Civic Type R (EP3) or Focus RS MK1?
Discussion
I like my Fords so may be a little biased...
Anyway, with the aim of being subjective...
The RS feels that bit more special than the TypeR. The RS has a more focused, detailed feel to it that the TypeR doesn't have.
The engine in the TypeR is its big positive and its big negative. Lacking in low down pull, but when you are giving it the beans, it truly is something else. The rest of the car perhaps the gear box aside, doesn't match the engine. It doesn't have a super sharp chassis to match the hard core engine... A miss matched car in my opinion.
The RS on the other hand seems to have everything in harmony with each other. The feel of a car thats been rolled out of a WRC workshop, the diff, engine, interior, suspension and styling all giving that impression.
The RS too is a little more unique than the TypeR. It has the detail over the TypeR, that makes it that much more of a different car to the base model.
I would say the RS would be a safer place money wise too. Both cars have a cult following though. However the EP3s that are saught after would be the JDM versions really... Watering down the appeal of the UK version, even if it is the latter (anniversary I think it was) model.
Real world both are very liveable with being hatch backs. The engine in the TypeR would come under criticism here, especially if used as a daily driver. The RS has a special feel even when you are driving it in traffic, the TypeR feels like a civic in traffic.
I would suggest driving them in differing conditions, that's the best way for you to decide.
I'm sure we would all be intrigued to hear what you have to say.
Anyway, with the aim of being subjective...
The RS feels that bit more special than the TypeR. The RS has a more focused, detailed feel to it that the TypeR doesn't have.
The engine in the TypeR is its big positive and its big negative. Lacking in low down pull, but when you are giving it the beans, it truly is something else. The rest of the car perhaps the gear box aside, doesn't match the engine. It doesn't have a super sharp chassis to match the hard core engine... A miss matched car in my opinion.
The RS on the other hand seems to have everything in harmony with each other. The feel of a car thats been rolled out of a WRC workshop, the diff, engine, interior, suspension and styling all giving that impression.
The RS too is a little more unique than the TypeR. It has the detail over the TypeR, that makes it that much more of a different car to the base model.
I would say the RS would be a safer place money wise too. Both cars have a cult following though. However the EP3s that are saught after would be the JDM versions really... Watering down the appeal of the UK version, even if it is the latter (anniversary I think it was) model.
Real world both are very liveable with being hatch backs. The engine in the TypeR would come under criticism here, especially if used as a daily driver. The RS has a special feel even when you are driving it in traffic, the TypeR feels like a civic in traffic.
I would suggest driving them in differing conditions, that's the best way for you to decide.
I'm sure we would all be intrigued to hear what you have to say.
ucb said:
Well I'm sure a regular Civic is a great everyday car. I find the CTR has a pretty hard ride, which is great if the road us smooth, but a PITA on UK roads. In fact I always thought the rear was overdamped and too stiff.
I absolutely agree with this; the EP3 gets very nervous on the rear once you start to really press on, far more so than any other FWD car I have driven. Plenty of people fit thicker rear anti-roll bars for some reason and I can only imagine it makes this trait even worse. Personally I think it would benefit from a reduction in diameter on the front ARB and certainly less damping on the rear.I'd love a Mk1 Focus RS, but even ropey high mileage ones are going for the price of an exceptionally good EP3.
Edited by Mr2Mike on Wednesday 30th May 23:50
Mr2Mike said:
I absolutely agree with this; the EP3 gets very nervous on the rear once you start to really press on, far more so than any other FWD car I have driven. Plenty of people fit thicker rear anti-roll bars for some reason and I can only imagine it makes this trait even worse. Personally I think it would benefit from a reduction in diameter on the front ARB and certainly less damping on the rear.
I'd love a Mk1 Focus RS, but even ropey high mileage ones are going for the price of an exceptionally good EP3.
I found it find on track, I assume that is where you got the back end to be 'nervous'?I'd love a Mk1 Focus RS, but even ropey high mileage ones are going for the price of an exceptionally good EP3.
Edited by Mr2Mike on Wednesday 30th May 23:50
Froomee said:
Having driven a Type-R all i can say is that they dont feel that fast and performance wise they sit between smaller hatches think Fiesta ST, Clio 172, etc and the bigger hatches Focus RS, Focus ST, Astra VXR,Seat Leon and the like.
At 100mph+ in a straight line drag race possibly, but on a track I wouldn't say so. The Civic is considerably lighter than the turbocharged cars.They're both good fun cars to drive on track, but it depends what you're going to be using it for. The Focus was made in limited numbers, so as long as it's kept low miles and in good condition it will go the same way as the Cosworths and be worth good money. The Civic won't.
Having said that, you're going to pay a lot less for the Civic, and it won't cost as much to run, and you won't be as worried about it, I should imagine.
If you're after a daily driver, I'd go for the Civic, if you're after a weekend toy that'll do 2,000miles a year, get the Focus.
Tyrewrecker said:
I found it find on track, I assume that is where you got the back end to be 'nervous'?
No, this is on the road I have driven or ridden almost every working day for 15 years. On some corners where my old Fiat Coupe 20VT felt absolutely planted and secure, the rear end of the Civic feels very unsettled and certainly doesn't inspire the same level confidence. In most aspects the handling is much sharper on the Civic, turn in is in a different league for example, but the rear end nervousness and the relatively early onset of understeer do spoil it slightly.Mr2Mike said:
No, this is on the road I have driven or ridden almost every working day for 15 years. On some corners where my old Fiat Coupe 20VT felt absolutely planted and secure, the rear end of the Civic feels very unsettled and certainly doesn't inspire the same level confidence. In most aspects the handling is much sharper on the Civic, turn in is in a different league for example, but the rear end nervousness and the relatively early onset of understeer do spoil it slightly.
A decent fast road geometry setup cures that to be honest. Makes the rear feel a lot more planted, and turn in becomes truly astounding. Froomee said:
Focus RS - Will suffer very little in depreciaiton, faster, cheaper to modify, looks better and i would say is generally a bit more special as others have said although i'm sure a decent one is a fair bit more expensive.
Having driven a Type-R all i can say is that they dont feel that fast and performance wise they sit between smaller hatches think Fiesta ST, Clio 172, etc and the bigger hatches Focus RS, Focus ST, Astra VXR,Seat Leon and the like. They also feel nearer the smaller hathces in terms of size too in my opinion.
On the other hand a Civic Type R with a bolt on supercharger is immensly fast if you decided to go down that route.
Or on the other hand, do a drag race with the Focus, Seat, and Astra and you will find the CTR within a nats bHaving driven a Type-R all i can say is that they dont feel that fast and performance wise they sit between smaller hatches think Fiesta ST, Clio 172, etc and the bigger hatches Focus RS, Focus ST, Astra VXR,Seat Leon and the like. They also feel nearer the smaller hathces in terms of size too in my opinion.
On the other hand a Civic Type R with a bolt on supercharger is immensly fast if you decided to go down that route.
k of the astra and side by side the others.If it's a CTR or RS, id say RS definatly, though the seats and steering wheel would get thrown out, what the hell were ford thinking.
There also not really compareable price wise, an EP3 is much cheaper.
Im with Dan, should be comparing to a DC5, and it's a better car IMO, though i prefer a n/A screamer than a turbo.
Both would be a good choice. Would say a DC5 interior is a million times nicer than a RS.
Round a track i remember the RS was only a tiny bit faster than a pre facelift EP3, so a DC5 should see one off.
Im with Dan, should be comparing to a DC5, and it's a better car IMO, though i prefer a n/A screamer than a turbo.
Both would be a good choice. Would say a DC5 interior is a million times nicer than a RS.
Round a track i remember the RS was only a tiny bit faster than a pre facelift EP3, so a DC5 should see one off.
Why does everyone say the type r is bomb proof?? believe me ive done enough repairs on them to know they are not.
The type 'r' is a good hot hatch that is quite reliable & is fun to drive although from my experiance they are sensitive to tyres & this massivley affects the way they drive also there seems to be some fast & some slow ones why this is i do not know. Performance wise unless spending a lot on mods its not even in the same ballpark as an Rs.
The Rs is a modern classic as others have stated partly due to it being a rarer car & also because of the Rs badge on it, love it or loath it the Rs badge will always give strong residuals & a near on obsessive following.
Ive had my Rs for over 6 years have covered ober 60k & yes it has gone wrong (only once requiring a recovery due to a 5 pence roll pin
) i have made some modifications to get it over 300bhp & its still been reliable & on a run will return over 30mpg without a problem.
The type 'r' is a good hot hatch that is quite reliable & is fun to drive although from my experiance they are sensitive to tyres & this massivley affects the way they drive also there seems to be some fast & some slow ones why this is i do not know. Performance wise unless spending a lot on mods its not even in the same ballpark as an Rs.
The Rs is a modern classic as others have stated partly due to it being a rarer car & also because of the Rs badge on it, love it or loath it the Rs badge will always give strong residuals & a near on obsessive following.
Ive had my Rs for over 6 years have covered ober 60k & yes it has gone wrong (only once requiring a recovery due to a 5 pence roll pin
) i have made some modifications to get it over 300bhp & its still been reliable & on a run will return over 30mpg without a problem. Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff