996 Turbo or GT3?
Discussion
I had originally decided that when I change my 996 C2 later this year I would get a 996 Turbo. It seemed to make sense: I'd get a lot more torque and power without losing the essential character of the 996 (which I like a lot).
However, after reading a lot of reviews and posts by owners, I'm wondering if it's the right car for me.
My car history is littered with boosted, mega-torque Audis and Mercedes. The acceleration of these cars was thrilling but they were ultimately unsatisfying (which is why I didn't keep any of them for very long) and in some cases, e.g. the modified RS6 I had before the Porsche, just too quick to use properly on public roads.
My C2 delivers a level of feedback and agility that put my old uber-barges to shame but it's sorely lacking in torque.
I like good acceleration but I don't drive at high speeds. I'm concerned that a 996 Turbo would be wasted on me - I've heard a lot of owners say that you end up travelling much faster than you realise.
I was chatting with Paul at Northway about this and he said that the 996 GT3 might be a better car for me because it makes you feel like you're travelling faster than you are, and it's a lot more involving and communicative than a Turbo.
Sorry - this has turned into such a rambling post.
I'm fully expecting to be told to shut up, drive them both and make my own mind up... but this is a discussion forum after all and I'd be very interested to hear everyone's thoughts, particularly those of people who've driven or owned both.
However, after reading a lot of reviews and posts by owners, I'm wondering if it's the right car for me.
My car history is littered with boosted, mega-torque Audis and Mercedes. The acceleration of these cars was thrilling but they were ultimately unsatisfying (which is why I didn't keep any of them for very long) and in some cases, e.g. the modified RS6 I had before the Porsche, just too quick to use properly on public roads.
My C2 delivers a level of feedback and agility that put my old uber-barges to shame but it's sorely lacking in torque.
I like good acceleration but I don't drive at high speeds. I'm concerned that a 996 Turbo would be wasted on me - I've heard a lot of owners say that you end up travelling much faster than you realise.
I was chatting with Paul at Northway about this and he said that the 996 GT3 might be a better car for me because it makes you feel like you're travelling faster than you are, and it's a lot more involving and communicative than a Turbo.
Sorry - this has turned into such a rambling post.
I'm fully expecting to be told to shut up, drive them both and make my own mind up... but this is a discussion forum after all and I'd be very interested to hear everyone's thoughts, particularly those of people who've driven or owned both.
Do you find that you end up going faster than you thought you were because the Turbo makes it so easy to do so?
I've had a succession of cars that could get me to the wrong side of three figures with very little effort. I can't help thinking that I wouldn't have sold them on so quickly if that had been what I was ultimately looking for...
I've had a succession of cars that could get me to the wrong side of three figures with very little effort. I can't help thinking that I wouldn't have sold them on so quickly if that had been what I was ultimately looking for...
Not sure. I mean, acceleration is not lacking, so getting up to "faster" is not a problem!
What I mean by feeling safer is that you can put down a shedload more power without the slightest of theatrics in the Turbo than in the MX-5!
It's not a car for putting the tail out sideways in. I try, but only on some hairpins do I get a hint of lateral movement and squeal.
What I mean by feeling safer is that you can put down a shedload more power without the slightest of theatrics in the Turbo than in the MX-5!
It's not a car for putting the tail out sideways in. I try, but only on some hairpins do I get a hint of lateral movement and squeal.
I don't think I tend to drive faster than I realise, however - it is the first car I've owned where I've genuinely thought it was unnecessarily fast for UK roads. Didn't stop me getting it mapped, but that just shows we're all illogical about cars.
Based on your comments, it does sound like GT3 might be more suitable. The turbo is fun when you floor it - but you can't do that for very long without reaching very silly speeds very quickly. I think I'd find a car with 150bhp less quick enough 99% of the time. In fact, I had a 348 side by side with the turbo for about 18 months - much slower (about 964 performance) but much more involving and much much more fun.
Based on your comments, it does sound like GT3 might be more suitable. The turbo is fun when you floor it - but you can't do that for very long without reaching very silly speeds very quickly. I think I'd find a car with 150bhp less quick enough 99% of the time. In fact, I had a 348 side by side with the turbo for about 18 months - much slower (about 964 performance) but much more involving and much much more fun.
To quote the same old saying - you need to drive both. They have a similar top speed.
The GT3 wont have the same torque as the turbo and the suspension will feel much stiffer.
There is a trade off between driver comfort and direct feedback.
The turbo is probably a better mile muncher but a GT3 will awaken your senses and has a superb sound.
The GT3 wont have the same torque as the turbo and the suspension will feel much stiffer.
There is a trade off between driver comfort and direct feedback.
The turbo is probably a better mile muncher but a GT3 will awaken your senses and has a superb sound.
Really difficult one to answer, and only you can really decide.
FWIW, I owned a turbo for 2 years and loved it. Never once did I wish I was in a GT3.
The turbo has a wider repertoire whereas the GT3 is a bit more focussed, but do not let anyone tell you (especially non-owner forum warriors) that the turbo is in any way numb. It is most definitely not. It's all relative. Compared to 99% of cars on the road, the 996 turbo (and all other 911's) are full of steering feel and handling balance.
I remember my first few weeks into turbo ownership thinking the car was a bit 'nervous' but gradually came to realise it is simply feedback overload, and completely different to most other cars on the road. It just feels 'alive'.
FWIW, I owned a turbo for 2 years and loved it. Never once did I wish I was in a GT3.
The turbo has a wider repertoire whereas the GT3 is a bit more focussed, but do not let anyone tell you (especially non-owner forum warriors) that the turbo is in any way numb. It is most definitely not. It's all relative. Compared to 99% of cars on the road, the 996 turbo (and all other 911's) are full of steering feel and handling balance.
I remember my first few weeks into turbo ownership thinking the car was a bit 'nervous' but gradually came to realise it is simply feedback overload, and completely different to most other cars on the road. It just feels 'alive'.
Edited by monthefish on Friday 31st May 12:50
It is horses for courses and depends what you want the car for. Reading between your lines I would say you'd be better off with a GT3. FWIW I had a 996 Turbo S, sold it after 6 months, now have 996 GT3 Mk 1 (road) and 996 GT3 Mk 2 (track)!
Turbo just wasn't for me. Loved the power delivery, but IMO it lacked engagement and was rather one dimensional once you got past the rush on boost. I know people who absolutely love them though and won't have anything else.
On the flip side GT3s are great, but I think I'd struggle with one as a daily. Awesome for track / weekend though. Real drivers car and that engine is immense.
Have fun on the search!
Cheers
Slodge
Turbo just wasn't for me. Loved the power delivery, but IMO it lacked engagement and was rather one dimensional once you got past the rush on boost. I know people who absolutely love them though and won't have anything else.
On the flip side GT3s are great, but I think I'd struggle with one as a daily. Awesome for track / weekend though. Real drivers car and that engine is immense.
Have fun on the search!
Cheers
Slodge
Thanks for the replies so far.
This car wouldn't be a daily driver: weekends and days out only.
davek_964 said:
Based on your comments, it does sound like GT3 might be more suitable. The turbo is fun when you floor it - but you can't do that for very long without reaching very silly speeds very quickly. I think I'd find a car with 150bhp less quick enough 99% of the time. In fact, I had a 348 side by side with the turbo for about 18 months - much slower (about 964 performance) but much more involving and much much more fun.
This is exactly what I found with my old RS4 and RS6: they reached daft speeds far too quickly which rendered their performance a bit pointless. Most journeys ended up being very frustrating.Pugley said:
a GT3 will awaken your senses and has a superb sound.
monthefish said:
Really difficult one to answer, and only you can really decide.
FWIW, I owned a turbo for 2 years and loved it. Never once did I wish I was in a GT3.
The turbo has a wider repertoire whereas the GT3 is a bit more focussed, but do not let anyone tell you (especially non-owner forum warriors) that the turbo is in any way numb. It is most definitely not. It's all relative. Compared to 99% of cars on the road, the 996 turbo (and all other 911's) are full of steering feel and handling balance.
I remember my first few weeks into turbo ownership thinking the car was a bit 'nervous' but gradually came to realise it is simply feedback overload, and completely different to most other cars on the road. It just feels 'alive'.
That's very interesting. If the Turbo feels as alive off-boost as my C2 then it's going to be a very tempting proposition indeed.FWIW, I owned a turbo for 2 years and loved it. Never once did I wish I was in a GT3.
The turbo has a wider repertoire whereas the GT3 is a bit more focussed, but do not let anyone tell you (especially non-owner forum warriors) that the turbo is in any way numb. It is most definitely not. It's all relative. Compared to 99% of cars on the road, the 996 turbo (and all other 911's) are full of steering feel and handling balance.
I remember my first few weeks into turbo ownership thinking the car was a bit 'nervous' but gradually came to realise it is simply feedback overload, and completely different to most other cars on the road. It just feels 'alive'.
slodge said:
It is horses for courses and depends what you want the car for. Reading between your lines I would say you'd be better off with a GT3. FWIW I had a 996 Turbo S, sold it after 6 months, now have 996 GT3 Mk 1 (road) and 996 GT3 Mk 2 (track)!
Turbo just wasn't for me. Loved the power delivery, but IMO it lacked engagement and was rather one dimensional once you got past the rush on boost. I know people who absolutely love them though and won't have anything else.
On the flip side GT3s are great, but I think I'd struggle with one as a daily. Awesome for track / weekend though. Real drivers car and that engine is immense.
Have fun on the search!
Cheers
Slodge
You own two?! That's just greedy. Sell one to me. Turbo just wasn't for me. Loved the power delivery, but IMO it lacked engagement and was rather one dimensional once you got past the rush on boost. I know people who absolutely love them though and won't have anything else.
On the flip side GT3s are great, but I think I'd struggle with one as a daily. Awesome for track / weekend though. Real drivers car and that engine is immense.
Have fun on the search!
Cheers
Slodge
This car wouldn't be a daily driver: weekends and days out only.
Edited by BillTheButcher on Friday 31st May 13:09
BillTheButcher said:
You own two?! That's just greedy. Sell one to me.
This car wouldn't be a daily driver: weekends and days out only.
I think one will have to go at some point, but I'm enjoying having both right now! Mine are quite different to drive, albeit in subtle ways.This car wouldn't be a daily driver: weekends and days out only.
Edited by BillTheButcher on Friday 31st May 13:09
I've not driven one, but what about a GT2? RWD + Turbo. RPM T have a nice one ATM, saw it yesterday and looks lovely in the flesh!
BillTheButcher said:
This car wouldn't be a daily driver: weekends and days out only.
Much as I like my turbo, I wouldn't really want it as a weekend / occasional day car. I don't think it's special enough. Ironically, though - mine is now.Edited by BillTheButcher on Friday 31st May 13:09
In my 3.5 years of ownership it was my daily car for the first 3 years and did a very good job of that. However, for personal reasons I needed a more practical car at the start of this year and decided to give the Cayenne a try. That has now become my daily, which means that the turbo is now an occasional sunny day car - and it isn't really my choice for that.
My need for the Cayenne has now passed, so I could simply sell it and go back to using the turbo. But I actually find it better as a daily - especially in poor weather, and particularly over winter. So I may decide to get shot of the turbo and buy something less practical as the weekend car - probably Italian again. But for various reasons, that is unlikely to be this year.
slodge said:
I think one will have to go at some point, but I'm enjoying having both right now! Mine are quite different to drive, albeit in subtle ways.
I'll be ready to buy in September. I think that would be a great time of year for you to calm down a bit and reduce your fleet by one. slodge said:
I've not driven one, but what about a GT2? RWD + Turbo. RPM T have a nice one ATM, saw it yesterday and looks lovely in the flesh!
I'd love a GT2 but if the Turbo can reach stupid speeds too quickly, won't the GT2 be even worse?!Hiya,
Like I said I am no expert on GT2, never driven one, but I would have thought with 2 wheel drive and the same turbo power you'd have to be on your toes more, be more involved, probably can't go as fast on B roads etc etc whereas you can take some real liberties with a turbo and fly along at triple digit speeds!
Hopefully someone with experience of GT2s will be along soon, but for a weekend hoon machine IMO you won't be disappointed with a GT3 of any flavour.
Cheers
Slodge
Like I said I am no expert on GT2, never driven one, but I would have thought with 2 wheel drive and the same turbo power you'd have to be on your toes more, be more involved, probably can't go as fast on B roads etc etc whereas you can take some real liberties with a turbo and fly along at triple digit speeds!
Hopefully someone with experience of GT2s will be along soon, but for a weekend hoon machine IMO you won't be disappointed with a GT3 of any flavour.
Cheers
Slodge
davek_964 said:
BillTheButcher said:
This car wouldn't be a daily driver: weekends and days out only.
Much as I like my turbo, I wouldn't really want it as a weekend / occasional day car. I don't think it's special enough. 
Again, it's all relative.
If your daily driver is a 997 Carrera, a 997 GT3 isn't really going to feel that special.
If your daily driver is a Mondeo, a 997 Carrera is going to feel pretty special.
BillTheButcher said:
monthefish said:
Mine was.
Again, it's all relative.
If your daily driver is a 997 Carrera, a 997 GT3 isn't really going to feel that special.
If your daily driver is a Mondeo, a 997 Carrera is going to feel pretty special.
My daily driver (my girlfriend's car) is a 1.6 Skoda Fabia. Again, it's all relative.
If your daily driver is a 997 Carrera, a 997 GT3 isn't really going to feel that special.
If your daily driver is a Mondeo, a 997 Carrera is going to feel pretty special.
...but getting into this was always an event.
You might be better looking at a 996 Turbo at the moment there is a much wider choice out there so you can seek out the best one you can for the price you want to pay.
996 GT3 Very small pickings at the moment for sale people seem to be hanging onto good ones. Ones that are up for grabs are probably not the best examples or very expensive for the good ones.
Maybe this is a sign of things to come good well looked after examples might command a higher price as theres so few around for sale.
But if your willing to pay a decent price for a good GT3 you wont be disapointed.
i think its better to pay a bit more and get a good one in my opinion no such thing as a cheap GT3 if its cheap theres a reason.
996 GT3 Very small pickings at the moment for sale people seem to be hanging onto good ones. Ones that are up for grabs are probably not the best examples or very expensive for the good ones.
Maybe this is a sign of things to come good well looked after examples might command a higher price as theres so few around for sale.
But if your willing to pay a decent price for a good GT3 you wont be disapointed.
i think its better to pay a bit more and get a good one in my opinion no such thing as a cheap GT3 if its cheap theres a reason.
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