The decline of manual values
Discussion
TwigtheWonderkid said:
There a hundreds of thousands of Americans driving manual cars having passed their test in an auto. Carnage hasn't ensued.
After posting that maybe you shouldn't be criticising other peoples' grammar! And do you have any statistics to back up those claims?
Back on topic I'm sure all types of gearbox have their place depending on the car, how they will be used, owners circumstances and preferences, etc.
The exceptions may be CVT and automated manuals though!
Back on topic.
Wife decided to buy a low mileage Mazda2 auto.
69 reg with 11k on the clock 1 owner £12k 1.5 6 speed auto (has flappy paddles but don't imagine we'd use them apart from for a hill decent)
That was pretty much the cheapest unless she dealt with a Facebook "privateer" and bought something which was a Cat S. In which case you would pay £8k
Prices of similar vehicles ranged from £13k to 17k, of which there were vwry few for sale. (Maybe 25 on Autotrader Nationally. Only 2 less than 2 hours away) mostly one owner cars with less than 20k typically 3 to 5k of use per year.
We had a look at the equivalent manual £5k to £8k just out of interest.
Lots for sale, (probably 15 within 1 hour of us)
Many with more than one owner and a mileage more like 10k a year.
So after 18 pages I'd conclude based on a small sample, you pay a premium on a small car, where most of the new sales were manual.
I imagine that on a larger car where most of the sales were automatics, then you'd pay a premium for manual.
Wife decided to buy a low mileage Mazda2 auto.
69 reg with 11k on the clock 1 owner £12k 1.5 6 speed auto (has flappy paddles but don't imagine we'd use them apart from for a hill decent)
That was pretty much the cheapest unless she dealt with a Facebook "privateer" and bought something which was a Cat S. In which case you would pay £8k
Prices of similar vehicles ranged from £13k to 17k, of which there were vwry few for sale. (Maybe 25 on Autotrader Nationally. Only 2 less than 2 hours away) mostly one owner cars with less than 20k typically 3 to 5k of use per year.
We had a look at the equivalent manual £5k to £8k just out of interest.
Lots for sale, (probably 15 within 1 hour of us)
Many with more than one owner and a mileage more like 10k a year.
So after 18 pages I'd conclude based on a small sample, you pay a premium on a small car, where most of the new sales were manual.
I imagine that on a larger car where most of the sales were automatics, then you'd pay a premium for manual.
NDNDNDND said:
Gary C said:
Nomme de Plum said:
I can see no logical reason to drive anything other than an automatic for day to day motoring on public roads.
Really ?No reason at all ?
Or would it be sooo small you couldnt see it even with a microscope?
I have a dog-leg gearbox amongst my collection, a robotised manual gearbox, a DCT, full on slush automatic and they’re all equally enjoyable to drive in their own way…
life isnt about deciding what’s best but appreciating each for what they give, if you apply this to the masses of choices out there on a wide variety of things then you’ll always be enjoying those things rather than bickering about who is wrong or right, there is no such thing as wrong or right, just an appreciation of what’s sat in front of you right now, that moment in time will never happen again, so appreciate it
Squabbling like children or being ‘right’ is such a waste of the very precious thing youve been gifted, time, spend it wisely…
NDNDNDND said:
Gary C said:
Nomme de Plum said:
I can see no logical reason to drive anything other than an automatic for day to day motoring on public roads.
Really ?No reason at all ?
The significantly larger that average post count is usually the best indicator.
Kerniki said:
Would an equally sized ‘inferiority’ complex be seen from space to?
Or would it be sooo small you couldnt see it even with a microscope?
I have a dog-leg gearbox amongst my collection, a robotised manual gearbox, a DCT, full on slush automatic and they’re all equally enjoyable to drive in their own way…
life isnt about deciding what’s best but appreciating each for what they give, if you apply this to the masses of choices out there on a wide variety of things then you’ll always be enjoying those things rather than bickering about who is wrong or right, there is no such thing as wrong or right, just an appreciation of what’s sat in front of you right now, that moment in time will never happen again, so appreciate it
Squabbling like children or being ‘right’ is such a waste of the very precious thing youve been gifted, time, spend it wisely…
All I said was can he see no reason at all for a manual for day to day driving ?Or would it be sooo small you couldnt see it even with a microscope?
I have a dog-leg gearbox amongst my collection, a robotised manual gearbox, a DCT, full on slush automatic and they’re all equally enjoyable to drive in their own way…
life isnt about deciding what’s best but appreciating each for what they give, if you apply this to the masses of choices out there on a wide variety of things then you’ll always be enjoying those things rather than bickering about who is wrong or right, there is no such thing as wrong or right, just an appreciation of what’s sat in front of you right now, that moment in time will never happen again, so appreciate it
Squabbling like children or being ‘right’ is such a waste of the very precious thing youve been gifted, time, spend it wisely…
Ok, a nice S class with an auto would make the drive down to Italy a breeze, then pickup the Alpine with DCT for the mountains and maybe a classic 911 with a G50 for a blast around lake Como
But many people only have one car that has to fill all roles.
I definitely used to be a manual man or nothing. However as I've got older...I do now appreciate autos and DCTs though. Plus I wouldn't want an auto in the Caterham, in the same way that I wouldn't want a manual in the GLE400d for example. Certain gearboxes suit certain cars I reckon.
I personally think the DCT is a lovely match to the S55 engine in the M4 as well. However I did spend years slagging the DCT off though...before I actually owned one for myself!
I personally think the DCT is a lovely match to the S55 engine in the M4 as well. However I did spend years slagging the DCT off though...before I actually owned one for myself!
Drove manuals forever but now only have one left , a 997.1RS. Everything else is paddle shift or full auto. I live in a city centre and the chances of using a manual for pleasure city traffic are not high. On a weekend I will take the manual for a country run periodically, but it is not my daily routine any more.
Automatic new sales in the UK have just touched 80%.
Amazed it's taken this long, I think the USA was at 95% back in the 90s?
USA is now at 98.3% automatic.
Europe is where the biggest change has happened, they have flown from less than 10% being automatic in 2005 to about 80% being automatic today.
Vans in the UK are also going Auto at a fast rate but slower than cars, it's about 40% of new vans are auto probably driven by the huge requirement of delivery drivers (auto will attract more people new to vans) and big companies going EV.
As vans switch to hybrid and EV I'd imagine it'll be 80% within a couple of years too.
Amazed it's taken this long, I think the USA was at 95% back in the 90s?
USA is now at 98.3% automatic.
Europe is where the biggest change has happened, they have flown from less than 10% being automatic in 2005 to about 80% being automatic today.
Vans in the UK are also going Auto at a fast rate but slower than cars, it's about 40% of new vans are auto probably driven by the huge requirement of delivery drivers (auto will attract more people new to vans) and big companies going EV.
As vans switch to hybrid and EV I'd imagine it'll be 80% within a couple of years too.
cerb4.5lee said:
911Spanker said:
I have 5 cars. They are all manual and RWD.
Couldn't live any other way.
That is super cool bud I reckon for sure. Couldn't live any other way.
quite possibly no ABS or ESC either. every keen driver should have at least one pure car.
not saying the daily family wagon should be a death trap before some get triggered.
740EVTORQUES said:
911Spanker said:
I have 5 cars. They are all manual and RWD.
Couldn't live any other way.
How boringCouldn't live any other way.
Variety is the spice of life
They have different engine placements and configurations. I have tried them all and know what I like...
It's a bit like food - I have eaten most, of not all types of cuisine but I know what I really enjoy.
BandOfBrothers said:
In cars with aggressive clutches and lightened flywheels it's absolutely necessary, unless your passengers to feel sick / think you never actually passed your test.
That doesn't necessitate heel and toe (rev matching while gear changing under braking), it just necessitates rev matching.911Spanker said:
Hardly.
They have different engine placements and configurations. I have tried them all and know what I like...
It's a bit like food - I have eaten most, of not all types of cuisine but I know what I really enjoy.
I find quite the opposite. There’s nothing better than getting out of my track car and jumping into Smart coupe with its quirky single clutch semi-auto, or the EV. Next day in a manual 911.They have different engine placements and configurations. I have tried them all and know what I like...
It's a bit like food - I have eaten most, of not all types of cuisine but I know what I really enjoy.
They all have their appeal . Driving a ‘sporty’ RWD manual car daily just find annoying.
740EVTORQUES said:
911Spanker said:
Hardly.
They have different engine placements and configurations. I have tried them all and know what I like...
It's a bit like food - I have eaten most, of not all types of cuisine but I know what I really enjoy.
I find quite the opposite. There’s nothing better than getting out of my track car and jumping into Smart coupe with its quirky single clutch semi-auto, or the EV. Next day in a manual 911.They have different engine placements and configurations. I have tried them all and know what I like...
It's a bit like food - I have eaten most, of not all types of cuisine but I know what I really enjoy.
They all have their appeal . Driving a ‘sporty’ RWD manual car daily just find annoying.
Nomme de Plum said:
740EVTORQUES said:
911Spanker said:
Hardly.
They have different engine placements and configurations. I have tried them all and know what I like...
It's a bit like food - I have eaten most, of not all types of cuisine but I know what I really enjoy.
I find quite the opposite. There’s nothing better than getting out of my track car and jumping into Smart coupe with its quirky single clutch semi-auto, or the EV. Next day in a manual 911.They have different engine placements and configurations. I have tried them all and know what I like...
It's a bit like food - I have eaten most, of not all types of cuisine but I know what I really enjoy.
They all have their appeal . Driving a ‘sporty’ RWD manual car daily just find annoying.
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