very thin wall socket to get a the bolts on the front ~ I only have a 1/4" drive socket that fits them IIRC.
I'd just nip them up from underneath & see if that fixes your problem. half hour job?
Edited by spend on Tuesday 15th April 11:33
FlipFlopGriff said:
Tried a couple of differnet belts and all the same, so there must be sufficient movement to chuck the belt off in certain circumstances.
FFG
obvious question and you have probably checked but, do all the pulleys line up? when my alternator was rebuilt on my old preserp the pulley position was slightly forward when refitted and it would kick the belt off when the throttle snapped shut. FFG
Bluebottle said:
obvious question and you have probably checked but, do all the pulleys line up? when my alternator was rebuilt on my old preserp the pulley position was slightly forward when refitted and it would kick the belt off when the throttle snapped shut.
Same on my TR7 V8. I put some shims and washers to line them up. From memory, it worked.Word of warning here!!!
On my Griff the crankshaft pulley was 'rocking' from new and wore the nose of the crankshaft down. Fortunately 'uncle' Colin at TVRSSW carried out the full rebuild but found that the woodruff key slot in the pulley was actually bigger than that in the crankshaft so he had some stepped keys made to solve this problem.
So - before you fit a new pulley make sure that the key slots are exactly the same size in the pulley and the crankshaft!!! Saves an awful lot of ££££
Chris
On my Griff the crankshaft pulley was 'rocking' from new and wore the nose of the crankshaft down. Fortunately 'uncle' Colin at TVRSSW carried out the full rebuild but found that the woodruff key slot in the pulley was actually bigger than that in the crankshaft so he had some stepped keys made to solve this problem.
So - before you fit a new pulley make sure that the key slots are exactly the same size in the pulley and the crankshaft!!! Saves an awful lot of ££££
Chris
Chuffmeister said:
The 500 is externally balanced. I'd be vary careful about removing and adding pulleys. I want to use an after market ECU and the advice about adding a trigger wheel to the pulley was get the whole thing dynamically balanced first, otherwise you can risk a snapped crank.
Its the 430BV not the 500.FFG
Just a question about the removal of the pulley with the engine in the car.
I want to renew the back plate of the oilpump of a 500 serpentine engine. After a full rebuild with new pump etc... I have low oil pressure when the engine is running longer then 30 minutes. I want to do the full monty, change pack plate, messure the oil pump, renew the pressure valve and install a 16 row cooler.
Question, can I remove the pulley with the engine in the car, is there enough space between pulley and the chassis?
I want to renew the back plate of the oilpump of a 500 serpentine engine. After a full rebuild with new pump etc... I have low oil pressure when the engine is running longer then 30 minutes. I want to do the full monty, change pack plate, messure the oil pump, renew the pressure valve and install a 16 row cooler.
Question, can I remove the pulley with the engine in the car, is there enough space between pulley and the chassis?
I found the problem. I have a enormous play between the pulley and the crankshaft (couple of mm and at least 10 degrees when rotating) so much that the oil leaks between the key and pulley. I think the crank and pulley are scrap. For now a take a bottle of Johnny Walker and after that I go to talk with the bank manager that I need money for a new bottom end.
griffer500 said:
I found the problem. I have a enormous play between the pulley and the crankshaft (couple of mm and at least 10 degrees when rotating) so much that the oil leaks between the key and pulley. I think the crank and pulley are scrap. For now a take a bottle of Johnny Walker and after that I go to talk with the bank manager that I need money for a new bottom end.
Oil shouldn't reach the woodruff key - the front oil seal needs replacing.There is no way that you can tell if the fault/wear/slack on the pulley is caused by the keyway in damper or crank or even just the key itself, without removing the damper + pulley to inspect. You need to remove these to get the timing cover off so that you can renew the oil seal anyway.
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