caught at 85mph,prosecuted for103mph.This stinks !!!
Discussion
Mr_annie_vxr said:
3doorPete said:
More and more penalties...... little plate and don't stop.
Indeed. Make it worse for yourself and engage in some dangerous riding to escape. See if you can re-enforce the negative stereotypes that people already have of bikers. Or just be sensible about your riding, ride your own ride and not the ride of those about you and don't race other bikers on public roads.
It is still more possible than ever to have safe fun rides and not put yourself at risk of prosecution or worse.
Will the next step be that the lead rider goes through a set of traffic lights on green.
The lights change to red and a trailing rider decides to run the red light, in an attempt to keep up.
If he / she gets prosecuted, will they then try and put some blame on the leading biker?
We all ride our own ride and so should be responsible for our own actions.
If we are riding as a group at the speed limit and a few bikers are trailing and they then decide to speed up to catch up, how is it the leader's fault? Quite often the lead biker can't even see the last rider, especially at night when all that you can see are headlights etc.
The lights change to red and a trailing rider decides to run the red light, in an attempt to keep up.
If he / she gets prosecuted, will they then try and put some blame on the leading biker?
We all ride our own ride and so should be responsible for our own actions.
If we are riding as a group at the speed limit and a few bikers are trailing and they then decide to speed up to catch up, how is it the leader's fault? Quite often the lead biker can't even see the last rider, especially at night when all that you can see are headlights etc.
I have said it once and I will say it again, police are out to get us as easy targets and we make it easier by hurtling down relatively straight roads which are easy targets for the speed gun brigade.
My advice is buy a Supermoto and prat about on roads the police do not even know exist, the buzz of whizzing down a narrow bumpy road is the same as a high speed blat on a sports bike.
You have more chance of risk in meeting some real farmyard animals than the ones with blue flashing lights and a siren.
This probably also explains the sudden increase in "I want an Enduro bike" threads recently but the government is now trying to stop our fun there by closing BOATS all over the place.
My advice is buy a Supermoto and prat about on roads the police do not even know exist, the buzz of whizzing down a narrow bumpy road is the same as a high speed blat on a sports bike.
You have more chance of risk in meeting some real farmyard animals than the ones with blue flashing lights and a siren.
This probably also explains the sudden increase in "I want an Enduro bike" threads recently but the government is now trying to stop our fun there by closing BOATS all over the place.
pozi said:
This probably also explains the sudden increase in "I want an Enduro bike" threads recently
Sold the GSXR Thou (and a 650 SM) and currently have a WR450F in the garage and £££ in the bank, and am having a LOT more f-u-n riding the WR (legally) and not watching the speedo all the time.
This is arse.
Its a Mickey Mouse ruling for a mickey mouse offence.
In the real world, you dont stop if possible, if not you dont stop for a member of your group getting pulled and if he is, everyone denies all knowledge of everyone and everything.
Say nothing until its proved etc etc
The guy on the tail end of our group got puilled once. He got done for 90 in a 70, was questioned on who we were, denied any knowlesge of our existence and went home.
We never even found out will we got to the first stop and rang to see where he was.
Its a Mickey Mouse ruling for a mickey mouse offence.
In the real world, you dont stop if possible, if not you dont stop for a member of your group getting pulled and if he is, everyone denies all knowledge of everyone and everything.
Say nothing until its proved etc etc
The guy on the tail end of our group got puilled once. He got done for 90 in a 70, was questioned on who we were, denied any knowlesge of our existence and went home.
We never even found out will we got to the first stop and rang to see where he was.
C8PPO said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
It is still more possible than ever to have safe fun rides and not put yourself at risk of prosecution or worse.
In which country?If however your going to get yourself wrapped up in a 'race' on the roads or too involved in others driving that you start not paying the attention you need to, then you have only yourself to blame.
I think it is easier that ever not to get caught speeding. Its all about paying attention.
Mr_annie_vxr said:
C8PPO said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
It is still more possible than ever to have safe fun rides and not put yourself at risk of prosecution or worse.
In which country?If however your going to get yourself wrapped up in a 'race' on the roads or too involved in others driving that you start not paying the attention you need to, then you have only yourself to blame.
I think it is easier that ever not to get caught speeding. Its all about paying attention.
I saw this thread earlier on, but I wanted to check a few details before I joined in.
A couple of my riding friends got caught along the same piece of road at the same place (Rogate) and were charged with exactly the same thing; The leading rider was charged with exactly the same speed as the second person.
From what I remember about his case he got all the evidence including film footage -from the following unmarked bike- and realised that there just wasn't enough evidence to charge him with the same offence. He had his day in court and with his solicitor manged to fight back and only end up with 3 points for doing 50 in a 40. He knew he was guilty of that and admitted that bit.
I know he didn't get away scot-free, but he was originally looking at a ban and a heavier fine for something that just couldn't be proven. (Something the second biker didn't manage to avoid.)
Part of his email to me says.... 'Solicitors fee cost me 1 grand...... My case went to court and was adjorned as soon as the solicitor pleaded not guilty. After the adjournment the solicitor bargained the CPS from 96 in a 60 to 50 in a 40. In the section of the video where I was alledgedly doing 96 I was a long way ahead of Neil, so there was no way of telling what speed I was doing. Pleaded guilty to 50, got 3 points and £60 fine.'
A couple of my riding friends got caught along the same piece of road at the same place (Rogate) and were charged with exactly the same thing; The leading rider was charged with exactly the same speed as the second person.
From what I remember about his case he got all the evidence including film footage -from the following unmarked bike- and realised that there just wasn't enough evidence to charge him with the same offence. He had his day in court and with his solicitor manged to fight back and only end up with 3 points for doing 50 in a 40. He knew he was guilty of that and admitted that bit.
I know he didn't get away scot-free, but he was originally looking at a ban and a heavier fine for something that just couldn't be proven. (Something the second biker didn't manage to avoid.)
Part of his email to me says.... 'Solicitors fee cost me 1 grand...... My case went to court and was adjorned as soon as the solicitor pleaded not guilty. After the adjournment the solicitor bargained the CPS from 96 in a 60 to 50 in a 40. In the section of the video where I was alledgedly doing 96 I was a long way ahead of Neil, so there was no way of telling what speed I was doing. Pleaded guilty to 50, got 3 points and £60 fine.'
HRG said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
C8PPO said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
It is still more possible than ever to have safe fun rides and not put yourself at risk of prosecution or worse.
In which country?If however your going to get yourself wrapped up in a 'race' on the roads or too involved in others driving that you start not paying the attention you need to, then you have only yourself to blame.
I think it is easier that ever not to get caught speeding. Its all about paying attention.
He was not on or under the limit.
Taken from another thread on MCN regarding the incident.....
At what point does a group of bikers riding change from a ride-out to a race?
I would normally be towards the back of the group, generally because I needed my licence for work!
Guys I rode with would do in excess of 60 in 30 limits (Chicksands to Bedford) which I just wouldnt do. Now I would be pissed if I got done for their speed, but in reality no-one is forcing you to ride excessively over the speed limit.
Post on MCN said:
Being one of the trio involved, all is not as clear as made out. Video evidence was very clear of all 3 bikes involved. I feel ken did not help himself in any way by taunting the police rider on various websites as he was only doing his job. We had also been followed for several miles and was very clear we were together as a group. The whole situation felt a bit dirty as it was an unmarked police r1 but we all commited the speeding offence, I would like to know what tree he picked the 85mph out of, as i and the other riders know we ALL did comitt the same offence. Myself pleaded guilty to the offence even thou i was rider number 2 because i knew i had broke the law and it is cheaper and easier to throw your hands up and say yes i did it! I received the same penalty points as Ken but my fine was sub £300 pounds and no solicitor fees. All without personal inconvience.
Not quite so clear cut?At what point does a group of bikers riding change from a ride-out to a race?
I would normally be towards the back of the group, generally because I needed my licence for work!
Guys I rode with would do in excess of 60 in 30 limits (Chicksands to Bedford) which I just wouldnt do. Now I would be pissed if I got done for their speed, but in reality no-one is forcing you to ride excessively over the speed limit.
Quinny said:
Years ago I was riding on the A5 by Llangollen on my Gpz900, and my next door neighbour at the time was with me on his Gpz1000... Anyway we'd been going pretty quick, nothing daft but we'd done a fair few overtakes... I was the lead...
Bike cop comes blasting past from nowhere, and demands we pull over... I figure he can't pull us both, and who did he want anyway??? so carry on..
Neighbour does the right thing and stops..
Result 6 points, 3 for speeding 3 for double whites....
I was sat at home having a cuppa by the time he turned up..... Not a happy camper... but fair do's he told the cop he had no idea who the other rider was...
Lucky for me, cos at the time I was on 9 points
Somtimes it pays not to be to co-operative
So as you were on 9 points anyway, why ride like a knobend and hope your mate lies to protect you ?Bike cop comes blasting past from nowhere, and demands we pull over... I figure he can't pull us both, and who did he want anyway??? so carry on..
Neighbour does the right thing and stops..
Result 6 points, 3 for speeding 3 for double whites....
I was sat at home having a cuppa by the time he turned up..... Not a happy camper... but fair do's he told the cop he had no idea who the other rider was...
Lucky for me, cos at the time I was on 9 points
Somtimes it pays not to be to co-operative
Mr_annie_vxr said:
HRG said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
C8PPO said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
It is still more possible than ever to have safe fun rides and not put yourself at risk of prosecution or worse.
In which country?If however your going to get yourself wrapped up in a 'race' on the roads or too involved in others driving that you start not paying the attention you need to, then you have only yourself to blame.
I think it is easier that ever not to get caught speeding. Its all about paying attention.
He was not on or under the limit.
Going out in a group of riders does not constitute a race as you imply. Just because I am in front of a group does not mean I am the leader, or I am winning. It purely means I am in front of others. Whenever we go out on a group ride, we do our own thing. Meeting up at designated points or sometimes the guy in front just pulls over somewhere. If the fourth or fifth rider gets held up for whatever reason, then what he does is his own choice, not the choice of anyone else.
The guy in the story was speeding, but the fines and points were based on what someone else had done.
How the hell can that be justice
Maybe you should go out and arrest Jonny chav for a mugging because you know his mate done one last week. GUILTY BY ASSOCIATION
TOPTON said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
HRG said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
C8PPO said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
It is still more possible than ever to have safe fun rides and not put yourself at risk of prosecution or worse.
In which country?If however your going to get yourself wrapped up in a 'race' on the roads or too involved in others driving that you start not paying the attention you need to, then you have only yourself to blame.
I think it is easier that ever not to get caught speeding. Its all about paying attention.
He was not on or under the limit.
Going out in a group of riders does not constitute a race as you imply. Just because I am in front of a group does not mean I am the leader, or I am winning. It purely means I am in front of others. Whenever we go out on a group ride, we do our own thing. Meeting up at designated points or sometimes the guy in front just pulls over somewhere. If the fourth or fifth rider gets held up for whatever reason, then what he does is his own choice, not the choice of anyone else.
The guy in the story was speeding, but the fines and points were based on what someone else had done.
How the hell can that be justice
Maybe you should go out and arrest Jonny chav for a mugging because you know his mate done one last week. GUILTY BY ASSOCIATION
No. I'm also not going to defend someone to the end of the earth when they are in the wrong and have been found so in a court of law. I'm also unlike you clearly a little more in the real world. He was travelling 25 mph at least over the limit. He was leading a group. The group if they wish to stay with him will set their pace to do so and in one case they were doing at least 43 mph over the limit to keep up.
Had he been sticking to the limit then no-one would have had to be so far over the limit to keep up. He set the pace no-one else.
I would arrest Jonny Chav if he was with his mate when he did the mugging.
Your analogy is not correct.
At no point have I said I agree with the outcome but I do understand the reasons behind it. I also like people to be annoyed about the right aspect of it. A number of posters have implied he was prosecuted for the 103, when in reality it is all just a badly written article written to draw you to that conclusion.
Like many articles in here it gets people all angry for the wrong reasons. Like the continual jailed for speeding offence articles. That are equally emotive but just as factually incorrect.
If you don't want to debate or get angry for the right reasons then feel free to ignore my posts. I don't force anyone to read them.
Gassing Station | Biker Banter | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff