what's wrong with pdk? being as impressed by
Discussion
One thing about PDK is that the paddles and manual shifting are totally redundant as you can only change gear worse than the software.
It gives the drivers the illusion of being in control but that is not the case, really.
It's good that it exists, it's evolution after all, but it would be preferable to have the choice.
It gives the drivers the illusion of being in control but that is not the case, really.
It's good that it exists, it's evolution after all, but it would be preferable to have the choice.
I tried PDK for the first time last week in a 991. I was previously very disappointed that Porsche are not offering a manual 'box in the 991 GT3. After three days with the PDK car I'd spec it on the GT3 even if it was an option. It's not as fun as a manual, but it's just so much faster, and the downshifts are a hoot(although obviously a piece of cake).
stuckmojo said:
One thing about PDK is that the paddles and manual shifting are totally redundant as you can only change gear worse than the software.
It gives the drivers the illusion of being in control but that is not the case, really.
It's good that it exists, it's evolution after all, but it would be preferable to have the choice.
That's a good concise summary of my views about pdk.It gives the drivers the illusion of being in control but that is not the case, really.
It's good that it exists, it's evolution after all, but it would be preferable to have the choice.
Output Flange said:
Go on then, how is the driver not in control?
Sorry, I could have explained my opinion better: the driver is in control but can only do a worse job than the computer. Not a criticism of the system, which is exceptional, but again of the lack of choice for those who don't want such a system. These are not all luddites with beards who want to crank start the engine and so on, but car enthusiasts who feel that one of the things they value in the process of driving is no longer available for them.
stuckmojo said:
Output Flange said:
Go on then, how is the driver not in control?
Sorry, I could have explained my opinion better: the driver is in control but can only do a worse job than the computer. Not a criticism of the system, which is exceptional, but again of the lack of choice for those who don't want such a system. These are not all luddites with beards who want to crank start the engine and so on, but car enthusiasts who feel that one of the things they value in the process of driving is no longer available for them.
Gotcha. Yes, I do find it mildly entertaining that the computer is the best at the job.
I've got a manual 991 sitting outside, which is with me for the day. As nice a gearbox as it is, whoever thought that putting 7 gears onto an H pattern was a good idea needs shooting. And then the person who then decided that you can't change up into 7th without going into 5th or 6th first ought to be hanged by his own alimentary canal.
I've got a manual 991 sitting outside, which is with me for the day. As nice a gearbox as it is, whoever thought that putting 7 gears onto an H pattern was a good idea needs shooting. And then the person who then decided that you can't change up into 7th without going into 5th or 6th first ought to be hanged by his own alimentary canal.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Maybe, although in practice I don't find myself short-shifting so often (after all, if I didn't want to change gear, I'd have bought a PDK)."Extra" gear - first it's that there's no opportunity to move the stick around, now it's that you have to move it around too much ...
"The one thing that seems to have been missed is a congratulations to Porsche for entering the mobility market.
It's great that they are now catering for people with no left leg."
Take above comment with tongue and cheek. I have a 911 Carrera 4 GTS, which is PDK. Without PDK I would have trouble to drive it. To me it is the best thing since sliced bread.
Never really thought of it as Porsche now entering the mobility market.
Unfortunately I have not much use of my legs due to some wretch hurling large junks of metal whilst I was ambling across a green field one day.
Probably my own fault as I should have realised I was in a war zone and the other chappy seemed to have taken an unordinate dislike to what I was wearing possibly or maybe he was having a bad hair day.
Must enquire next time I am in local Porsche dealership if they perhaps may offer me the chance to purchase my next 991 on a mobility scheme. Must keep my remaining fingers crossed.
It's great that they are now catering for people with no left leg."
Take above comment with tongue and cheek. I have a 911 Carrera 4 GTS, which is PDK. Without PDK I would have trouble to drive it. To me it is the best thing since sliced bread.
Never really thought of it as Porsche now entering the mobility market.
Unfortunately I have not much use of my legs due to some wretch hurling large junks of metal whilst I was ambling across a green field one day.
Probably my own fault as I should have realised I was in a war zone and the other chappy seemed to have taken an unordinate dislike to what I was wearing possibly or maybe he was having a bad hair day.
Must enquire next time I am in local Porsche dealership if they perhaps may offer me the chance to purchase my next 991 on a mobility scheme. Must keep my remaining fingers crossed.
To those that assume left legs will become redundant and withered I have 3 words: LEFT FOOT BRAKING!
It is a technique that can occupy those deprived H&T{which I also find enjoyable}souls and also happens to be quicker and more adaptable on the limit. Surely a worthy replacement technique.
Also I hope there are no old ladies or cyclists near Tesco as a foot used to blip is not braking quite as well as it could.
It is a technique that can occupy those deprived H&T{which I also find enjoyable}souls and also happens to be quicker and more adaptable on the limit. Surely a worthy replacement technique.
Also I hope there are no old ladies or cyclists near Tesco as a foot used to blip is not braking quite as well as it could.
Left foot braking is fairly extreme for the road. I do use it a little to dial out some understeer, like when trailing, but its pretty much for the track really.
Oh, and you can do it just fine with a manual. You certainly wouldnt want to be changing gear when trail braking!
Oh, and you can do it just fine with a manual. You certainly wouldnt want to be changing gear when trail braking!
Edited by mollytherocker on Friday 24th May 18:34
Can anyone confirm that throttles go dead when braking? If so then another this is yet another electrismo interfering unasked and kills my intended use.
I seem to be lacking talent compared with some of you guys as I absolutely cannot left foot brake when I also have to use that foot for a clutch but you have clarified my previous feelings of inadequacy re the H&T. If you always do it at lower speeds I can now understand that you do not have to adapt for half depressed brake pedal or fully depressed. I can see the satisfaction but blipping to match a few hundred revs lower requires much less skill than a thousand or more so I prefer to test myself on track where I think it counts for more and I also regard it as totally irrelevant in the circumstances as it is essentially a travel time saving technique and therefore only has a point on track. It therefore brings to mind the double de clutching argument which I assume everyone has dropped [or not taken up]
I have even had a race instructor at Silverstone inform me that even on track it is now irrelevant with modern gearboxes as you should brake and then snick down however many you need using the synchro with no risk of squeal until the last change [think about it!] so pick up the revs for the last new gear if you have to.
He makes the point for racing that blipping lowers your braking pressure on the brake pedal and therefore reduces your braking intensity.
I know of people with Mclarens who prefer driving a classic Bentley with levers on the running board because it is more involving and skinny tyres lose traction for more interest. Some people like SCI FI and some like Egyptian scrolls. As you can see I am more interested in the techniques and reasons for them and am absolutely perplexed that so many people have so much time to argue aimlessly.
I seem to be lacking talent compared with some of you guys as I absolutely cannot left foot brake when I also have to use that foot for a clutch but you have clarified my previous feelings of inadequacy re the H&T. If you always do it at lower speeds I can now understand that you do not have to adapt for half depressed brake pedal or fully depressed. I can see the satisfaction but blipping to match a few hundred revs lower requires much less skill than a thousand or more so I prefer to test myself on track where I think it counts for more and I also regard it as totally irrelevant in the circumstances as it is essentially a travel time saving technique and therefore only has a point on track. It therefore brings to mind the double de clutching argument which I assume everyone has dropped [or not taken up]
I have even had a race instructor at Silverstone inform me that even on track it is now irrelevant with modern gearboxes as you should brake and then snick down however many you need using the synchro with no risk of squeal until the last change [think about it!] so pick up the revs for the last new gear if you have to.
He makes the point for racing that blipping lowers your braking pressure on the brake pedal and therefore reduces your braking intensity.
I know of people with Mclarens who prefer driving a classic Bentley with levers on the running board because it is more involving and skinny tyres lose traction for more interest. Some people like SCI FI and some like Egyptian scrolls. As you can see I am more interested in the techniques and reasons for them and am absolutely perplexed that so many people have so much time to argue aimlessly.
sidsideways said:
Can anyone confirm that throttles go dead when braking? If so then another this is yet another electrismo interfering unasked and kills my intended use.
I seem to be lacking talent compared with some of you guys as I absolutely cannot left foot brake when I also have to use that foot for a clutch but you have clarified my previous feelings of inadequacy re the H&T. If you always do it at lower speeds I can now understand that you do not have to adapt for half depressed brake pedal or fully depressed. I can see the satisfaction but blipping to match a few hundred revs lower requires much less skill than a thousand or more so I prefer to test myself on track where I think it counts for more and I also regard it as totally irrelevant in the circumstances as it is essentially a travel time saving technique and therefore only has a point on track. It therefore brings to mind the double de clutching argument which I assume everyone has dropped [or not taken up]
I have even had a race instructor at Silverstone inform me that even on track it is now irrelevant with modern gearboxes as you should brake and then snick down however many you need using the synchro with no risk of squeal until the last change [think about it!] so pick up the revs for the last new gear if you have to.
He makes the point for racing that blipping lowers your braking pressure on the brake pedal and therefore reduces your braking intensity.
I know of people with Mclarens who prefer driving a classic Bentley with levers on the running board because it is more involving and skinny tyres lose traction for more interest. Some people like SCI FI and some like Egyptian scrolls. As you can see I am more interested in the techniques and reasons for them and am absolutely perplexed that so many people have so much time to argue aimlessly.
It doesn't go dead. Certainly not when the sport button is pressed.I seem to be lacking talent compared with some of you guys as I absolutely cannot left foot brake when I also have to use that foot for a clutch but you have clarified my previous feelings of inadequacy re the H&T. If you always do it at lower speeds I can now understand that you do not have to adapt for half depressed brake pedal or fully depressed. I can see the satisfaction but blipping to match a few hundred revs lower requires much less skill than a thousand or more so I prefer to test myself on track where I think it counts for more and I also regard it as totally irrelevant in the circumstances as it is essentially a travel time saving technique and therefore only has a point on track. It therefore brings to mind the double de clutching argument which I assume everyone has dropped [or not taken up]
I have even had a race instructor at Silverstone inform me that even on track it is now irrelevant with modern gearboxes as you should brake and then snick down however many you need using the synchro with no risk of squeal until the last change [think about it!] so pick up the revs for the last new gear if you have to.
He makes the point for racing that blipping lowers your braking pressure on the brake pedal and therefore reduces your braking intensity.
I know of people with Mclarens who prefer driving a classic Bentley with levers on the running board because it is more involving and skinny tyres lose traction for more interest. Some people like SCI FI and some like Egyptian scrolls. As you can see I am more interested in the techniques and reasons for them and am absolutely perplexed that so many people have so much time to argue aimlessly.
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