Uninsured Car Question - Legality

[matt21]

Dull question I know but hey, here goes...

Bought a new car last week off a friend, drove it home on third party through my insurance, as they still had it insured. They have now uninsured, yet I cannot insure until I shift the old one, currently on ebay.

Where do I stand legally...can I do this? Car is off the road, but uninsured and taxed. This scenario must happen often, is there a grace period which will allow me to do what I am doing.

Thanks, and trying to keep legal!

Matt

[zaphod42]

No grace period you are uninsured.

Have you tried talking to your insurer? Many will offer a cover note on both cars for a week or so on overlap of ownership. Better than being uninsured... Otherwise try the day insure places who offer week or multiple week policies.

[GKP]

Most policies which allow you to drive other cars third party normally has the exemption of any cars owned by you. So it sounds like you've already driven it uninsured.

[B'stard Child]

I don't think there is answer yet - no-one I am aware of has had to test it (unless the PH masses know better)

New Law Contiuous Insurance (Only exemption is if Vehicle is SORN)

I'm in same boat - Tranfered main insurance policy over to new car.

I needed to own both cars at the same time in order to transfer the "vanity" plate from old car to new one without resorting to retention charges (pay for a year use just 2 weeks rip off)

Old car still taxed (now with original numberplate and VED correct to original number) but no longer insured

I appreciate I could surrender the tax and SORN it but then I'd have no tax on it which would make selling it a pain as I can add it on temporary cover for a day to a week if I needed to demonstrate the car but I didn't want to insure both cars untill I am ready to sell.

Have to see how quickly the "system" picks up on it

[marshalla]

matt21 said:

Bought a new car last week off a friend, drove it home on third party through my insurance, as they still had it insured.

No you didn't. You were the owner and didn't have a valid policy in place. Driving other cars excludes cars that you own.

[TPS]

matt21 said:

Dull question I know but hey, here goes...

Bought a new car last week off a friend, drove it home on third party through my insurance, as they still had it insured. They have now uninsured, yet I cannot insure until I shift the old one, currently on ebay.

Where do I stand legally...can I do this? Car is off the road, but uninsured and taxed. This scenario must happen often, is there a grace period which will allow me to do what I am doing.

Thanks, and trying to keep legal!

Matt

If the car you drove was brought for you to own then as said your own insurance probably did not cover you to drive.
Most policys state your covered to drive a car not owned by you.

[B'stard Child]

zaphod42 said:

No grace period you are uninsured.

Have you tried talking to your insurer? Many will offer a cover note on both cars for a week or so on overlap of ownership. Better than being uninsured... Otherwise try the day insure places who offer week or multiple week policies.

Small point (and ignoring the slightly iffy driving the car home on third party bit) OP said he's not using the car and it's parked off the road

The only law he's breaking under those circumstances is the new one introduced to require continuous insurance. (exemption being vehicles covered by SORN)

[Viperz888]

Agree completely with B'stard Child, I have 2 cars right now, as I needed to buy the new one before selling the old one due to work and my insurer wants a crazy amount for a week of having them both insured as I am a young driver. Hopefully it will go in the next few days.

But if I were to get a refund on the tax, surely that takes a few days (for post and for DVLA to lose the disc etc) so there must be some kind of grace period.

Very silly rule imo.

[zaphod42]

B'stard Child said:

Small point (and ignoring the slightly iffy driving the car home on third party bit) OP said he's not using the car and it's parked off the road

The only law he's breaking under those circumstances is the new one introduced to require continuous insurance. (exemption being vehicles covered by SORN)

I would agree - but I wasn't ignoring the driving home bit - OP was lucky as no ANPR would have triggered as the db would show insured, but a muddle if he'd been pulled for a routine stop.

[matt21]

Viperz888 said:

Agree completely with B'stard Child, I have 2 cars right now, as I needed to buy the new one before selling the old one due to work and my insurer wants a crazy amount for a week of having them both insured as I am a young driver. Hopefully it will go in the next few days.

But if I were to get a refund on the tax, surely that takes a few days (for post and for DVLA to lose the disc etc) so there must be some kind of grace period.

Very silly rule imo.

exactly, this is my point.

ref. the driving home. fair point. but to be fair, I was not the legal owner at this point. As it was through a friend no money was exchanged and as such the V5 was only completed 4 days later.

But going forward will bare this in mind!

[B'stard Child]

Viperz888 said:

Agree completely with B'stard Child, I have 2 cars right now, as I needed to buy the new one before selling the old one due to work and my insurer wants a crazy amount for a week of having them both insured as I am a young driver. Hopefully it will go in the next few days.

I agree it's daft but like I said it's early days and it's not been tested

Slightly OT in a way

I had a conversation with a guy at work last week who mentioned that he'd had to re-insure his old Volvo estate (he seems to like them) because his insurance company told him when the policy expired that it was now an offence to not have insurance on a car that you own even if it's stored off the highway.

I said but this is your old Volvo estate - the one that you haven't used for ages and I thought you were using for spares - surely it's not still taxed

He replied - No I sorned it when I surrendered whats left of the tax

He was quite chuffed I'd saved him £300 - I wouldn't want to be the person at his broker who clearly advised him to buy insurance that he didn't need.......

Viperz888 said:

But if I were to get a refund on the tax, surely that takes a few days (for post and for DVLA to lose the disc etc) so there must be some kind of grace period.

I guess soon enough we'll have a thread asking how to react to the first penalty notice issued under the new Law

Viperz888 said:

Very silly rule imo.

It's very well thought out and I'm sure it will stop people driving on the road without insurance, tax, MOT etc - The people out there that drive without documents won't take any notice

[B'stard Child]

It's also quite funny to me that I also have another car that is currently insured but on SORN (unfortunately the policy is a classic one so that cover cannot be transfered)

So in summary

I have

2 cars with separate insurance policies that are both taxed and MOT'd and are in daily use.

1 car that is taxed and MOT'd parked on private property (not insured) awaiting being sold (this one does not comply with the new law - but would have been perfectly acceptable before it's introduction)

1 car which is SORN out of MOT but is actually insured (also parked on private property) (this complies purely as a result of the SORN - but it's not an offence to have a car on SORN but insured )

[Viperz888]

B'stard Child said:

Viperz888 said:

Very silly rule imo.

It's very well thought out and I'm sure it will stop people driving on the road without insurance, tax, MOT etc - The people out there that drive without documents won't take any notice

Its is not thought out at all.
No Insurance - comes up on ANPR, get pulled.
No Tax - comes up on ANPR, get pulled.
No MOT - comes up on ANPR, get pulled.

Its not going to stop the idiots that drive around with no insurance, tax or mot, which is what it is for (as far as I can see)

[snowdude2910]

I'm in the same situation I don't want to cash the tax in on either of my 2 cars that are up for sale but can only insure one when do i have to make a decision by on which one I'm cashing in??

[davepoth]

snowdude2910 said:

I'm in the same situation I don't want to cash the tax in on either of my 2 cars that are up for sale but can only insure one when do i have to make a decision by on which one I'm cashing in??

As soon as you take the insurance off a car it must be SORNed.

[snowdude2910]

when does the law kick in??

[B'stard Child]

snowdude2910 said:

I'm in the same situation I don't want to cash the tax in on either of my 2 cars that are up for sale but can only insure one when do i have to make a decision by on which one I'm cashing in??

No grace.... Law is clear - you commit the offence in the first day that one of the vehicles is uninsured and NOT SORN with the VED surrendered (which makes it a pain to sell a car)

New law is untested to the best of my knowledge

I'm sure we will find out soon enough

Somewhere DVLA have a bloody great computer that is matching two databases

Insurance Database and VED Database (Inc SORN)

No VED - Yes - Check SORN - NO SORN - issue Penalty

No VED - Yes - Check SORN - SORN Noted - Move on to next target record

No Insurance - Yes - Check SORN - NO SORN - issue Penalty

No Insurance - Yes - Check SORN - SORN - Move on to next target Potential Victim

^ no idea if this is true

[B'stard Child]

snowdude2910 said:

when does the law kick in??

Already in - for some time

[B'stard Child]

davepoth said:

snowdude2910 said:

I'm in the same situation I don't want to cash the tax in on either of my 2 cars that are up for sale but can only insure one when do i have to make a decision by on which one I'm cashing in??

As soon as you take the insurance off a car it must be SORNed.

And to SORN you must surrender the VED

As a result you end up with a car that is not just uninsured but also not taxed - let me state at this point the car is Parked off the road and not on a highway and it is not being used at all.

So if you are tyring to sell a car life gets tough.

To demonstrate the car to a potential buyer you need to obtain insurance cover and then apply for VED

Insurance I can sort out over the phone when needed to start immediately for a small premium for a days cover.

However in order to get VED I have to go to the Post office to get it (if a car has been SORN you can't apply on line for VED) and to do that they need a copy of the insurance so the insurance period needs to be long enough to allow for posting of the cover note

I'm sure as stated previously all this will stop people driving without VED, insurance or MOT.

Note I'm sure those same people always make sure DVLA have keepers details up to date they can easily be sent penalty notices thro the post

[B'stard Child]

Hmmm intersting Maybe we have grace untill end of June

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/OwningAVehicl...

What will happen if your vehicle doesn't have insurance

From the end of June 2011 Insurance Advisory Letters (IAL) will be issued by the Motor Insurers' Bureau to the registered keepers of uninsured vehicles. This will be following a check of the Motor Insurance Database (MID) - the UK's central record of vehicle insurance. The IAL will advise the registered keeper that their vehicle appears to have no insurance and what actions to take to avoid receiving a fixed penalty from DVLA.

If a vehicle does not have insurance, the registered keeper could:

receive a fixed penalty of £100
have their vehicle wheel-clamped, impounded, or destroyed
face a court prosecution, with a possible maximum fine of £1000

Payment of a penalty does not replace the need for motor insurance.

was this new law sponsored by the Insurance companies..........