Burglary at remote Peak District farm, murder arrest
Discussion
Shades of Tony Martin?
Man arrested on suspicion of murder at remote farmhouse after police find one man dead inside and another injured outside, both having been shot
“Officers were called to reports of a break-in at a remote Peak District farmhouse early this morning.
They found a man with fatal injuries inside the property and another seriously hurt in the road outside around 1.20am. Both had been shot.
Officers cordoned off a large section of a country lane, in Whaley Bridge, Derbyshire, and launched a murder investigation.
The injured man was taken to hospital for treatment and arrested on suspicion of aggravated burglary. A third suspect was also arrested on suspicion of the same offence this afternoon after being stopped by police in a vehicle on the A6, near Chapel-en-le-frith.
Neighbours said the incident appeared to have been a 'burglary that went wrong.'
A woman, who lives close the farm, said: 'The farm is in a remote location, quite deep in the valley and set back from the main road.
'I suspect it was an opportunistic burglary that has gone wrong.'”
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13372033/...
Man arrested on suspicion of murder at remote farmhouse after police find one man dead inside and another injured outside, both having been shot
“Officers were called to reports of a break-in at a remote Peak District farmhouse early this morning.
They found a man with fatal injuries inside the property and another seriously hurt in the road outside around 1.20am. Both had been shot.
Officers cordoned off a large section of a country lane, in Whaley Bridge, Derbyshire, and launched a murder investigation.
The injured man was taken to hospital for treatment and arrested on suspicion of aggravated burglary. A third suspect was also arrested on suspicion of the same offence this afternoon after being stopped by police in a vehicle on the A6, near Chapel-en-le-frith.
Neighbours said the incident appeared to have been a 'burglary that went wrong.'
A woman, who lives close the farm, said: 'The farm is in a remote location, quite deep in the valley and set back from the main road.
'I suspect it was an opportunistic burglary that has gone wrong.'”
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13372033/...
If it was a "burglary that went wrong" then they deserve what they got, play stupid games win stupid prizes springs to mind, the law is flawed if this farmer is done for murder IMHO if his gun is legally held (unlike Tony Martin) should be given an award for saving tax payers a fortune to keep these scrotes in prison, again in IMHO
Edited by ninepoint2 on Wednesday 1st May 22:39
Ch Supt Dave Kirby, of Derbyshire Police, said: "We appreciate the impact this incident is having on this small rural community and we'd like to thank local residents for their help with this investigation so far.
"We are aware there has been some speculation locally around this and while we are in the early stages of the investigation, we believe this is a targeted incident.
A fourth man was arrested on suspicion of aggravated burglary after officers stopped a vehicle on the A6 near Chapel-en-le-Frith. He remains in custody.
"We are aware there has been some speculation locally around this and while we are in the early stages of the investigation, we believe this is a targeted incident.
A fourth man was arrested on suspicion of aggravated burglary after officers stopped a vehicle on the A6 near Chapel-en-le-Frith. He remains in custody.
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hstewie said:
hstewie said: I thought it was generally accepted that stopping burglars with reasonable force is fine whilst murdering them regardless of the circumstances isn't.
Apologies for not being able to multi link in one reply.I’d suggest (if the story/facts are as reported. Then shooting at a burglar maybe reasonable force/appropriate response.
A pity if said burglar happens to get in the way of more of the pellets than you might of intended, but as others have stated, play silly games…
Being woken in the early hours of the morning by noise in your house would, I’d venture, lead most people to being scared and any actions might not be as well thought through as those you may carry out when you were awake and more aware/prepared.
ie, more instinct-based than totally pre-meditated.
The law was changed quite a long time ago now to allow home owners to use beyond reasonable force "in the heat of the moment" in your home.
I think it was Dave Cameron?
Anyway, there have been cases where home owners have not been charged following the deaths of burglars. The issue with this case from the outset is the use of firearms. The police are going to be all over that. You cant just keep a shotgun by your bedside... so there are going to be questions. That said, with the right answers in theory actions could still be legal especially if the crims had come tooled up.
I think it was Dave Cameron?
Anyway, there have been cases where home owners have not been charged following the deaths of burglars. The issue with this case from the outset is the use of firearms. The police are going to be all over that. You cant just keep a shotgun by your bedside... so there are going to be questions. That said, with the right answers in theory actions could still be legal especially if the crims had come tooled up.
bhstewie said:
hstewie said: I thought it was generally accepted that stopping burglars with reasonable force is fine whilst murdering them regardless of the circumstances isn't.
You aren't going to stop them without violence. Once you have been pushed into violence, they aren't going to stop until they have inflicted enough violence back on you to change your life permanently, so if stopping them is your aim, then murder is your only option. If you do nothing, they'll be back again. I assume.
(I've watched too much Guy Richie on telly, to really know the answer)
Pit Pony said:
You aren't going to stop them without violence. Once you have been pushed into violence, they aren't going to stop until they have inflicted enough violence back on you to change your life permanently, so if stopping them is your aim, then murder is your only option.
If you do nothing, they'll be back again. I assume.
(I've watched too much Guy Richie on telly, to really know the answer)
It's all down to the judgement of reasonable.If you do nothing, they'll be back again. I assume.
(I've watched too much Guy Richie on telly, to really know the answer)
The level of violence 4 blokes can dish out on 1 can easily end in death if not life changing injury.
A shotgun (assumption) at close range is deadly though, so the farmer is going to have to demonstrate a near equal level of fear.
Also I think Tony Martin hid behind a door and ambushed them
At least this thread has not got derailed by attach dogs, bit being a farm maybe they could train attack geese?
Ps Whalley Bridge is where that dam that nearly collapsed was in 2020 ish
Ian Geary said:
Also I think Tony Martin hid behind a door and ambushed them
Not only was he lying in waiting for them but he shot them in the back as they were running away. With an illegally held gun. He was lucky to only do 3 years.If you feel your life is threatened then defending with lethal force is perfectly legal.
Ian Geary said:
It's all down to the judgement of reasonable.
The level of violence 4 blokes can dish out on 1 can easily end in death if not life changing injury.
A shotgun (assumption) at close range is deadly though, so the farmer is going to have to demonstrate a near equal level of fear.
Also I think Tony Martin hid behind a door and ambushed them
At least this thread has not got derailed by attach dogs, bit being a farm maybe they could train attack geese?
Ps Whalley Bridge is where that dam that nearly collapsed was in 2020 ish
If you are alone, and 4 people are attempting to break in then a firearm is probably the only hope you have of coming out on top.The level of violence 4 blokes can dish out on 1 can easily end in death if not life changing injury.
A shotgun (assumption) at close range is deadly though, so the farmer is going to have to demonstrate a near equal level of fear.
Also I think Tony Martin hid behind a door and ambushed them
At least this thread has not got derailed by attach dogs, bit being a farm maybe they could train attack geese?
Ps Whalley Bridge is where that dam that nearly collapsed was in 2020 ish
The question will be where and how it was kept to allow the homeowner to access it in what was probably a fast moving situation.
I hope he had been up shooting vermin on the farm with a legal weapon and was sat cleaning it when the other vermin broke in and threatened him/family with serious harm.
If they are armed in any way that also helps. At that point he hopefully gets off.
If he does a Tony Martin then sadly jail beckons.
If they are armed in any way that also helps. At that point he hopefully gets off.
If he does a Tony Martin then sadly jail beckons.
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