Gay Marriage Set to Unhinge Tories?
Discussion
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9843165/G...
Interesting choice, placate the bigots or lose power
Interesting choice, placate the bigots or lose power
On a quick skim of that article, it only says that 20% of voters who voted Tory last time won't vote Tory next time. What it doesn't mention is how many people will vote Tory next time who didn't vote Tory last time as a result of Gay Marriage.
Either way, this seems to me to be a fairly principled stance from Cameron; I think he believes this is the right thing to do and he's going to push it through. I like that in a politician.
Either way, this seems to me to be a fairly principled stance from Cameron; I think he believes this is the right thing to do and he's going to push it through. I like that in a politician.
davepoth said:
On a quick skim of that article, it only says that 20% of voters who voted Tory last time won't vote Tory next time. What it doesn't mention is how many people will vote Tory next time who didn't vote Tory last time as a result of Gay Marriage.
Either way, this seems to me to be a fairly principled stance from Cameron; I think he believes this is the right thing to do and he's going to push it through. I like that in a politician.
I suspect Sir Humphrey would describe it as a brave decision. There seems to be a 3 way split - the end of the civilised world/meh/howling.Either way, this seems to me to be a fairly principled stance from Cameron; I think he believes this is the right thing to do and he's going to push it through. I like that in a politician.
Interesting to see how it pans out.
s2art said:
They have made a rod for their own backs here. The problem of equating gay marriage with traditional marriage is that many of the old 'rules' about marriage become questionable. What constitutes 'consummation'?
Performing a sexually penetrative act with your spouse. Easy for gay men, obviously needs tools for gay women, but still entirely possible. It's probably worth mentioning that consummation is usually by opinion more than anything - if both of the couple consider the relationship consummated, it probably would be. The judge doesn't have to watch.s2art said:
What constitutes adultery?
Having sex with someone else, usually. The history of adultery is replete with cases of people having sex with someone of the same gender being adultery, so it's not really a bar. 
I think there is a problem with what is meant by 'allowing' gay marriage. Most of the anti brigade seem to be suggesting that churches will be obliged to perform ceremonies. Certainly a conversation I had with acquaintances showed that the 'fact' that churches would be obliged to perform the ceremonies has been 'confirmed' by vicars or priests (not sure which).
Once the law is a reality then people realise nothing has changed I think the 20% will be somewhat less.
Further, with priests saying even to consider gay marriage means everyone would be condemned to hell means that many would feel obliged to threaten to vote against the tories. When it is a choice between tory and anyone else for the religious in middle England I doubt there would be much doubt as to which way they'd vote.
Popes won't tell their parishioners to vote against the tories just in case they listen.
Once the law is a reality then people realise nothing has changed I think the 20% will be somewhat less.
Further, with priests saying even to consider gay marriage means everyone would be condemned to hell means that many would feel obliged to threaten to vote against the tories. When it is a choice between tory and anyone else for the religious in middle England I doubt there would be much doubt as to which way they'd vote.
Popes won't tell their parishioners to vote against the tories just in case they listen.
Edited by Derek Smith on Saturday 2nd February 17:45
Terminator X said:
Not a fan of it myself, why change it just cos the minority are howling? Every decision in life has consequences and one associated with being gay is simply that you can't get married. Dare I suggest you just get over it ...
TX.
Not sure being gay is a 'decision' as such, any more than being black, being female or being left handed. One would not, I assume, suggest to someone who is short that they cannot marry and should get over it, it being extremely difficult for anyone short to get over a lot of things.TX.
MI.
Derek Smith said:
Not sure being gay is a 'decision' as such, any more than being black, being female or being left handed. One would not, I assume, suggest to someone who is short that they cannot marry and should get over it, it being extremely difficult for anyone short to get over a lot of things.
MI.
At least sense has been seen here in that we don't change the british standards for everything just to make it possible for them.MI.
davepoth said:
I would guess that he is suggesting that legalising gay marriage and making it illegal for churches to discriminate by not marrying gay people is a breach of the human rights of those religious groups who would say that gay people will burn in hell.
God made gay people. He also made bigots. And gay bigots. At least he/she/it/they has/have a sense of humour.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff