Radical decision - SR3 or SR1 or SR4
Discussion
Sent from my phone so this is brief:
1. deal not quite done yet, sorry Bert
2. Black and gold car is my one, 1 yr old, Prosport class winner and overall championship runner up. Full spec. No idea on price, just trying to help Jamie move it on if he ends up owning it later this week
3. Early PR6s seem to weigh a bit less but most are shot through now
4. Engine refreshes circa 3-4 grand
5. How long past 40 hours depends on use. How long is a piece of string? Prenventation better than cure, but I would have thought acquiring a 1340 is pretty straightforward if a sealed one isn't essential
1. deal not quite done yet, sorry Bert
2. Black and gold car is my one, 1 yr old, Prosport class winner and overall championship runner up. Full spec. No idea on price, just trying to help Jamie move it on if he ends up owning it later this week
3. Early PR6s seem to weigh a bit less but most are shot through now
4. Engine refreshes circa 3-4 grand
5. How long past 40 hours depends on use. How long is a piece of string? Prenventation better than cure, but I would have thought acquiring a 1340 is pretty straightforward if a sealed one isn't essential
kartaphilos said:
So I was discounting the PR6 but that is looking like a good option now, good on circuits and reasonable on hills. The only issue was having two seats but that isn't a must have (given the performance differences). How much would a reasonable PR6 go for, any particular year or spec I should be looking for. Do they all have the 1340 engine?
What's this black & gold one like then :-)
What's the average cost of an engine refresh? And how far can it go past 40hrs? If I totally blow up an engine how much for a new one?
Well, there's this one already equipped for hillclimbs: http://www.racecarsdirect.com/listing/43651/radica... It only need a few bits to make it 100% perfect! What's this black & gold one like then :-)
What's the average cost of an engine refresh? And how far can it go past 40hrs? If I totally blow up an engine how much for a new one?
I used a similarly specced Prosport to set new class records at Curborough (29.8 & 53.5 secs), get up Loton in 52secs, Harewood in 56, Shelsley in 28 and burble round MIRA in 44secs. Not too shabby for a heap of recycled Peterborough gas pipe flying in loose formation.
I've found that a pure refresh with no significant parts needing to be replaced comes out around £2500 + the inescapable.......
Go past 40 hours? Not if you're hillclimbing where it's balls out all the way and engines get a hard life! I normally get a rebuild after 20 hours or so.
Blow up and replace your engine? If it's something like a 1585/1598/1615 then DON'T blow it up! Simple. Fit a Life ECU, get the cut-outs set at RPE and then look after it (warm it up properly, keep it supplied with good oil, use good fuel and a swirl pot to eliminate surge and try not to hit the rev limiter) like it cost a lot of money (which it did).
Cool. Thanks for the extra info and pointers to cars. Going to make a few phone calls today. I think I'll start with a standard 1340 until Ican trust muyself to look after it (sound advice LCM). The blue one in Scotland looks nice but I think I'll look closer to home
mabbott - I take the Jamie you are referring to is Jamie@Radical?
Jamie@Radical also has a PR6 coming in very soon ex-Simon Garmston.
mabbott - I take the Jamie you are referring to is Jamie@Radical?
Jamie@Radical also has a PR6 coming in very soon ex-Simon Garmston.
mabbott said:
2. Black and gold car is my one, 1 yr old, Prosport class winner and overall championship runner up. Full spec. No idea on price, just trying to help Jamie move it on if he ends up owning it later this week
Fair enough, but as you were my tip for (and it would have been well deservedly) taking the Championship in 2012 (always nice to see a proper Clubman winning a Clubmans Championship dontchaknow 
) wasn't that the car whose initial and fairly prolonged problems actually cost you it as it eventually transpired?Presumably Neil and yourself etc finally sorted it?
Yes Jamie R. Simon's old car is a good one, just doesn't have latest dampers or paddleshift, nor, I think, the big brakes, but then these are nice to haves not prerequisites for being competitive or indeed winning.
Trev, yes, we got it nicely sorted in the end, just niggly things but ones that resulted in DNFs. To be honest I was only up there due to the points system,Bradley and Matt were a class apart.
Trev, yes, we got it nicely sorted in the end, just niggly things but ones that resulted in DNFs. To be honest I was only up there due to the points system,Bradley and Matt were a class apart.
Thanks for all the advice. Deal done on a PR6 which I should pick up next week!
So now the learning curve begins... First thing is jacking it up to change wheels...so will need to acquire a quick lift jack. I assume they're all pretty similar?
Second is driving it, first event is Abingdon sprint but will hopefully get a tuning day in beforehand somewhere.
So now the learning curve begins... First thing is jacking it up to change wheels...so will need to acquire a quick lift jack. I assume they're all pretty similar?
Second is driving it, first event is Abingdon sprint but will hopefully get a tuning day in beforehand somewhere.
I'd recommend you turn up to Abingdon having never driven it before. I can't justify that comment in any way, but it lessens the chance of you trumping my times! I don't know who else is in class, but from those I've heard have entered and those I expect to enter, there should be a nice bunch to battle with. The 8 runs in a day will be a baptism of fire with refuelling for each run - I take it you need to get the body off to fill her up? Tap me on the shoulder when you need a hand.
kartaphilos said:
Thanks for all the advice. Deal done on a PR6 which I should pick up next week!
So now the learning curve begins... First thing is jacking it up to change wheels...so will need to acquire a quick lift jack. I assume they're all pretty similar?
Second is driving it, first event is Abingdon sprint but will hopefully get a tuning day in beforehand somewhere.
Good choice!So now the learning curve begins... First thing is jacking it up to change wheels...so will need to acquire a quick lift jack. I assume they're all pretty similar?
Second is driving it, first event is Abingdon sprint but will hopefully get a tuning day in beforehand somewhere.
You'll probably need a BIG torque wrench as well if it's got centre locks - they go on at 200 lb/ft and can need quite a lot more to get them off. If you need to buy one then the Norbar Industrial range is worth a look http://www.norbar.com/Industrials-TorqueWrenches-5... I've used them for years and have been very happy with them.
andylaurence said:
I'd recommend you turn up to Abingdon having never driven it before. I can't justify that comment in any way, but it lessens the chance of you trumping my times! I don't know who else is in class, but from those I've heard have entered and those I expect to enter, there should be a nice bunch to battle with. The 8 runs in a day will be a baptism of fire with refuelling for each run - I take it you need to get the body off to fill her up? Tap me on the shoulder when you need a hand.
Recommendation noted. Two points. First - On Abingdon regs I'm in a different class to you (>1100cc bike engine). Second, for my first time on slicks in a 'proper' race car I'd be really chuffed if I was on par with your times. Entries are here: http://www.abingdoncarnival.com/AbingdonCARnival/C...
I think I have an external filler for refuelling. But will be bound to be playing around with other stuff.
kartaphilos said:
Thanks for all the advice. Deal done on a PR6 which I should pick up next week!
So now the learning curve begins... First thing is jacking it up to change wheels...so will need to acquire a quick lift jack. I assume they're all pretty similar?
Second is driving it, first event is Abingdon sprint but will hopefully get a tuning day in beforehand somewhere.
The jacking points are 1 - under a chassis cross member at the front (make sure that your quicklift is long enough to reach the chassis and low enough to go under the FUT as you don't want to break the FUT by jacking on it) and 2 - a jacking post that sticks through the diffuser at the rear. It's worth taking a supply of wooden blocks (4" - 6" square) to span the gap between the jacking post and the quicklift platform and so keep the quicklift clear of the diffuser during lifting.So now the learning curve begins... First thing is jacking it up to change wheels...so will need to acquire a quick lift jack. I assume they're all pretty similar?
Second is driving it, first event is Abingdon sprint but will hopefully get a tuning day in beforehand somewhere.
I use this one: http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/jacks-cha... in the long version. Obviously, other suppliers are available!
Edited by LCM on Saturday 25th May 14:38
As above ..........
Here's some pics of our 'quicklift' - happens to be a 'Champion' and the missing bit on the rubber mat is not standard!
You'll see the 'helper' tape on it; the black (set right to leading edge of front splitter when slid underneath) is to suit a PR6, whereas the white is to suit an SR4, so quite different as you'll see, all to avoid lifting up via the FUT and damaging it in the process. Our Champion is the 1200mm/4ft long one, which I think is the biggest so I think you'll need that one for a PR6 i.e. the smaller ones simply won't be long enough.
Like Lindsay says watch the rear diffuser undertray; use blocks like he suggested or make sure it will fit by other means - we turned the bolts round on ours and it gave just enough clearance - hence including the end on view.
HTH
Here's some pics of our 'quicklift' - happens to be a 'Champion' and the missing bit on the rubber mat is not standard!
You'll see the 'helper' tape on it; the black (set right to leading edge of front splitter when slid underneath) is to suit a PR6, whereas the white is to suit an SR4, so quite different as you'll see, all to avoid lifting up via the FUT and damaging it in the process. Our Champion is the 1200mm/4ft long one, which I think is the biggest so I think you'll need that one for a PR6 i.e. the smaller ones simply won't be long enough.
Like Lindsay says watch the rear diffuser undertray; use blocks like he suggested or make sure it will fit by other means - we turned the bolts round on ours and it gave just enough clearance - hence including the end on view.
HTH
Edited by splitpin on Saturday 25th May 14:58
kartaphilos said:
Got some A15's mounted on spare rims at Gurston today....now I just need the car :-)
A15s - lubbly jubbly!If you're new to to this compound, remember that it goes off quickly and you really need a minimum of 2 sets for a day hillclimbing (1 set for practice and 1 for timed runs). Plus you need to clean them up between events (and get stones off the surface during an event for which a hard rubber curry brush is just the thing. Something like this: http://www.rideaway.co.uk/john-whitaker-bean-curry... although you can get cheaper if you can find monochrome ones - just make sure that they are the hard type).
There's a lot of discussion on Uphill Racers (http://www.uphillracers.com/forum.php) about the relative merits of Surforming and heat gun/scraper techniques for cleaning up tyres between events. I used to be a Surform Man but spinal injury (yes, it was racing) has perforce turned me into a Heat gun Harlot. Do I notice any difference? Not on the track but heat gun/scraping is a LOT less work - heat gunning a set of 4 then wrapping them in stretch wrap takes about 1 hour and 1 mug of tea.
With the tyres, I aill definitely be exploring reasonably gently on the first event. It's Abingdon sprint(s) so a airfield tarmac jobbie with little chance of hitting something. The courses are ~50secs long so should be in the lifetime of the tyres. I'm pretty sure Mr Wooster runs A15's on his SR4 there.
Yes, curry comb.....I knew the wife's horse would come in handy for something more than just a large future serving of Chorizo.
Any guesses on how much fuel I need to put in for a 60 sec run and minimum to stop surge?
Ta,
Matt
Yes, curry comb.....I knew the wife's horse would come in handy for something more than just a large future serving of Chorizo.
Any guesses on how much fuel I need to put in for a 60 sec run and minimum to stop surge?
Ta,
Matt
Thanks for the entry list - I'd not seen it. Looks like I've a tough class, even with the small capacity split. Best of luck against that 6R4. Aero doesn't look too useful at Abingdon, so that car will be potent with uber-power and 4WD. I don't bother looking after the tyres during the day - I'd rather have a bit of paddock banter. I don't always check the tyre pressures between runs. Besides, with four runs in the morning and four in the afternoon, it'll be manic! I just put in a couple of litres and find that the amount I put in reduces during the day as I have more left over from the previous run. I used about a gallon at Crystal Palace yesterday.
Most importantly, this isn't a road car, so preparation is important. Spanner check top to bottom and mark each bolt to save having to check it again during the event - a visual check is much quicker than a physical check. I neglected to check my wheel nuts at my first sprint and found the split pin was holding one on. It's not like production cars where you just get an MOT each year.
Most importantly, this isn't a road car, so preparation is important. Spanner check top to bottom and mark each bolt to save having to check it again during the event - a visual check is much quicker than a physical check. I neglected to check my wheel nuts at my first sprint and found the split pin was holding one on. It's not like production cars where you just get an MOT each year.
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