Tyres: Bridgestone S02 or S03?
Discussion
Well Apache 17 inch wheels on a Griff... You didn't say that when this started!
This could explain an awful lot as this will upset the car's handling. Doesn't explain the total problems you saw but could have been a factor and anyway it is irrelevant as it the Toyos have solved the problem.
Fitting bigger wheels and lower profile tyres is not simply a question of ensuring the same rolling circumference as the lower profile tyres will have a stiffer sidewall and this will remove a lot of suspension complience. This means the ride is harsher and more suspect to bouncing around and tramlining. Instead of the tyres acting like a spring, it forces more pressure onto the rest of the suspension components. It is like running the tyres widly over inflated. It may also affect the suspension geometry as well. The end result is that the suspension characteristics change and in some cases not for the better. The 520 runs ex Tuscan 9J wide wheels on which the tyre is blown to get the sidewalls pointing inwards and thus stiffen even more that the lower profile tyre would normally. End result is virtually zero tyre complience which means that the suspension was adjusted to compensate. I also break top and bottom ball joints but they are consumables now along with most other things.
What I suspect is happening is that the S03 has a stiffer construction which the 17 inch wheels really highlighted. The Toyo is relatively soft judging from what I have seen a Lotus Exige do to them and that is restoring normality. This could be why other users who have standard sizes have not experienced any problem.
Anyway glad it is sorted. Also glad that the S02 may be making a comeback. Tracked some more down yesterday so a few months wait should be fine.
Steve
www.tvrbooks.co.uk
This could explain an awful lot as this will upset the car's handling. Doesn't explain the total problems you saw but could have been a factor and anyway it is irrelevant as it the Toyos have solved the problem.
Fitting bigger wheels and lower profile tyres is not simply a question of ensuring the same rolling circumference as the lower profile tyres will have a stiffer sidewall and this will remove a lot of suspension complience. This means the ride is harsher and more suspect to bouncing around and tramlining. Instead of the tyres acting like a spring, it forces more pressure onto the rest of the suspension components. It is like running the tyres widly over inflated. It may also affect the suspension geometry as well. The end result is that the suspension characteristics change and in some cases not for the better. The 520 runs ex Tuscan 9J wide wheels on which the tyre is blown to get the sidewalls pointing inwards and thus stiffen even more that the lower profile tyre would normally. End result is virtually zero tyre complience which means that the suspension was adjusted to compensate. I also break top and bottom ball joints but they are consumables now along with most other things.
What I suspect is happening is that the S03 has a stiffer construction which the 17 inch wheels really highlighted. The Toyo is relatively soft judging from what I have seen a Lotus Exige do to them and that is restoring normality. This could be why other users who have standard sizes have not experienced any problem.
Anyway glad it is sorted. Also glad that the S02 may be making a comeback. Tracked some more down yesterday so a few months wait should be fine.
Steve
www.tvrbooks.co.uk
Whats the latest on the SO3 issue!
I'm just about to replace tyres on a griff 500 prior to nurberg!
I'm not sure whether to use SO3's cured in as suggested by steve (most likely as he obviosly knows his stuff!) OR toyo proxes ( fronts are only rated to 150mph - I cant see me exceeding that!!!
The factory suggested putting 16 inch rims on the front with proxex all round 225/45/16 f 245/45/16 r.
this was their sollution for the last run of griffs.
Anyone who can up date me please do so ASAP as I have to order soon
TA
I'm just about to replace tyres on a griff 500 prior to nurberg!
I'm not sure whether to use SO3's cured in as suggested by steve (most likely as he obviosly knows his stuff!) OR toyo proxes ( fronts are only rated to 150mph - I cant see me exceeding that!!!
The factory suggested putting 16 inch rims on the front with proxex all round 225/45/16 f 245/45/16 r.
this was their sollution for the last run of griffs.
Anyone who can up date me please do so ASAP as I have to order soon
TA
Fitting VR rated tyres to a car that uses ZR is a no-no. Potentially invalidates insurance as the replacement tyres are not to the same spec. The speed rating is also applicable to acceleration as well so the argument that I won't be doing that speed is also invalid.
Can't fit 15 inch ZR Toyos so it limits the choice doesn't it!
Steve
Can't fit 15 inch ZR Toyos so it limits the choice doesn't it!
Steve
Steve
Yeah, hadn't thought of insurance issues
looks like it's SO3's then.
I'll cure them in as suggested, I'll report back in may how they faired!
Nurberg for a day then onto Imola for a day!!!!
That should end any arguments!
Didn't really want to be the guinea pig though.
16 inch rims are £178 + vat + £17 shipping !!!
>> Edited by Guillotine on Monday 29th April 15:57
Yeah, hadn't thought of insurance issues
looks like it's SO3's then.
I'll cure them in as suggested, I'll report back in may how they faired!
Nurberg for a day then onto Imola for a day!!!!
That should end any arguments!
Didn't really want to be the guinea pig though.
16 inch rims are £178 + vat + £17 shipping !!!
>> Edited by Guillotine on Monday 29th April 15:57
Theres been a lot of talk about letting tyres 'Warm' up and then cool down, without sounding too stupid - just how long does it take to 'Warm up' your tyres?, are we talking about a quick 5 minute run round the block - or something a little more extensive?
I've only recently acquired my Griff - and all the advice I've had so far is to get the car warm before driving too hard - just when is warm - warm?
I've only recently acquired my Griff - and all the advice I've had so far is to get the car warm before driving too hard - just when is warm - warm?
quote:
Theres been a lot of talk about letting tyres 'Warm' up and then cool down, without sounding too stupid - just how long does it take to 'Warm up' your tyres?, are we talking about a quick 5 minute run round the block - or something a little more extensive?
I've only recently acquired my Griff - and all the advice I've had so far is to get the car warm before driving too hard - just when is warm - warm?
Would you believe, "it depends"?
If you're talking about curing the tyres, you need to get them very hot and you will struggle to find somewhere safe enough to do that on the public roads. They will be distinctly hot to the touch, not enough to burn but definitely nice and cosy, and you'll feel the tyre stick to the palm of your hand. On a race track the tyres will come up to temperature within half a dozen laps on a hot day (quicker if they started warm from a previous session). But on cold days where there's less grip and less heat into the tyres and more cooling, they will take far longer to warm up and may never come right up to temperature.
Hope this helps,
Peter Humphries (and a green V8S)
Back from Nurberg / Imola now 
Tyres were exellent the whole time.
3 general WARM up / cool down cycles then on the track.
NO savage break away, NO excesssive tramlining. normal grip and good wear. NO probs. recommend them for road or track.
standard griff 500 on standard rims.
225x50x15 and 245x45x16
Now we Know
Tyres were exellent the whole time.
3 general WARM up / cool down cycles then on the track.
NO savage break away, NO excesssive tramlining. normal grip and good wear. NO probs. recommend them for road or track.
standard griff 500 on standard rims.
225x50x15 and 245x45x16
Now we Know
Guillotine, this is not about TVR's!! Presumably you were with a load of other people. Did you see my friend Stuart with his 911 993 Turbo there? He should be back soon. Apparently he managed to use a set of brake pads in the first week (Ring and Imola). Was he quick? I need independent verification before I believe him. I was supposed to be going with him in the Griff but pressure of work put paid to that.
quote:
Any one know where I can get 2x 245 45 16 S02s
Help!!!
you will strugle to find a place with ex-stock of s02's
I have just bought 2 x new rears 245 45 ZR 16's, I had a look about on the web at different manufactures,tyre construction, rubber composite, tread pattern etc and came accross Kumho supra 702 which I bought. I have not had chance to scrub the outer mould layer yet to see how they perform but I will keep u posted.
I paid £150.22 inc vat fitting etc for 2.
If they turn out to be crap at least I wont be out of pocket
here is a pic of the tyre
and their webby if your interested www.kumho-euro.com/products/results.asp
>> Edited by cleg on Thursday 23 May 15:44
I got this email a couple of days ago. Don't know what they are like:-
Hi my name is Aryan from Black Circles, we have a full range of SO2s and Toyos,
and are undoubtedly the cheapest in Britain! we could have done 225/50/16zrs for
£100 per tyre, phone us or even mail me with your tyre requirements and best
quote today and we will beat it!
Aryan Mokarram
Sales Manager
Black Circles Ltd
0845 200 0022
aryan.mokarram@blackcircles.com
Hi my name is Aryan from Black Circles, we have a full range of SO2s and Toyos,
and are undoubtedly the cheapest in Britain! we could have done 225/50/16zrs for
£100 per tyre, phone us or even mail me with your tyre requirements and best
quote today and we will beat it!
Aryan Mokarram
Sales Manager
Black Circles Ltd
0845 200 0022
aryan.mokarram@blackcircles.com
have now done the Imola trip, found so3's were fine. It was very hot and tyres held up very well to hot laps and fun laps (drifting at lower speeds 70 - 80mph) so unless you are a very skilled speed merchant so3's are as good as so2's. slightly stiffer so can understeer, but nothing surprising.
my opinion only ofcourse!!
my opinion only ofcourse!!
just got my new wheels (17/16") and Toyo T1-S's.
I must say I wasn't entirely sure when I ordered them but now after the first drive: very, very good!
The car feels more relaxed, is less bumpy (although pressure is higher in the Toyo's) and the steering is superb. It takes the handling of the car into the next league. Probably also the new wheels help, but the Toyo's are excellent. If given a choice, I wouldn't go back to SO'2 (although I haven't tested them on a track yet; next week on Zolder)
I must say I wasn't entirely sure when I ordered them but now after the first drive: very, very good!
The car feels more relaxed, is less bumpy (although pressure is higher in the Toyo's) and the steering is superb. It takes the handling of the car into the next league. Probably also the new wheels help, but the Toyo's are excellent. If given a choice, I wouldn't go back to SO'2 (although I haven't tested them on a track yet; next week on Zolder)
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