British and Irish Lions 2013
Discussion
Bit gutted for the loss, in the context of the series it means little but in the tour history it is, they need to get over the loss quickly as a camp and look to Saturday. If the bench had been used 5 mins earlier the Lions might have pipped it. Some gash kicking all game out of hand and toward the end they when they should have kept the ball and played for territory.
For me those who could have stuck up there hand for a test start now def won't. SOB and Tips namely. TF got through allot of work and could and I think should start on Saturday.
Ah well the sun is shinning so going to kick back in the garden for the rest o the day.....
For me those who could have stuck up there hand for a test start now def won't. SOB and Tips namely. TF got through allot of work and could and I think should start on Saturday.
Ah well the sun is shinning so going to kick back in the garden for the rest o the day.....
a311 said:
For me those who could have stuck up there hand for a test start now def won't. SOB and Tips namely. TF got through allot of work and could and I think should start on Saturday.
Kearney did a decent job too I thought.....the rest of them looked poor. Front row lightweight, second row rubbish in the line out and the back line looked like what it was....a last minute selection of whoever was available.Cheib said:
Kearney did a decent job too I thought.....the rest of them looked poor. Front row lightweight, second row rubbish in the line out and the back line looked like what it was....a last minute selection of whoever was available.
You can't be too harsh on Hogg, but Gatlands 2 10's theory shot to s
t again. A frontline international 10 would have been pretty sure of getting the 6 points Hogg left on the pitch.I agree with you about Kearney, if North isn't fit the wing is a bit of a dilemma. Switch 1/2p to wing and have Kearney at FB or vice versa? Other permutations Hogg in on the wing. Wade didn't get any space to work in today, Zebo looked sharp enough at the weekend.
I've not heard much about Manu's injury, I think JD can rightly feel the most aggrieved man on tour if he doesn't start on Saturday followed by Tips.
Apparently the weather forecast isn't great for Saturday, how much will this figure on Gatlands selection. A tight arm wrestle would be more suited to Lydiate and Faletau in the back row, and Hibbard and Corbs into the scrum. I'd hoped Gray would hit form but I think he's faded, and after Saturdays performance is a country mile behind AWJ and also Parling.
I think the Wallabies will play allot like the Brumbies did today on Saturday, aggressive around the breakdown and look to kick for territory-but to much better effect than the Brumbies.
Fellow armchair coaches, starting 15?
1. Vuniopla
Who would have thunk it at the start of the tour but for me through the injuries and his performances he's done enough to deserve his start.
2. Youngs
Tough call but given that Youngs wasn't on the bench I think this is the way Gatland looks like going. I still think with Mako at loose Hibbard would be smarter choice for the scrum.
3. A. Jones
No doubt. No one has challenged him on tour
4. AWJ
I thought there was a case to have POC or AWJ partnered by a more mobile partner in Gray or Parling but after Saturday performance no chance.
5. POC
Seems to have made it his and almost worth his place for leadership qualities alone IMO
6. Croft
I think he put in an all round performance on Saturday and should start.
7. Warburton(C)
Tipuric can feel a bit aggrieved but with Warbs being the choice for captain he showed enough on Saturday to warrant selection although I'd still have JT it's not going to happen.
8. Faletau
Heslip and Faletau have both been pretty average for me which is why I'd like to have seen SOB have a game at #8. Faletau had a pretty good game today and offers more balance. I'd rather start with Croft than drop him to accomadate Heaslip.
9. Phillips
I've always thought MP was a very good rugby player just not a great traditional 9. Youngs had a mare today but I don't think Phillips has looked close to his best either. On his day he'll make breaks, and space but if it all goes wrong and he finds himself at the bottom of one too many rucks Genia will exploit the space.
10. Sexton
Not allot to say really.
11. North
Not allot to say really unless he's injured.
12. Davies
One of the stand out performers of the tour so far. I still think Gatland would like a big unit in there.
13. BOD
Shown enough quality and composure. It will be a miracle if he gets through all 3 tests though.
14. Cuthbert
Not being on the bench today I expect him to start. There was a chance for Maitland to show an alternative but he hasn't.
15. 1/2p
Pure class. Will he get shifted out to the wing if North is fit?
I think we'll win the series, areas of concern for me have been uncharacteristic defensive frailties, lack of intensity at the breakdown, and the set piece (lineout). There's been talk of Gatland not wanting to show the Lions hand and the player have played to that-I do question how in the heat of a game players can hold back.
Can't wait till Saturday-come on you LIONS!!
In poor conditions with up your jumper 'roughing it' rugby are Croft and Heaslip really the guys you want in your back row. If the weather is poor on the weekend then there is no way the show ponys should start.
Lydiate really needs to play. He is the type of player you don't realise is as important as he is until he isn't there. Croft will not fight at the fringes and tackle down through the channels time after time. He will go wandering and you cant afford that against the Aussies due to their skill set. If it was hot and bone dry I still wouldn't pick croft at 6 over Lydiate but maybe at 8. Lydiate makes Warburton work. Warburton isn't anywhere near the same player without him.
Lydiate really needs to play. He is the type of player you don't realise is as important as he is until he isn't there. Croft will not fight at the fringes and tackle down through the channels time after time. He will go wandering and you cant afford that against the Aussies due to their skill set. If it was hot and bone dry I still wouldn't pick croft at 6 over Lydiate but maybe at 8. Lydiate makes Warburton work. Warburton isn't anywhere near the same player without him.
a311 said:
Fellow armchair coaches, starting 15?
1. Vuniopla
Who would have thunk it at the start of the tour but for me through the injuries and his performances he's done enough to deserve his start.
2. Youngs
Tough call but given that Youngs wasn't on the bench I think this is the way Gatland looks like going. I still think with Mako at loose Hibbard would be smarter choice for the scrum.
3. A. Jones
No doubt. No one has challenged him on tour
4. AWJ
I thought there was a case to have POC or AWJ partnered by a more mobile partner in Gray or Parling but after Saturday performance no chance.
5. POC
Seems to have made it his and almost worth his place for leadership qualities alone IMO
6. Croft
I think he put in an all round performance on Saturday and should start.
7. Warburton(C)
Tipuric can feel a bit aggrieved but with Warbs being the choice for captain he showed enough on Saturday to warrant selection although I'd still have JT it's not going to happen.
8. Faletau
Heslip and Faletau have both been pretty average for me which is why I'd like to have seen SOB have a game at #8. Faletau had a pretty good game today and offers more balance. I'd rather start with Croft than drop him to accomadate Heaslip.
9. Phillips
I've always thought MP was a very good rugby player just not a great traditional 9. Youngs had a mare today but I don't think Phillips has looked close to his best either. On his day he'll make breaks, and space but if it all goes wrong and he finds himself at the bottom of one too many rucks Genia will exploit the space.
10. Sexton
Not allot to say really.
11. North
Not allot to say really unless he's injured.
12. Davies
One of the stand out performers of the tour so far. I still think Gatland would like a big unit in there.
13. BOD
Shown enough quality and composure. It will be a miracle if he gets through all 3 tests though.
14. Cuthbert
Not being on the bench today I expect him to start. There was a chance for Maitland to show an alternative but he hasn't.
15. 1/2p
Pure class. Will he get shifted out to the wing if North is fit?
I think we'll win the series, areas of concern for me have been uncharacteristic defensive frailties, lack of intensity at the breakdown, and the set piece (lineout). There's been talk of Gatland not wanting to show the Lions hand and the player have played to that-I do question how in the heat of a game players can hold back.
Can't wait till Saturday-come on you LIONS!!
Yeah. Looks about right. 1. Vuniopla
Who would have thunk it at the start of the tour but for me through the injuries and his performances he's done enough to deserve his start.
2. Youngs
Tough call but given that Youngs wasn't on the bench I think this is the way Gatland looks like going. I still think with Mako at loose Hibbard would be smarter choice for the scrum.
3. A. Jones
No doubt. No one has challenged him on tour
4. AWJ
I thought there was a case to have POC or AWJ partnered by a more mobile partner in Gray or Parling but after Saturday performance no chance.
5. POC
Seems to have made it his and almost worth his place for leadership qualities alone IMO
6. Croft
I think he put in an all round performance on Saturday and should start.
7. Warburton(C)
Tipuric can feel a bit aggrieved but with Warbs being the choice for captain he showed enough on Saturday to warrant selection although I'd still have JT it's not going to happen.
8. Faletau
Heslip and Faletau have both been pretty average for me which is why I'd like to have seen SOB have a game at #8. Faletau had a pretty good game today and offers more balance. I'd rather start with Croft than drop him to accomadate Heaslip.
9. Phillips
I've always thought MP was a very good rugby player just not a great traditional 9. Youngs had a mare today but I don't think Phillips has looked close to his best either. On his day he'll make breaks, and space but if it all goes wrong and he finds himself at the bottom of one too many rucks Genia will exploit the space.
10. Sexton
Not allot to say really.
11. North
Not allot to say really unless he's injured.
12. Davies
One of the stand out performers of the tour so far. I still think Gatland would like a big unit in there.
13. BOD
Shown enough quality and composure. It will be a miracle if he gets through all 3 tests though.
14. Cuthbert
Not being on the bench today I expect him to start. There was a chance for Maitland to show an alternative but he hasn't.
15. 1/2p
Pure class. Will he get shifted out to the wing if North is fit?
I think we'll win the series, areas of concern for me have been uncharacteristic defensive frailties, lack of intensity at the breakdown, and the set piece (lineout). There's been talk of Gatland not wanting to show the Lions hand and the player have played to that-I do question how in the heat of a game players can hold back.
Can't wait till Saturday-come on you LIONS!!
On 30 April on page 3 of this thread Greg66 said:
Starting XV predictions?
Halfpenny
North
Davies
O'Driscoll
Bowe
Sexton
Philips
Falatau
Warburton
Croft
A-W Jones
O'Connell
A Jones
Youngs
Healy
Had Bowe not been injured, he'd have got the nod over Cuthbert though...Halfpenny
North
Davies
O'Driscoll
Bowe
Sexton
Philips
Falatau
Warburton
Croft
A-W Jones
O'Connell
A Jones
Youngs
Healy
Vuni is the surprise package, for sure.
oj121 said:
In poor conditions with up your jumper 'roughing it' rugby are Croft and Heaslip really the guys you want in your back row. If the weather is poor on the weekend then there is no way the show ponys should start.
Lydiate really needs to play. He is the type of player you don't realise is as important as he is until he isn't there. Croft will not fight at the fringes and tackle down through the channels time after time. He will go wandering and you cant afford that against the Aussies due to their skill set. If it was hot and bone dry I still wouldn't pick croft at 6 over Lydiate but maybe at 8. Lydiate makes Warburton work. Warburton isn't anywhere near the same player without him.
I think Lydiate is a fine player, and as I said in my previous post, in an arm wrestle a Lydiate type may be the smarter move. Tbh I think Lydiate still hasn't looked back to his best and IMO Croft is the more complete 6. I think this show pony hang about on the wing stuff is mostly founded on myth. On Saturday when playing with Heaslip he played allot tighter, and got through allot of work defensively. If we were up against the big bruising pack of the last tour Lydiate would have been ideal. I think Croft would be a potential disaster at 8 tbh, Gatland seems to like a specialist 8 or I think he would have tried SOB at #8 by now.Lydiate really needs to play. He is the type of player you don't realise is as important as he is until he isn't there. Croft will not fight at the fringes and tackle down through the channels time after time. He will go wandering and you cant afford that against the Aussies due to their skill set. If it was hot and bone dry I still wouldn't pick croft at 6 over Lydiate but maybe at 8. Lydiate makes Warburton work. Warburton isn't anywhere near the same player without him.
Greg66 said:
Had Bowe not been injured, he'd have got the nod over Cuthbert though...
Vuni is the surprise package, for sure.
Looks like baring injury you got the potential starting 15 nearly spot on.Vuni is the surprise package, for sure.
Totally agree about the Croft "show pony" myth. People that think he is really need to look at the Tahs game again, especially at the lineout. When the Lions had the throw in their own half Croft at 2 was the banker ball, he was also used at the tail for quick attacking ball. He's also a massive presence jumping at 2 on opposition ball, he won a vital lineout on the Lions 5 m line on Tahs ball.
I have a sneaking suspicion we're going to see Tuilagi at 12, especially if North isn't fit. I think Gatland will tthink a back line minus Roberts and North looks a bit lightweight. The weather might also come into that thinking.
I have a sneaking suspicion we're going to see Tuilagi at 12, especially if North isn't fit. I think Gatland will tthink a back line minus Roberts and North looks a bit lightweight. The weather might also come into that thinking.
drakart said:
phil_cardiff said:
oj121 said:
What about JD on the wing? He has played there in the past.........Its a bit harsh to leave him out!
No. Not enough pace and that's one thing the Wallabies have in abundance. People said:
Tuilagi or Davies on the wing
There was talk of England maybe trying Tuilagi on the wing, I've not seen him play on the wing for the Tigers in recent years but when he was younger he played for the Tigers in plenty of 7's comps. I think he lacks the skill set to be a world class winger could get away with at a push depending who's playing around him.I've not heard anything about his status injury wise, but if he were to play on Saturday he won't have played for a fortnight.
It will be very harsh not to have Davies in the test 15, my worry for him is in combination with BOD it's not what Gatland likes in a centre partnership. I'd be amazed if BOD will makes it through all 3 tests to be fair.
In other news looks like Eng Vs Wales for the JWC title.
According to the SMH this is the Aussie side
Wallabies XV: Benn Robinson, Stephen Moore, Ben Alexander, James Horwill (c), Kane Douglas, Ben Mowen, Michael Hooper, Wycliff Palu,Will Genia, James O'Connor, Digby Ioane, Christian Lealiifano, Adam Ashley-Cooper, Israel Folau, Berrick Barnes. Reserves: Saia Faingaa, James Slipper, Sekope Kepu, Rob Simmons, Liam Gill, Nick Phipps, Kurtley Beale, Pat McCabe.
Wallabies XV: Benn Robinson, Stephen Moore, Ben Alexander, James Horwill (c), Kane Douglas, Ben Mowen, Michael Hooper, Wycliff Palu,Will Genia, James O'Connor, Digby Ioane, Christian Lealiifano, Adam Ashley-Cooper, Israel Folau, Berrick Barnes. Reserves: Saia Faingaa, James Slipper, Sekope Kepu, Rob Simmons, Liam Gill, Nick Phipps, Kurtley Beale, Pat McCabe.
Must admit the idea that anybody who plies their trade with The Tigers is just a show pony makes me laugh 
The most infamously gritty hard nosed team in the game? Even the Lip had to get down and dirty...mostly because he got planted more by his own teammates in training than opposition in matches
Croft is the complete modern 6 and has an extra attacking dimension that nobody else has. Lydiate offers a more defensive, scrapping game, both give you flexibility options in the 80mins. The Lions will need both at some point!
The most infamously gritty hard nosed team in the game? Even the Lip had to get down and dirty...mostly because he got planted more by his own teammates in training than opposition in matches Croft is the complete modern 6 and has an extra attacking dimension that nobody else has. Lydiate offers a more defensive, scrapping game, both give you flexibility options in the 80mins. The Lions will need both at some point!
Gassing Station | Sports | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff