RE: Spotted: Volkswagen Passat W8 4Motion
Discussion
A fortnight on and nothing has broken although a minor few things have needed sorting. CD changer for £40, wiper blades for a tenner, etc. Some known about, some not but spending is peanuts so far. Starting is instant, no temperament issues and I'm very happy. I've only had one person look at the gearbox and the opinion is synchros, which doesn't square with the history around the clutch replacement. I have managed to avoid any crunches for 7 days in a row by driving around the issue and plan to continue to do this for the foreseeable future and then I'll make a decision about spending money on the car or moving it on. I'll change the gearbox oil as a worthwhile long shot/no harm anyway type job.
I want to be absolutely certain there are no nasties lurking to surface right after the gearbox is fixed. At the moment I'm not convinced I'd recoup my expenditure short term and can't really see the point of fixing the gearbox just for a new owner! The thing is, if I keep the car, I won't skimp on anything, so spending can mount up (for decent tyres, wheel refurb, etc). I'd rather get to the point where the tyres need replacing and then make the all or nothing decision.
The car drives as well as I would expect and the outright performance is better than I would expect. Repmobile TDs are hopelessly outpaced and the 4th>6th grunt is more than adequate. It certainly understeers (not badly) if you don't get the speed off in time but driven with forethought it's a very pleasant drive on fast sweepers. The tyres don't help but given that they have so much tread on them I will live them for now unless wet weather in the autumn highlights truly serious shortcomings. Got to emphasise though, it's not an R32 Golf, so it's not fair to criticise the car for failing to deliver something it was never designed to do.
I want to be absolutely certain there are no nasties lurking to surface right after the gearbox is fixed. At the moment I'm not convinced I'd recoup my expenditure short term and can't really see the point of fixing the gearbox just for a new owner! The thing is, if I keep the car, I won't skimp on anything, so spending can mount up (for decent tyres, wheel refurb, etc). I'd rather get to the point where the tyres need replacing and then make the all or nothing decision.
The car drives as well as I would expect and the outright performance is better than I would expect. Repmobile TDs are hopelessly outpaced and the 4th>6th grunt is more than adequate. It certainly understeers (not badly) if you don't get the speed off in time but driven with forethought it's a very pleasant drive on fast sweepers. The tyres don't help but given that they have so much tread on them I will live them for now unless wet weather in the autumn highlights truly serious shortcomings. Got to emphasise though, it's not an R32 Golf, so it's not fair to criticise the car for failing to deliver something it was never designed to do.
It may be for sale again. Cutting a long story short, I was waiting for a manual spares or repair car, pinch the gearbox from that and then break what was left. Well, I got the spares or repair car (saloon) but it was in such good nick apart from apparently unfixable problems that I decided to have a go at sorting it out. The problems are now fixed so I'm thinking of keeping it and moving the estate on. I'll make my mind up over Christmas and place an ad then (one of the cars will definitely be going) but if anyone's interested send me a pm. The car now lives not far from Chichester and has had a few bits done, like tyres and rear wheel bearings. The 'box is untouched and no different.
Oscar,
Is that 21.9 mpg an average MPG or your best?
I'm going to be in the market for something a bit different and estate shaped in March (after selling my 996) and, coupled with some youtube vids I'm pretty impressed by the W8 (even with the above).
Are the manual gearboxes unique to this car or are they used across the VAG range?
Is that 21.9 mpg an average MPG or your best?
I'm going to be in the market for something a bit different and estate shaped in March (after selling my 996) and, coupled with some youtube vids I'm pretty impressed by the W8 (even with the above).
Are the manual gearboxes unique to this car or are they used across the VAG range?
coanda said:
Oscar,
Is that 21.9 mpg an average MPG or your best?
I'm going to be in the market for something a bit different and estate shaped in March (after selling my 996) and, coupled with some youtube vids I'm pretty impressed by the W8 (even with the above).
Are the manual gearboxes unique to this car or are they used across the VAG range?
Not sure where 21.9mpg comes from. I see 21.2 in the ad which was auto-loaded when the ad was placed.Is that 21.9 mpg an average MPG or your best?
I'm going to be in the market for something a bit different and estate shaped in March (after selling my 996) and, coupled with some youtube vids I'm pretty impressed by the W8 (even with the above).
Are the manual gearboxes unique to this car or are they used across the VAG range?
In fact, I would say that 21.2mpg as an overall figure is pretty accurate. If you're cruising at an indicated 75mph in sixth (which is a lot less than half the speed this car will do when extended!) then the real time consumption indicated will be 27/28 mpg. The reality is that even a 200 mile mainly motorway journey will be punctuated with some use of the power available, gradients, idling, etc so I just think that if you can't live with 21mpg overall then the car isn't for you.
The six speed manual gearbox is an 01E which I believe was used in other VAG models, notably the RS4. I would be more concerned to ensure that a gearbox sourced from an Audi would mate directly to the W8 block. My intention, if it ever got that far, was either a straight swap with another W8 gearbox or a rebuild of the existing box. The labour cost for removal/refitting the gearbox would not exceed £600 (that's a quote from a top specialist) so you'd need to add the rebuild cost to that and you could see why I#be priced the car at £3K. There's only one other W8 wagon in the market at the moment. That has the same mileage, is the awful tiptronic, has a lower spec as is up for £5K.
I have another W8 with manual gearbox but it's too good to break for the box. I'm still on the lookout for another gearbox and if I get one I will fix the car in the ad and it will be back on the market for at least £5K.
Ok, I have now owned my W8 for nearly 6 months (auto saloon).
Its significantly quicker than I anticipated (ecu remap) and although not the quickest off the line- when its going it pulls like a freight train but is so refined. Rides more like a Jag than a VW and glides over even the worst roads.
I love the fact that the glovebox doubles up as fridge, the seats have five heating settings plus loads of other small cool things. Mine is an auto and the autobox is woeful. However slip it into sequential and its a different animal. Much better economy (up from 16-18mpg to approx 26 mpg) and thats using a heavy foot. It handles very well but I have never owned a 4wd before but it gives you so much confidence even in the snow. As previously stated in the worst weather its unstoppable.
I was intending to keep it for a year or so but even the wife loves it so for now its a keeper. Only 60k miles too.
Nothing needed doing as of yet, can be a tad noisy on initial start up but within five seconds she purrs.
Its significantly quicker than I anticipated (ecu remap) and although not the quickest off the line- when its going it pulls like a freight train but is so refined. Rides more like a Jag than a VW and glides over even the worst roads.
I love the fact that the glovebox doubles up as fridge, the seats have five heating settings plus loads of other small cool things. Mine is an auto and the autobox is woeful. However slip it into sequential and its a different animal. Much better economy (up from 16-18mpg to approx 26 mpg) and thats using a heavy foot. It handles very well but I have never owned a 4wd before but it gives you so much confidence even in the snow. As previously stated in the worst weather its unstoppable.
I was intending to keep it for a year or so but even the wife loves it so for now its a keeper. Only 60k miles too.
Nothing needed doing as of yet, can be a tad noisy on initial start up but within five seconds she purrs.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PASSAT-W8-4MOTION-ESTATE...
Looks like this could be had for little money. I used to walk past it everyday on my way to work in Bristol (in the same location as the ad photos), so assume it has been in the same ownership for some time. Not sure what these are worth and I assume they are dire on fuel - a rare old beast though that could come good with a recon box installed!
Looks like this could be had for little money. I used to walk past it everyday on my way to work in Bristol (in the same location as the ad photos), so assume it has been in the same ownership for some time. Not sure what these are worth and I assume they are dire on fuel - a rare old beast though that could come good with a recon box installed!
Well some time ago at work while quiet and hanging on the phone I was searching for a new toy and wanted something with a BIG engine.....as I do so few miles as ride a scooter into London every day and a car is used occasionally at week-ends....so MPG was not really an issue.
Scouting thorugh the ad`s came across a Black W8 Tiptronic Saloon with a blue leather interior...£2500 and only a few miles from me.
I remember being a test pilot many years ago when they fist came out and it was a blue estate at a VW dealers in Croydon......and do you know what that is all I can remember...not what it went like etc.....strange....but anyway.....
Went and had a look and drive and was suitably impressed. It needed to new tyres and tax was due to expire in a few months so got for £2200 :-)
Picked it up a few days later and have not looked back.
Interior blue was a bit odd....but have got used to it....................baby bro is in the trade and speaking to his freinds that as they sold so few of them 163 in the UK........128 manual and 35 tiptronic and these are figures got from VW themselves. Haven`t got the breakdown of estates and saloons.......so a rare beastie....................but I also got a original brochure and the colour scheme isn`t in this brochure but on good authority as so damn expensive they were selling so few (163 over several years) the dealers basically said what do you want and we will do it. It was so expensive as it was a test bed for the Phaeton. Checking on a tax registration web site there appear to be only 130 that have been taxed in the last year so becoming rarer and rarer.
I have heard of issues with gearboxes but seems to be manuals rather than tipronics.
Have had two front tyres recently......and also an oil change and that was a few £ as takes nearly 9 litres of oil.
I really do love it as it is so stealth........some people go on about 6 and bit to 60 for a manual and nearer 8 for auto....but when you don`t have to change gear so that silky smooth power delivery is great. Only recently going through the Dartford Tunnel some boy in his Aston DB7 Vantage was revving it so it sounded good in the tunnel.....but leaving the tunnel he booted it so I decided to follow him......and suddenly while still on his tail realised I was doing 120 so decided to slow down. It is so deceptively quick as so quite and smooth.
I am now a total convert..............to such an extent I am actively looking for an estate version to complete the set...how sad :-)
There were a few sold in Nothern Ireland as they were all used as Police Cars again as so stealth....so always a few for sale there but most have added holes for their kit.......probably have been suitably used/abused but properly serviced.
It does always give me a smile on my face when I think to myseflf that this is the only car in the world that has a W8 engine in :-)
Scouting thorugh the ad`s came across a Black W8 Tiptronic Saloon with a blue leather interior...£2500 and only a few miles from me.
I remember being a test pilot many years ago when they fist came out and it was a blue estate at a VW dealers in Croydon......and do you know what that is all I can remember...not what it went like etc.....strange....but anyway.....
Went and had a look and drive and was suitably impressed. It needed to new tyres and tax was due to expire in a few months so got for £2200 :-)
Picked it up a few days later and have not looked back.
Interior blue was a bit odd....but have got used to it....................baby bro is in the trade and speaking to his freinds that as they sold so few of them 163 in the UK........128 manual and 35 tiptronic and these are figures got from VW themselves. Haven`t got the breakdown of estates and saloons.......so a rare beastie....................but I also got a original brochure and the colour scheme isn`t in this brochure but on good authority as so damn expensive they were selling so few (163 over several years) the dealers basically said what do you want and we will do it. It was so expensive as it was a test bed for the Phaeton. Checking on a tax registration web site there appear to be only 130 that have been taxed in the last year so becoming rarer and rarer.
I have heard of issues with gearboxes but seems to be manuals rather than tipronics.
Have had two front tyres recently......and also an oil change and that was a few £ as takes nearly 9 litres of oil.
I really do love it as it is so stealth........some people go on about 6 and bit to 60 for a manual and nearer 8 for auto....but when you don`t have to change gear so that silky smooth power delivery is great. Only recently going through the Dartford Tunnel some boy in his Aston DB7 Vantage was revving it so it sounded good in the tunnel.....but leaving the tunnel he booted it so I decided to follow him......and suddenly while still on his tail realised I was doing 120 so decided to slow down. It is so deceptively quick as so quite and smooth.
I am now a total convert..............to such an extent I am actively looking for an estate version to complete the set...how sad :-)
There were a few sold in Nothern Ireland as they were all used as Police Cars again as so stealth....so always a few for sale there but most have added holes for their kit.......probably have been suitably used/abused but properly serviced.
It does always give me a smile on my face when I think to myseflf that this is the only car in the world that has a W8 engine in :-)
Edited by VIRTUALALAN on Tuesday 25th June 11:46
As of Friday I became the proud owner of the W8 featured in the original article.
For exactly the reasons stated
I'm "bloody-minded enough to champion a car ‘just because’ " and it is indeed "a fascinating folly"
So far I've driven about 300 miles in it, and I'm really enjoying it.
Compared to my previous car (Alfa 156GTA) it's less overtly sporty which makes it more relaxing to drive, especially on the motorway. At motorway speed there's no issue with listening to the stereo and having a conversation. Doing either one of those was difficult in the Alfa.
Obviously it's a different type of car, so not necessarily right to compare but after 4 years of Alfa ownership it's the differences which stand out.
From the lights you make a choice of either smooth or fast get away, try to give it too much and it can lurch away, which doesn't sit with the character of the car. Better to get it moving then - when you're in second or third - then just let the momentum build.
On the way back from collecting the car a Boxster owner raced away from the lights, only to be very surprised as an unassuming, old Passat estate wafted past. Thoroughly enjoyable.
Economy is on a par with the Alfa which is fine. The bonus is the size of the tank, I was quite startled at the pump on Friday as the litres...and pounds continued rolling upwards. The benefit is convenience though. I make regular trips to Nottingham and a car that gets me there and back with some journeys while I'm up there on one tank is a real bonus.
Inside the car certainly belies its age, it's light, airy and very comfortable (Recaros all round) The user interface for the CD / Sat Nav is a bit clunky, but for the most part I'll just be playing CDs. The quality (and volume) of the stereo / speakers is excellent.
For exactly the reasons stated
I'm "bloody-minded enough to champion a car ‘just because’ " and it is indeed "a fascinating folly"
So far I've driven about 300 miles in it, and I'm really enjoying it.
Compared to my previous car (Alfa 156GTA) it's less overtly sporty which makes it more relaxing to drive, especially on the motorway. At motorway speed there's no issue with listening to the stereo and having a conversation. Doing either one of those was difficult in the Alfa.
Obviously it's a different type of car, so not necessarily right to compare but after 4 years of Alfa ownership it's the differences which stand out.
From the lights you make a choice of either smooth or fast get away, try to give it too much and it can lurch away, which doesn't sit with the character of the car. Better to get it moving then - when you're in second or third - then just let the momentum build.
On the way back from collecting the car a Boxster owner raced away from the lights, only to be very surprised as an unassuming, old Passat estate wafted past. Thoroughly enjoyable.
Economy is on a par with the Alfa which is fine. The bonus is the size of the tank, I was quite startled at the pump on Friday as the litres...and pounds continued rolling upwards. The benefit is convenience though. I make regular trips to Nottingham and a car that gets me there and back with some journeys while I'm up there on one tank is a real bonus.
Inside the car certainly belies its age, it's light, airy and very comfortable (Recaros all round) The user interface for the CD / Sat Nav is a bit clunky, but for the most part I'll just be playing CDs. The quality (and volume) of the stereo / speakers is excellent.
I really like the idea of the engine and all that but other than the cylinder layout then what is so special about the engine? Is it smoother or more economical than a V8? More torque? Because 21mpg seems a bit lame, seven seconds-ish to sixty doesn't seem that fast, 'nose heavy/non-inspiring handling' doesn't either. Seems to me like dropping a potentially interesting engine into a car that isn't really set up to benefit from it. I guess it'll probably storm down the Autobahn at a fair old clip, but unless you are planning on spending a bit of time in Germany I can't see it being all that useful here! Or can someone make a convincing argument in favour?
These cars will be a write off as soon as you get an engine issue. It is only a matter of time according to the VW technicians who rebuilt my old one at 45k. The shocking reliability and high VW parts prices made these a daft purchase back when mine was worth £8k. Now the cars are only worth a few grand they become an insane purchase imo.
vsonix said:
I really like the idea of the engine and all that but other than the cylinder layout then what is so special about the engine? Is it smoother or more economical than a V8? More torque? Because 21mpg seems a bit lame, seven seconds-ish to sixty doesn't seem that fast, 'nose heavy/non-inspiring handling' doesn't either. Seems to me like dropping a potentially interesting engine into a car that isn't really set up to benefit from it. I guess it'll probably storm down the Autobahn at a fair old clip, but unless you are planning on spending a bit of time in Germany I can't see it being all that useful here! Or can someone make a convincing argument in favour?
There's nothing special about the engine other than the layout; it's more compact than a traditional V8, so you can squash it into the nose of a Passat.k-ink said:
These cars will be a write off as soon as you get an engine issue. It is only a matter of time according to the VW technicians who rebuilt my old one at 45k. The shocking reliability and high VW parts prices made these a daft purchase back when mine was worth £8k. Now the cars are only worth a few grand they become an insane purchase imo.
i'd say they've become more a sensible price then, less to losek-ink said:
When it goes pear shaped it will certainly be cheaper to abandon it and just walk away.
That would be like any number of big-engined interesting cars much loved by petrolheads then, such as V12 BMWs, Mercs, Jags, etc, etc? What you fail to understand is that IF such cars go wrong, you can break them and walk away with a loss that's a tiny fraction of the running costs including depreciation of something as exciting and interesting as talc - like a 120D or Audi A4.The fact is that they don't go terminally wrong that often. I owned two W8s in the last year and put 15,000 miles on them. Neither 'went wrong'. What's more, by the time these cars get to 10 years old, unless they are worn out examples, buyers know what to look for and enthusiasts have sorted out any glitches that blighted the cars' reputations when they were newer. A good W8 example is the cam position sensor fault. It used to be claimed that this was a terminal problem whereas now it can usually be fixed in 10 minutes with no specialist knowledge whatsoever.
When these big engined old bruisers do go pop it's exactly the right policy to walk away. You sell them as spares or repair or you break them. The worst thing that could happen to my old Passat and the subject of this thread is that the engine could go pop. I can assure you that you'd sell it as a non-runner for at least £2K and break it for more. So what's the maximum risk exposure - £1500? That's incredibly good and mirrored by other cars such as 750 BMWs. But hey, you could always have an exciting and rare 120D and lose £10K in three years just by depreciation.
Edited by oscarwilde on Tuesday 20th August 19:06
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