UK to the Italian lakes via Switzerland
Discussion
Hi guys
planning on driving from the UK to the Italian Lakes via Switzerland.
Will be myself and the wife ,travelling in Porsche Cayman and have 14 days total
DAY.1 Travelling from near Manchester so intend to drive to the tunnel then stay in Lille.
DAY 2.From here it is on to Luxembourg and the Ardennes region for our next stop.
DAY.3 From the Ardennes to Mulhouse and our 3rd stop.
Day 4. Mulhouse through Basel and into the Alps.
From here is where i need help. Which route through the Alps ? Where in the Alps to stay ? Would love to travel as many mountain passes as possible.
When we eventually get there, where is the best area to stay in the Italian lakes......or spend a night in a few different places ?
Do not mind doing all the "nice" driving to the lakes and then a mad and more direct route
back to blighty.
Would appreciate any pointers, or any alternative suggestions as where to drive to, and get back from within Europe, in 14 days.
Thanks in advance
Tom
planning on driving from the UK to the Italian Lakes via Switzerland.
Will be myself and the wife ,travelling in Porsche Cayman and have 14 days total
DAY.1 Travelling from near Manchester so intend to drive to the tunnel then stay in Lille.
DAY 2.From here it is on to Luxembourg and the Ardennes region for our next stop.
DAY.3 From the Ardennes to Mulhouse and our 3rd stop.
Day 4. Mulhouse through Basel and into the Alps.
From here is where i need help. Which route through the Alps ? Where in the Alps to stay ? Would love to travel as many mountain passes as possible.
When we eventually get there, where is the best area to stay in the Italian lakes......or spend a night in a few different places ?
Do not mind doing all the "nice" driving to the lakes and then a mad and more direct route
back to blighty.
Would appreciate any pointers, or any alternative suggestions as where to drive to, and get back from within Europe, in 14 days.
Thanks in advance
Tom
We’ve stayed in Innerkitchen before now, ideally placed for a number of passes, that you can loop around and use it as a base
Easy access to the Furka, Gothard, Grimsell, Susten etc
We stayed in hotel restaurant Urweider which I’d recommend
Don’t know if that helps but some stunning drives out from there plus a number of attractions you can visit
Easy access to the Furka, Gothard, Grimsell, Susten etc
We stayed in hotel restaurant Urweider which I’d recommend
Don’t know if that helps but some stunning drives out from there plus a number of attractions you can visit
Can't really help much with suggestions but We went back in 2015 and travelled over on the ferry,
Day one - we travelled down to Dover and across on the ferry, we then went from Calais to Strasbourg and stayed the night
Day 2 - from Strasbourg we crossed over into Switzerland at Basel and crossed the Alps Via the Simplon Pass then onto our hotel at Stresa Lake Maggiore
Day one was a long one and by the time we reached Strasbourg we were all pretty tired and ready for a good nights sleep,
Day 2 we set of early but our sat nav managed to send us on a route that involved taking one of the car ferry trains under the mountain before we reached Simplon and to this day I still don't know what route we took and how we ended up going both under the alps and over the top before reaching Italy,
we didn't arrive at our lakeside hotel till late in the afternoon so had been travelling for most of the day and probably covered a lot more miles than necessary,
plus the weather going over the pass wasn't the best with rain and fog, we were also stuck behind a motorhome the whole way over so didn't really get to see much, I still enjoyed the drive down though and the unexpected train ride was an added adventure.
Day one - we travelled down to Dover and across on the ferry, we then went from Calais to Strasbourg and stayed the night
Day 2 - from Strasbourg we crossed over into Switzerland at Basel and crossed the Alps Via the Simplon Pass then onto our hotel at Stresa Lake Maggiore
Day one was a long one and by the time we reached Strasbourg we were all pretty tired and ready for a good nights sleep,
Day 2 we set of early but our sat nav managed to send us on a route that involved taking one of the car ferry trains under the mountain before we reached Simplon and to this day I still don't know what route we took and how we ended up going both under the alps and over the top before reaching Italy,
we didn't arrive at our lakeside hotel till late in the afternoon so had been travelling for most of the day and probably covered a lot more miles than necessary,
plus the weather going over the pass wasn't the best with rain and fog, we were also stuck behind a motorhome the whole way over so didn't really get to see much, I still enjoyed the drive down though and the unexpected train ride was an added adventure.
Edited by timberman on Tuesday 21st May 20:00
timberman said:
Can't really help much with suggestions but We went back in 2015 but travelled over on the ferry,
Day one - we travelled down to Dover and across on the ferry, we then went from Calais to Strasbourg and stayed the night
Day 2 - from Strasbourg we crossed over into Switzerland at Basel and crossed the Alps Via the Simplon Pass then onto our hotel at Stresa Lake Maggiore
Day one was a long one and by the time we reached Strasbourg we were all pretty tired and ready for a good nights sleep,
Day 2 we set of early but our sat nav managed to send us on a route that involved taking one of the car ferry trains under the mountain before we reached Simplon and to this day I still don't know how what route we took and how we ended up going both under the alps and over the top before reaching Italy,
we didn't arrive at our lakeside hotel till late in the afternoon so had been travelling for most of the day and probably covered a lot more miles than necessary,
plus the weather going over the pass wasn't the best with rain and fog, we were also stuck behind a motorhome the whole way over so didn't really get to see much, I still enjoyed the drive down though and the unexpected train ride was an added adventure.
I suspect you went first on the Lotschberg/Kandersteg train ferry down to Brig and then drove over Simplon Pass rather than taking that train ferry. Day one - we travelled down to Dover and across on the ferry, we then went from Calais to Strasbourg and stayed the night
Day 2 - from Strasbourg we crossed over into Switzerland at Basel and crossed the Alps Via the Simplon Pass then onto our hotel at Stresa Lake Maggiore
Day one was a long one and by the time we reached Strasbourg we were all pretty tired and ready for a good nights sleep,
Day 2 we set of early but our sat nav managed to send us on a route that involved taking one of the car ferry trains under the mountain before we reached Simplon and to this day I still don't know how what route we took and how we ended up going both under the alps and over the top before reaching Italy,
we didn't arrive at our lakeside hotel till late in the afternoon so had been travelling for most of the day and probably covered a lot more miles than necessary,
plus the weather going over the pass wasn't the best with rain and fog, we were also stuck behind a motorhome the whole way over so didn't really get to see much, I still enjoyed the drive down though and the unexpected train ride was an added adventure.
Edited by timberman on Tuesday 21st May 19:58
All I can add is I went to the lakes on the bike last year. I planned to go over the St.Gotthard pass. The queue for the tunnel was miles long, and I wouldn’t have wanted to wait in that. If that is your planned route go via Andermatt and the pass proper, not the tunnel. Long queue on the Italian side too.
Came back over the Timmelsjoch; no queues there but a toll at the top. Great road to ride/drive.
Came back over the Timmelsjoch; no queues there but a toll at the top. Great road to ride/drive.
I've just started a very similar trip today. Typing this from Lille.
Unfortunately most of the Swiss passes are still closed, otherwise I'd be staying in Andermatt and enjoying the Susten, Nufenen, Furka and Gotthard passes.
Timmelsjoch as mentioned above is a corker, but a little out of the way. Stelvio is en route if you're heading to Garda. It's crap to drive but the views from the top are very nice and it's so famous you'd might as well tick off the list if never been. Might as well drive the Umbrail as well if you're in that area.
Unfortunately most of the Swiss passes are still closed, otherwise I'd be staying in Andermatt and enjoying the Susten, Nufenen, Furka and Gotthard passes.
Timmelsjoch as mentioned above is a corker, but a little out of the way. Stelvio is en route if you're heading to Garda. It's crap to drive but the views from the top are very nice and it's so famous you'd might as well tick off the list if never been. Might as well drive the Umbrail as well if you're in that area.
Just coming back from a weekend in Turin, we took the overnight ferry from Harwich to Hook, last Wednesday then on Thursday drove to Fribourg in Switzerland for overnight stop, took 9 hours 45 mins driving time. Stayed at a fantastic ‘wellness’ retreat hotel.
The high passes are not open yet so had to take tunnel at Great St Bernard pass on to Aosta, after a quick stop in Montreaux to look at lake. Then down to Turin
Came back on Sunday via Route De Grandes Alpes, up a bit of the Route Napoleon to Gap, then back across Switzerland to near Baden Baden, then back to Hook tonight. On the ferry as I type this.
I never saw open road ahead of me for any great distance in either of my drives across Germany, very very busy. My average over 500+ km was under 98kph. I reckon I’d have been better taking a peage route through France as it’s far more relaxed.
The high passes are not open yet so had to take tunnel at Great St Bernard pass on to Aosta, after a quick stop in Montreaux to look at lake. Then down to Turin
Came back on Sunday via Route De Grandes Alpes, up a bit of the Route Napoleon to Gap, then back across Switzerland to near Baden Baden, then back to Hook tonight. On the ferry as I type this.
I never saw open road ahead of me for any great distance in either of my drives across Germany, very very busy. My average over 500+ km was under 98kph. I reckon I’d have been better taking a peage route through France as it’s far more relaxed.
psi310398 said:
timberman said:
Can't really help much with suggestions but We went back in 2015 but travelled over on the ferry,
Day one - we travelled down to Dover and across on the ferry, we then went from Calais to Strasbourg and stayed the night
Day 2 - from Strasbourg we crossed over into Switzerland at Basel and crossed the Alps Via the Simplon Pass then onto our hotel at Stresa Lake Maggiore
Day one was a long one and by the time we reached Strasbourg we were all pretty tired and ready for a good nights sleep,
Day 2 we set of early but our sat nav managed to send us on a route that involved taking one of the car ferry trains under the mountain before we reached Simplon and to this day I still don't know how what route we took and how we ended up going both under the alps and over the top before reaching Italy,
we didn't arrive at our lakeside hotel till late in the afternoon so had been travelling for most of the day and probably covered a lot more miles than necessary,
plus the weather going over the pass wasn't the best with rain and fog, we were also stuck behind a motorhome the whole way over so didn't really get to see much, I still enjoyed the drive down though and the unexpected train ride was an added adventure.
I suspect you went first on the Lotschberg/Kandersteg train ferry down to Brig and then drove over Simplon Pass rather than taking that train ferry. Day one - we travelled down to Dover and across on the ferry, we then went from Calais to Strasbourg and stayed the night
Day 2 - from Strasbourg we crossed over into Switzerland at Basel and crossed the Alps Via the Simplon Pass then onto our hotel at Stresa Lake Maggiore
Day one was a long one and by the time we reached Strasbourg we were all pretty tired and ready for a good nights sleep,
Day 2 we set of early but our sat nav managed to send us on a route that involved taking one of the car ferry trains under the mountain before we reached Simplon and to this day I still don't know how what route we took and how we ended up going both under the alps and over the top before reaching Italy,
we didn't arrive at our lakeside hotel till late in the afternoon so had been travelling for most of the day and probably covered a lot more miles than necessary,
plus the weather going over the pass wasn't the best with rain and fog, we were also stuck behind a motorhome the whole way over so didn't really get to see much, I still enjoyed the drive down though and the unexpected train ride was an added adventure.
Edited by timberman on Tuesday 21st May 19:58
I have been taking European motorcycling trips for many years & can see the end of that just over the horizon, so we are in the throes of a series of final visits to various favourites. In 2022 it was to the Dolomites & the Alps, we went down on the motorail from Düsseldorf to Innsbruck, but I don’t recommend that. However it led to one of best days out of my entire life at the 007 Elements exhibition at Solden. It is a surreal experience that I struggle to verbalise.
Anyway we went to Cortina for a couple of days & toured the Dolomites. Then travelled west across Alps darting back & forth through Italy, Austria, Switzerland & France. We were away 12 days. I think we did 25 passes. It was knackering, but excellent.
My advice for route planning is to work on max of 200 miles per day in the mountains, many motorcycle magazines & websites have suggested touring routes. I supplement this by looking at cycle racing routes because they ride the passes one after another, but all of them have support vehicles, so use decent roads and will pass through places with plenty of accommodation. Just following green routes on Michelin maps can take you down the odd goat trail, ok for a bike, not so much for a Porsche Cayman.
Anyway we went to Cortina for a couple of days & toured the Dolomites. Then travelled west across Alps darting back & forth through Italy, Austria, Switzerland & France. We were away 12 days. I think we did 25 passes. It was knackering, but excellent.
My advice for route planning is to work on max of 200 miles per day in the mountains, many motorcycle magazines & websites have suggested touring routes. I supplement this by looking at cycle racing routes because they ride the passes one after another, but all of them have support vehicles, so use decent roads and will pass through places with plenty of accommodation. Just following green routes on Michelin maps can take you down the odd goat trail, ok for a bike, not so much for a Porsche Cayman.
Get this if you have time, it’s a good read
https://www.amazon.com/Alps-Human-History-Hannibal...
I’d cross into CH at Vallorbe, then head south east and over the Col de Marchairuz. Neat little drive ending in a great view of Lac Leman with the alps behind. I also don’t like Mulhouse and whilst Basel is nice, Bern is much nicer (with far better f&b).
Overnight at Lausanne. Then via Gruyère and the Jaun pass to Interlaken. This pass is a personal favourite as it’s kind of ok then folds back between 2 ridges with a cracking view down the valley to the Eiger / Monch.
Oh, get the PeakFinder app, it’s great.
Personally I think the most ‘wow’ scenery is in the Swiss alps and the Dolomites. Zermatt & Grindwald can be very touristy but for good reasons. If near the latter, the Grandhotel Giessbach is worth a stop or stay.
I’d echo the above and stay on the Swiss side up to Stelvio then circle round to Grand St Bernard on the way home. Stay in agriturismos as far as you can and, if not, ask your hosts for f&b recommendations.
Near garda there’s a very unimpressive town called Grezzana. However close by there’s the very impressive Villa Balis Crema which is well worth a stay. Has 2 excellent restaurants, one Michelin stared the other much more informal and hearty. A short drive up the hill takes you to La Collini dei Cillegi, a winery. They do a great tour, tasting and lunch for about €40 which is too value given the wines on offer.
Hard to go wrong food wise once in Italy but if you do head home via the GSB, we always now stop at Trattoria La Bourg in Fenis. Was first recommended by the Sommelier at a very swish place in Aosta, the food is simple and the place even more so, but the food is top notch.
Stayed at hotel le Balze on the eastern side of Garda which is cheap and cheerful but makes up for it with a stunning view.
Isola Bella is well worth it but the shoreside towns nearby were a bit meh imo. If you head there via the north of the lake, the valleys up to Brione is a nice diversion.
But really, the alps, Dolomites and Italian lakes, very difficult not to have an amazing time. Enjoy!
https://www.amazon.com/Alps-Human-History-Hannibal...
I’d cross into CH at Vallorbe, then head south east and over the Col de Marchairuz. Neat little drive ending in a great view of Lac Leman with the alps behind. I also don’t like Mulhouse and whilst Basel is nice, Bern is much nicer (with far better f&b).
Overnight at Lausanne. Then via Gruyère and the Jaun pass to Interlaken. This pass is a personal favourite as it’s kind of ok then folds back between 2 ridges with a cracking view down the valley to the Eiger / Monch.
Oh, get the PeakFinder app, it’s great.
Personally I think the most ‘wow’ scenery is in the Swiss alps and the Dolomites. Zermatt & Grindwald can be very touristy but for good reasons. If near the latter, the Grandhotel Giessbach is worth a stop or stay.
I’d echo the above and stay on the Swiss side up to Stelvio then circle round to Grand St Bernard on the way home. Stay in agriturismos as far as you can and, if not, ask your hosts for f&b recommendations.
Near garda there’s a very unimpressive town called Grezzana. However close by there’s the very impressive Villa Balis Crema which is well worth a stay. Has 2 excellent restaurants, one Michelin stared the other much more informal and hearty. A short drive up the hill takes you to La Collini dei Cillegi, a winery. They do a great tour, tasting and lunch for about €40 which is too value given the wines on offer.
Hard to go wrong food wise once in Italy but if you do head home via the GSB, we always now stop at Trattoria La Bourg in Fenis. Was first recommended by the Sommelier at a very swish place in Aosta, the food is simple and the place even more so, but the food is top notch.
Stayed at hotel le Balze on the eastern side of Garda which is cheap and cheerful but makes up for it with a stunning view.
Isola Bella is well worth it but the shoreside towns nearby were a bit meh imo. If you head there via the north of the lake, the valleys up to Brione is a nice diversion.
But really, the alps, Dolomites and Italian lakes, very difficult not to have an amazing time. Enjoy!
Edited by shirt on Tuesday 21st May 22:41
I was reminded of a restaurant this evening and thought I’d share here in case you do pass bylaw .
https://www.coucoumontreux.com/
Rare in CH for being decent value. Probably the best steak I’ve had anywhere, which was a surprise.
https://www.coucoumontreux.com/
Rare in CH for being decent value. Probably the best steak I’ve had anywhere, which was a surprise.
Metric Max said:
Rather than stop overnight at Mulhouse I would suggest that you take a look at Colmar, about 26 miles north
Actually go for Riquewihr, Le Schoenenbourg. Inexpensive and Magic place for overnight stop.This place was great, decent restaurant in ‘northern Luxembourg - Chateau d'Urspelt
Lakes wise - villa Cordevigo or in Sirmione near Garda
Or Lake Maggorie - Stresa
Or Como magic
Edited by bennno on Thursday 23 May 22:05
We drove from the Lakes last year and went right down into Italy, Best trip ever.
Couple of things;
Lake Como we stayed at Boggo de Terraze was wonderful, covered parking, pool, great views of the Lake, close enough to walk into Bellagio (they run a shuttle) but far away enough. Rent a boat from the bottom of the hill from Mirko at Boat Hire Bellagio, had it for 5 hours, nice boat and told us where to go which was good.
Good stop off place or even to spend a day or two is Colmar or in around Alsace great place to explore, lots of history, castles and I have been a couple of times on business. We drove from Colmar to Penrith in a day.
July and August are busy so best avoided imho.
Mountain Passes are great but don’t underestimate how long it takes to drive and also it can become a bit of chore after a few days of them so spread it out.
Go on one of the Mountain Coasters really enjoyed them and maybe an ice cave.
Loads of places for wild swimming if that’s your thing.
I prefer Austria and the Dolomites but the Swiss Alps are amazing.
Couple of things;
Lake Como we stayed at Boggo de Terraze was wonderful, covered parking, pool, great views of the Lake, close enough to walk into Bellagio (they run a shuttle) but far away enough. Rent a boat from the bottom of the hill from Mirko at Boat Hire Bellagio, had it for 5 hours, nice boat and told us where to go which was good.
Good stop off place or even to spend a day or two is Colmar or in around Alsace great place to explore, lots of history, castles and I have been a couple of times on business. We drove from Colmar to Penrith in a day.
July and August are busy so best avoided imho.
Mountain Passes are great but don’t underestimate how long it takes to drive and also it can become a bit of chore after a few days of them so spread it out.
Go on one of the Mountain Coasters really enjoyed them and maybe an ice cave.
Loads of places for wild swimming if that’s your thing.
I prefer Austria and the Dolomites but the Swiss Alps are amazing.
The last time I drove to Italy was in 2015 from London. Whilst it was July, I found the queues in Switzerland very tiring both ways and vowed to use an alternative route on future trips.
The Italian lakes however are well worth visiting. I would stay in France for as long as possible before crossing into Italy.
The Italian lakes however are well worth visiting. I would stay in France for as long as possible before crossing into Italy.
Did this last year. 981 GTS.
We went via Stuttgart, crossing into Switzerland via Thangyen.
Down to Andermatt but via Grimsel, Neufen and Gottard. The following morning (a Monday) we set off before 9 and did Furka E to W and then Grimsel again but S to N. Susten W to E and back to Andermatt to complete the figure of 8 and take the Oberlap East towards and onto Fluela and Offen. Umbrail to Stelvio (looked at it only) before heading down to Bormio where we stopped for 2 nights in an amazing thermal spa hotel (QC Therme). 10 hrs ish with stops, long day but we knew we had some down time after.
Italian lakes after that. Garda and then Como. Both spectacular but latter was nicer imo.
We stayed at a place called Hotel Lumin, Cremia when at Como. Amazing place. Great parking too. Menardo when at Garda. Hotel was a bit meh there but the town was very nice.
We went further south to Monaco and then back up through France via Annecy. Mid July. 12 days all in. 3k miles.
Enjoy!
We went via Stuttgart, crossing into Switzerland via Thangyen.
Down to Andermatt but via Grimsel, Neufen and Gottard. The following morning (a Monday) we set off before 9 and did Furka E to W and then Grimsel again but S to N. Susten W to E and back to Andermatt to complete the figure of 8 and take the Oberlap East towards and onto Fluela and Offen. Umbrail to Stelvio (looked at it only) before heading down to Bormio where we stopped for 2 nights in an amazing thermal spa hotel (QC Therme). 10 hrs ish with stops, long day but we knew we had some down time after.
Italian lakes after that. Garda and then Como. Both spectacular but latter was nicer imo.
We stayed at a place called Hotel Lumin, Cremia when at Como. Amazing place. Great parking too. Menardo when at Garda. Hotel was a bit meh there but the town was very nice.
We went further south to Monaco and then back up through France via Annecy. Mid July. 12 days all in. 3k miles.
Enjoy!
Edited by SapperD on Saturday 25th May 11:25
Gassing Station | Holidays & Travel | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff