997 S Gen 1 vs Gen 2
Discussion
Question to those of you who have owned both 997 S gen 1 and 2...
Is there a significant difference between the models in real life - i.e. that would justify spending £££ more to get a Gen 2 - or is the difference marginal?
In particular, I'm thinking about the driving pleasure, rather than a list of the technical changes. For example does the increase of bhp, the real-world consumption differences (seems to be 3mpg on paper) and whether the interior etc is better, make it a much nicer car to have?
Obviously, there's the engine issues with the Gen 1 to take into consideration too, but I guess the gen 2's are too young to know whether they will suffer the same problems down the line.
I'm thinking of upgrading from 996 pre-facelift to either model, but not sure whether it's worth an extra £10K or so to get MY09 gen 2, rather than a MY06 gen 1 , for example.
Any thoughts gratefully received...
Is there a significant difference between the models in real life - i.e. that would justify spending £££ more to get a Gen 2 - or is the difference marginal?
In particular, I'm thinking about the driving pleasure, rather than a list of the technical changes. For example does the increase of bhp, the real-world consumption differences (seems to be 3mpg on paper) and whether the interior etc is better, make it a much nicer car to have?
Obviously, there's the engine issues with the Gen 1 to take into consideration too, but I guess the gen 2's are too young to know whether they will suffer the same problems down the line.
I'm thinking of upgrading from 996 pre-facelift to either model, but not sure whether it's worth an extra £10K or so to get MY09 gen 2, rather than a MY06 gen 1 , for example.
Any thoughts gratefully received...
Edited by Diesel130 on Thursday 23 May 11:51
"Obviously, there's the engine issues with the Gen 1 to take into consideration too, but I guess the gen 2's are too young to know whether they will suffer the same problems down the line."
gen2 engines have been around 5 years now so any issues would have reared their ugly head.that said gen2 have no ims to fail the engine is a closed deck design so no ovaling of bores,the bore liner is changed so has the piston coating so bore scoring is much less likely to happen.cooling is also greatly improved and there are now 5 oil pumps (one sump plus 4 pickups on each head)instead of 1.they use the same engine in the turbo with 500+bhp
and i am yet to here of/read a confirmed failure on any forum
so i am with the gen 2 all the way.
gen2 engines have been around 5 years now so any issues would have reared their ugly head.that said gen2 have no ims to fail the engine is a closed deck design so no ovaling of bores,the bore liner is changed so has the piston coating so bore scoring is much less likely to happen.cooling is also greatly improved and there are now 5 oil pumps (one sump plus 4 pickups on each head)instead of 1.they use the same engine in the turbo with 500+bhp
and i am yet to here of/read a confirmed failure on any forum
so i am with the gen 2 all the way.
In my opinion it's down to what you can afford and how long you will keep the car.
OPC price with a 2 year warranty you're looking at £30-35k for a gen 1 C2S. For a gen 2 you're looking closer to £50k.
If you're in for the long hawl then buying from RSJ or 911 Virgin will keep piece of mind that you are buying a 'good one' then you can service outside the OPC network and keep some money aside if you do need an engine rebuild or expensive repairs incl. gear box (as all 930, 964 and 996 owners should do).
I went 2005 C2S from Guildford OPC in Sept 2011. I'm having a major service and another years warranty added on in July then will decide what to do.
Personally the interior difference is only the sat nav that you'll notice. The ride is better and you can actually use the sport setting without feeling that you've just solidified the suspension.
I think the gen 1 looks slightly better from the front, the gen 2 looks slightly better from the back and the gen 1 sounds better.
OPC price with a 2 year warranty you're looking at £30-35k for a gen 1 C2S. For a gen 2 you're looking closer to £50k.
If you're in for the long hawl then buying from RSJ or 911 Virgin will keep piece of mind that you are buying a 'good one' then you can service outside the OPC network and keep some money aside if you do need an engine rebuild or expensive repairs incl. gear box (as all 930, 964 and 996 owners should do).
I went 2005 C2S from Guildford OPC in Sept 2011. I'm having a major service and another years warranty added on in July then will decide what to do.
Personally the interior difference is only the sat nav that you'll notice. The ride is better and you can actually use the sport setting without feeling that you've just solidified the suspension.
I think the gen 1 looks slightly better from the front, the gen 2 looks slightly better from the back and the gen 1 sounds better.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
from what i can gather and only heard of is on the early 2.9 engines which porsche upgraded rings/pistons so i am yet to here of bore scoring on the 3.4,3.6,3.8 gen2 engines.i even spoke to a opc mechanic a few months and pretty said much the same,also early pdk had issues with some boxes being replaced but then it was new in 2008/9 and software etc was improved
I went from facelift 996 to Gen 2 997. There is no way of saying it's "worth the extra", as it can't really be. However, it's a vastly different car to sit in and to drive. I was daft enough to pay the price after that.
I wanted to try PDK, so that decided the Gen 2 bit. The DFI engine follows, so to speak.
Having only ever driven 996s and Gen 2 997s, I can't offer anything on what the Gen 1 driving experience is like.
I wanted to try PDK, so that decided the Gen 2 bit. The DFI engine follows, so to speak.
Having only ever driven 996s and Gen 2 997s, I can't offer anything on what the Gen 1 driving experience is like.
[report] [news] 15:01
cmoose said:
itsybitsy said:
wheres the evidence i have yet to see a single case!
I have never claimed it's anything other than a PHer saying his 997.2 is on its second engine due to bore scoring. It was in a post from the last few weeks or so. To many threads in my history, can't find it.
His post seemed pretty genuine to me.
so no proof then! i read every failure case on all the main forums and have never seen a single case on this one.you must be thinking of a 997.1
this is how unsubstantiated rumours start.
cmoose said:
itsybitsy said:
wheres the evidence i have yet to see a single case!
I have never claimed it's anything other than a PHer saying his 997.2 is on its second engine due to bore scoring. It was in a post from the last few weeks or so. To many threads in my history, can't find it.
His post seemed pretty genuine to me.
so no proof then! i read every failure case on all the main forums and have never seen a single case on this one.you must be thinking of a 997.1
this is how unsubstantiated rumours start.
The post was by magic919 (he posted above) and here it is -
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
I asked him to expand on it and he did.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
I asked him to expand on it and he did.
itsybitsy] [report] [news said:
15:01
cmoose said:
itsybitsy said:
wheres the evidence i have yet to see a single case!
I have never claimed it's anything other than a PHer saying his 997.2 is on its second engine due to bore scoring. It was in a post from the last few weeks or so. To many threads in my history, can't find it.
His post seemed pretty genuine to me.
so no proof then! i read every failure case on all the main forums and have never seen a single case on this one.you must be thinking of a 997.1
this is how unsubstantiated rumours start.
cmoose said:
itsybitsy said:
wheres the evidence i have yet to see a single case!
I have never claimed it's anything other than a PHer saying his 997.2 is on its second engine due to bore scoring. It was in a post from the last few weeks or so. To many threads in my history, can't find it.
His post seemed pretty genuine to me.
so no proof then! i read every failure case on all the main forums and have never seen a single case on this one.you must be thinking of a 997.1
this is how unsubstantiated rumours start.
I went from 996 C4S to 997 C4S gen 1 and yes apart from steering and PSE sound everything on the 997 is much better especially PASM, however not different enough. i sold it within 6 months where as the 996 I had for over 4 years!
Definately get gen 2 pdk
Definately get gen 2 pdk
Edited by Callughan on Thursday 23 May 23:11
itsybitsy] [report] [news said:
15:01
cmoose said:
itsybitsy said:
wheres the evidence i have yet to see a single case!
I have never claimed it's anything other than a PHer saying his 997.2 is on its second engine due to bore scoring. It was in a post from the last few weeks or so. To many threads in my history, can't find it.
His post seemed pretty genuine to me.
so no proof then! i read every failure case on all the main forums and have never seen a single case on this one.you must be thinking of a 997.1
this is how unsubstantiated rumours start.
cmoose said:
itsybitsy said:
wheres the evidence i have yet to see a single case!
I have never claimed it's anything other than a PHer saying his 997.2 is on its second engine due to bore scoring. It was in a post from the last few weeks or so. To many threads in my history, can't find it.
His post seemed pretty genuine to me.
so no proof then! i read every failure case on all the main forums and have never seen a single case on this one.you must be thinking of a 997.1
this is how unsubstantiated rumours start.
did not read this topic as it was not engine failure related.if magic919 had such a failure how comes it was never posted and what the actual reasons for failure were?so it was a 2008 c2s then.gen1 or gen 2 as both were built in this year?if it was a pdk apperently early cars suffered cooling due to not having the third radiator.and still not convinced that is borescoring due to the material coating on the piston and bore.if it is true about the pdk then most likely a heat seizure.
As one of the 'tiny few percent' of 997 gen 1 owners that is currently getting an engine rebuilt (at OPC expense fortunately), I'd stump up the extra and get a gen 2 if I was doing it again. The thought of keeping this car once the warantee's up doesn't appeal, much as I love it.
Edited by richardrsc on Thursday 23 May 17:37
itsybitsy said:
did not read this topic as it was not engine failure related.if magic919 had such a failure how comes it was never posted and what the actual reasons for failure were?so it was a 2008 c2s then.gen1 or gen 2 as both were built in this year?if it was a pdk apperently early cars suffered cooling due to not having the third radiator.and still not convinced that is borescoring due to the material coating on the piston and bore.if it is true about the pdk then most likely a heat seizure.
Did you buy the last keyboard in the shop?The one with no caps or spaces...
Why can't you get you're head round a few gen2 issues?
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