Times: The parking meter you can't beat
Discussion
Interesting article here: [url]www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-1981039_1,00.html[/url]. Note the highlighted phrase and see where things are headed.
Times said:
The parking meter you can't beat
By Will Pavia
Photo Violation Meter snaps you arriving and automatically fines you the second you stay too long
ELECTRONIC wardens with lidless eyes, ruthless time keeping and an immunity to even the most charming excuses could soon be monitoring parking on the streets of London.
The meters start ticking the moment you park, automatically hand out fines and photograph your numberplate to ensure that there can be no excuses. The Canadian-designed Photo Violation Meter accepts payment in coins, cards and even by mobile phone.
It issues fines the second that a car overstays its allotted time. It will accept penalty payments on the spot. Motorists may be advised to cough up straight away — paying later could cost more.
The meters can even call hapless motorists on the phone and warn them to return to their cars.
It knows the precise moment that you depart, instantly resetting to zero — putting an end to the convivial practice of drivers using the time left over when another motorist leaves early.
Attempts at escape are futile. There will be no hiding place for motorists who attempt to cheat the machine — only drivers of illegally registered vehicles or cloned cars will be immune.
An invasion of the metallic attendants is expected shortly. Photo Violation Technologies, of Vancouver, has spent years producing the automatons and is setting up an office in London to market the meters across Europe.
The office’s staff are expected to be human.
Each machine is expected to cost £3,000, and, according to Fred Mitschele, chief executive of Photo Violation Technologies, the price tag is worth it. He predicts that the meters, which monitor two bays each, will collect five times as much as ordinary machines.
“We’ve talked to NCP and we’re going to start talking with Westminster Council,” Mr Mitschele said.
A spokesman for Westminster Council, which issues more parking tickets than any other council in the country and makes an annual surplus of about £35 million on parking, said that its parking department was interested in the machines.
He added: “Westminster tries to stay ahead of the game so far as parking is concerned. We are interested, although we are not about to roll them out within days.
“There is still an important role for the (human) parking attendant. I don’t think we will see them completely replaced. They are important as a street patrol, to give advice and to hand out tickets. It’s still an important job for a human being to do.”
Barrie Segal, the founder of AppealNow.com, a parking ticket advice website, said he thought that some town halls would be reluctant to employ the new meters.
“This will make life easier for motorists who will know exactly where they stand but it could reduce fines income to virtually nothing as motorists would no longer be so open to making mistakes.”
Mr Mitschele said that the meters could be adapted to take congestion charge payments and top-ups from Oyster travel cards.
He also believes that human traffic wardens will be switched to monitoring vehicles from an office once his machines hold sway on the streets.
Times said:
Attempts at escape are futile. There will be no hiding place for motorists who attempt to cheat the machine — only drivers of illegally registered vehicles or cloned cars will be immune.
Indeed. Its not like car identity fraud is already on the increase in London due to Kengestion charging, bus lane cameras and speed cams etc...
er out the ground. I think this raises the question, how many times/day will a car be ANPRed? If the risk of cloning a plate is that you will be stopped once that plate is ANPRed, then the solution is to keep changing the plate. Therefore, as long as you have a ready supply of plates you could, for example, put a new one on each day. But perhaps there will be so much ANPRing going on that you might have to change them twice a day... or relatively little so that once per week is enough. Even if it's 4 times per day it's still a trivial way of becoming invisible. No wonder self-incrimination is so vital to today's rule of motoring law.
Why do they have to fine you if you overstay?
If the machines can record the excact time that you arrive, why not programme them so that you have to pay for the parking just before you leave, so that you pay for the actual time that you have used the parking bay for.
Obviously if you drive away without paying at all or overstay the maximum time allowed (2 to 4 hours depending on area) then a fine, in the usual manner, would not be unreasonable.
This would be a much fairer system and would only fine those who purposefully don't pay or overstay and would not fine those who, at the present time, get a penalty if they are 5 minutes late getting back to their car after 2 hours of shopping, etc.
However, as this would decrease revenue for the councils I doubt that this fairer system would ever be introduced.
If the machines can record the excact time that you arrive, why not programme them so that you have to pay for the parking just before you leave, so that you pay for the actual time that you have used the parking bay for.
Obviously if you drive away without paying at all or overstay the maximum time allowed (2 to 4 hours depending on area) then a fine, in the usual manner, would not be unreasonable.
This would be a much fairer system and would only fine those who purposefully don't pay or overstay and would not fine those who, at the present time, get a penalty if they are 5 minutes late getting back to their car after 2 hours of shopping, etc.
However, as this would decrease revenue for the councils I doubt that this fairer system would ever be introduced.
Swilly said:
What would happen if some lout or yobbo sprayed the camera lens to prevent pictures being taken?
Exactly, the systems inherent weakness against REAL criminals and trouble makers proves that it is already used to target those who would not retribute against it, ie, everyday people.
Yet more ANPR camera's... Living in London you must be watched alot of the time these days. I worry! Guilty of everything until you don't do what they think you could be upto!
Dave
mandat said:Exactly what I though when I read the article this morning.
If the machines can record the excact time that you arrive, why not programme them so that you have to pay for the parking just before you leave, so that you pay for the actual time that you have used the parking bay for.
catso said:
Just one more invention designed to shaft the motorist, what will be next? will it never end? 
and with all these electronic devices, how long before they become self aware? (judgement day)
I'm just imagining the human race being wiped out by an army of self aware robotic parking attendants. It could be quite a fitting end actually
...but is it possible to be both self aware and a parking attendant? Perhaps that just results in a loud metaphysical popping sound?
>> Edited by 711 on Thursday 12th January 17:24
leosayer said:
If the machines can record the excact time that you arrive, why not programme them so that you have to pay for the parking just before you leave, so that you pay for the actual time that you have used the parking bay for.
Agree. How much extra money do these parking thieves make out of us by overpayments already? I always over by a pound or so at pay and display lots, rather than risk a £30 fine for being a minute too late.
It would be a really fair system if the thing recorded your time and you simply paid for what you used-like a multistorey. But I guess asking for fairness in parking systems is going a bit too far....
In South Africa they have a really cool system in most places-a person monitors what time you park and then comes to you when you leaving to collect payment for the time you stayed. All the details get recorded in a handheld device and you can check for yourslef that they register your payment. Talk about service-none of this going to get a sticker and walk back to you car nonsense!!
>> Edited by dinod on Thursday 12th January 17:35
[quote]In South Africa they have a really cool system in most places-a person monitors what time you park and then comes to you when you leaving to collect payment for the time you stayed. All the details get recorded in a handheld device and you can check for yourslef that they register your payment. Talk about service-none of this going to get a sticker and walk back to you car nonsense!!
[/quote]
Same in South Korea most places. Keeps the old timers employed too.
[/quote]
Same in South Korea most places. Keeps the old timers employed too.
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff