New Vanq 3 on the way
Discussion
835 BHP pretty impressive!
http://click.mails.astonmartin.com/?qs=9cd9a9a86c3...
Vanq3 by Mark Maddox, on Flickr
http://click.mails.astonmartin.com/?qs=9cd9a9a86c3...
Vanq3 by Mark Maddox, on FlickrAdamV12V said:
Cant wait to see it....
Surely a whole NEW V12 engine can't only be used one model? This must spell a whole new era of last ever V12's still to come, which can only be great news!
It does say:Surely a whole NEW V12 engine can't only be used one model? This must spell a whole new era of last ever V12's still to come, which can only be great news!
The new V12 engine, which will feature across Aston Martin’s most exclusive and limited availability models, is a bold statement of luxurious sporting intent and, as such, it will be handcrafted, year by year, in strictly limited numbers
Westlondondriver said:
AdamV12V said:
Cant wait to see it....
Surely a whole NEW V12 engine can't only be used one model? This must spell a whole new era of last ever V12's still to come, which can only be great news!
It does say:Surely a whole NEW V12 engine can't only be used one model? This must spell a whole new era of last ever V12's still to come, which can only be great news!
The new V12 engine, which will feature across Aston Martin’s most exclusive and limited availability models, is a bold statement of luxurious sporting intent and, as such, it will be handcrafted, year by year, in strictly limited numbers
So first up a V12 Vanquish, then V12 DBX maybe, then presumably another last ever V12 Vantage? All would be very nice to see, but I suspect the associated ultra price tags are going to be every bit as eyewatering as 825bhp and 1000Nm of Torque will be.
So the 5.2 AE31 does live on after all. Fantastic. As suspected, new turbos, injectors/pump.
Sadly, and also as expected, judging by the marketing bumf it looks like it’s going to be a very expensive option be it in the new Vanquish, a more hopped up DBX or the more limited stuff.
1000Nm and 836hp should certainly make it interesting though.
Can’t imagine the Valour owners, who a year ago were persuaded to cough well over a million for the Valour will be too impressed though.
Sadly, and also as expected, judging by the marketing bumf it looks like it’s going to be a very expensive option be it in the new Vanquish, a more hopped up DBX or the more limited stuff.
1000Nm and 836hp should certainly make it interesting though.
Can’t imagine the Valour owners, who a year ago were persuaded to cough well over a million for the Valour will be too impressed though.
AdamV12V said:
Grapevine says circa £400k and not mid engined…..
That's a shame, for £400k plus it needs to be mid-engineered. if not it's just another DB car with a different body again. I'm keeping Vanq2S forever more but I've moved to McLaren for my main fun because AML front engineered cars all a bit samey and slow these days. 835BHp in Mid-Engineered Vanq would get me back in the marque! AdamV12V said:
Grapevine says circa £400k and not mid engined…..
Sure. As with DB12 and Vantage it’s going to be a revised version of the recent DBS/S. More boosted V12, revised chassis, revised body, new interior, likely 30-40% price hike. Where DBS Superleggerra finished at what, GBP 280k this will start at probably £380k. Let’s hope they make it good enough to justify the price and find the buyers. Great to see the 5.2 V12 get another lease of life though. It seems it is being built in UK by Auto craft. It was always designed to be capable of massive power, Astons have long featured quality cranks, but the AE31 had forged rods and pistons from the outset. Good job Brian Fitzsimmons.
Remember this is the era of Stroll, so it will be essentially the same 5.2 litre V12 twin scroll biturbo engine developed under Andy Palmer and Brian Fitzsimmons - probably with revised turbos and fuelling for the extra horses, then as has become the norm, cynically presented as something all new. “this and that has been revised, and we have moved the spark plugs”.
Edited by Calinours on Wednesday 1st May 18:49
Calinours said:
AdamV12V said:
Grapevine says circa £400k and not mid engined…..
Sure. As with DB12 and Vantage it’s going to be a revised version of the recent DBS/S. More boosted V12, revised chassis, revised body, new interior, likely 30-40% price hike. Where DBS Superleggerra finished at what, GBP 280k this will start at probably £380k. Let’s hope they make it good enough to justify the price and find the buyers. Given the focus on ASP, wouldn't surprise me if they gave it a go - even if such an approach doesn't feel aligned with increasing volume.
MMarkM said:
A dealer told me yesterday that starting price will be £320k. Front engineered GT. Pretty much what we expected but not what we wanted. AML don't have the funds to sort a mid engineered super car
This seems more realistic, a 20-25% hike then. I think the DBSS at launch in 2018 was about £230k base, but optioned up like anything at that sort of price point there would have been few if any less than 250k. I don’t know about it being a shame that it’s only a big front engined sporting GT - this is what AM are best known for. I wonder what they will declare it to be? If DB12 is already a super tourer… Whatever it looks like they are aiming more squarely at the 812 and it’s replacement this time. I’d expect numbers close to and perhaps over £400k when decently optioned though, they are really leaning even more into that strategy.
If £400k is going to be the cost of a well optioned new continuation V12 flagship Vanq/DBS with 1000Nm, it does make the 900Nm (with so much torque, horsepower starts to become irrelevant) DBSS look a much more tantalising prospect at todays values. I for one could absolutely live with its interior and Merc sat nav at 1/3 the price of the new car…
Calinours said:
If £400k is going to be the cost of a well optioned new continuation V12 flagship Vanq/DBS with 1000Nm, it does make the 900Nm (with so much torque, horsepower starts to become irrelevant) DBSS look a much more tantalising prospect at todays values. I for one could absolutely live with its interior and Merc sat nav at 1/3 the price of the new car…
With my 430bhp Vantage, traffic conditions and trying to respect laws, means I can only use full throttle for a few seconds at any time.
Can anyone tell me how I could have more fun with 835bhp?
In addition to that mystery, the cost to trade-up would mean my bank account would be £350,000 lighter.
£400,000 does seem a lot to pay, for something that is fairly similar to what I already enjoy.
There must be an approximate relationship, between the total price and the number of prospective buyers.
Do you think doubling the price, might halve the number of interested buyers?
Dewi 2 said:
With my 430bhp Vantage, traffic conditions and trying to respect laws, means I can only use full throttle for a few seconds at any time.
Can anyone tell me how I could have more fun with 835bhp?
In addition to that mystery, the cost to trade-up would mean my bank account would be £350,000 lighter.
£400,000 does seem a lot to pay, for something that is fairly similar to what I already enjoy.
There must be an approximate relationship, between the total price and the number of prospective buyers.
Do you think doubling the price, might halve the number of interested buyers?
All manufacturers have been locked in a crazy power for years now, its not that long since even 430bhp seemed obscene, nowadays its probably not even worthy of a SRI badge, let alone the GT badge in the mid-market boring rep-mobile race
As for the price game I am absolutely sure there is such a relationship. Back-of-a-fag-packet-onomics but lets imagine that the cars cost a) £150k to build and they sell it for £200k or b) costs £170k to build, but they can sell it for £400k albeit they only sell half as many.
In a) they make 2x £50k profit, so £100k total
in b) they make 1x £230k profit total - and can reduce overheads, have half as many warranty claims, half as many customers to deal with etc.., etc.... However R&D costs do have to get doubled for each unit sold, so its not all gravy...
Still there is deffo a solid basis for putting the price up and selling less units, and AM has always been a niche choice, so they are never going to compete with Porsche, Ferrari or Lambo sales volumes no matter what.
On a side note, Im surprised how few posts this thread has, but I do realise there i a similar thread in the "News" section, but I cant bring myself to post there as its full of really stupid posts such as "lets hope the new V12 is n/a" and such like....
EDIT - corrected hasty maths as pointed out below - thanks
Edited by AdamV12V on Thursday 2nd May 21:59
With the new Vanquish, I think Aston Martin have a real chance to make a car for would-be 12Cilindri buyers to seriously consider as an alternate/preferred option.
I was really looking forward to seeing the 812 replacement. Not being a fan of the Roma or Purosangue styling, I'm not sure what I expected. And really, it's just "meh" imo. It's OK I guess. I appreciate some of the design elements in a way, but it's nowhere near as special as Ferraris of the past. You could imagine a new Chinese sports EV looking like something not far off the 12Cilindri. Maybe it will look better in person. And they’ve gone the opposite route to Aston on the interior - it’s all screens with very few physical controls.
Aston have already shown that they can take an already quite good looking car (DB11) and significantly improve it (DB12). The new Vantage as well. The DBSS was already pretty damn gorgeous. And elements of the Viktor/Valour are amazing. The trend is encouraging. Spy shots of the new Vanquish look great so far.
So aside from the unbeatable N/A 6.5L aspect of the new Ferrari, I think AM could find themselves in a very strong position if they play their cards right. The new Vanquish already beats it on output power.
My main worry for both the new Vanquish and the 12Cilindri is regulation. And not just the particulate filtration and dB edicts ruining the sound. There is talk of forced speed regulation (not just over-speed-limit beep warnings). That kind of thing would kill the market for these otherwise awesome machines.
I was really looking forward to seeing the 812 replacement. Not being a fan of the Roma or Purosangue styling, I'm not sure what I expected. And really, it's just "meh" imo. It's OK I guess. I appreciate some of the design elements in a way, but it's nowhere near as special as Ferraris of the past. You could imagine a new Chinese sports EV looking like something not far off the 12Cilindri. Maybe it will look better in person. And they’ve gone the opposite route to Aston on the interior - it’s all screens with very few physical controls.
Aston have already shown that they can take an already quite good looking car (DB11) and significantly improve it (DB12). The new Vantage as well. The DBSS was already pretty damn gorgeous. And elements of the Viktor/Valour are amazing. The trend is encouraging. Spy shots of the new Vanquish look great so far.
So aside from the unbeatable N/A 6.5L aspect of the new Ferrari, I think AM could find themselves in a very strong position if they play their cards right. The new Vanquish already beats it on output power.
My main worry for both the new Vanquish and the 12Cilindri is regulation. And not just the particulate filtration and dB edicts ruining the sound. There is talk of forced speed regulation (not just over-speed-limit beep warnings). That kind of thing would kill the market for these otherwise awesome machines.
Edited by atrossity on Friday 3rd May 14:39
Edited by atrossity on Friday 3rd May 14:40
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